[soulquest81]

When I gave my son up for adoption in Washington State I was in the military at the time and I signed the adoption papers several weeks BEFORE the birth. I didn't sign anything afterwards and I was so exhausted that I just went along with everything, denying that I had actually had a baby and desiring to just get on with my life. Then after it was all said and done I had a lot of second thoughts and I believe that if I had been asked to sign anything after the birth or go to court or talk with a lawyer then I would have never gone through with it. What's done is done and I know I can't go back, I'm just wondering how many other birthmothers signed the papers while they were still pregnant and had so much less emotional attachment and then later had second thoughts. I'm also wondering if this was even legal as the child wasn't even a born person. Thanks for the insight.

-Soulquest81

[SuddenlySusan]

Dear Soulquest 81,
I can empathize...I know I signed papers before giving birth, but honestly was so traumatized that I do not know if I signed anything afterwards. I surrendered my son at Madigan Hospital, in the Ft. Lewis/McChord AFB complex, as my father was retired USAF, and went through the LDS Social Services.

Last month, on Jan 23, I found a profile my birthson had posted on this website in 2005. I had posted a profile in 2000, but for some reason we didn't connect. We were able to make a connection this time, however. As we are getting to know each other, he stated that he thought that the records had been sealed by my request. I have to say that I do not remember doing that, but again, it was so traumatic that I believe I buried a lot of memories and emotions, which are now just coming to the surface. Are you searching for the child you surrendered?

In Washington State, you, as the birth mother, have a right to a copy of the original birth certificate. I just traveled to Olympia yesterday and ordered mine. It should be in my possession within a week, if there are no glitches. I didn't even know I could do that until I starting posting on this website, and another very kind poster let me know about that. What adoption agency did you go through? I am thinking of contacting LDS Social Services to request information. It's not necessary in order to find my son, because we have already reunited (although not face to face yet). But, I want to know what happened because like yourself, the trauma was so great that I am having difficulty putting all the pieces together. It's almost like a form of PTSD, I think.

I have heard other stories of a similar nature. You are not alone.

Best wishes,
Susan

[mn125]

(((((((soulquest and 03-06))))))))

my eyeballs are twitching with stress and anger from reading your posts about the tricks of the trade......sigh.

03-06 I got your PM about finding your son. Congrats!! I am so very happy neither you or your son had to endure WA's solution to adoption reunion (confidential intermediary)

I'm going to "grab" a Seattle mom that posts on the boards here...and give her a link to the posts. I know she has been involved with WA search/support/reforms. Lets see if she can help direct you on how to get those documents. I'd like to know myself- so I can pass that info to my mother. I'm sure looking over those papers would give us hours and hours of new conversations about what and how it all happened.

[Scarlet Moon 13]

Originally Posted by 03-06-1971

Dear Soulquest 81,
I can empathize...I know I signed papers before giving birth, but honestly was so traumatized that I do not know if I signed anything afterwards. I surrendered my son at Madigan Hospital, in the Ft. Lewis/McChord AFB complex, as my father was retired USAF, and went through the LDS Social Services.

Last month, on Jan 23, I found a profile my birthson had posted on this website in 2005. I had posted a profile in 2000, but for some reason we didn't connect. We were able to make a connection this time, however. As we are getting to know each other, he stated that he thought that the records had been sealed by my request. I have to say that I do not remember doing that, but again, it was so traumatic that I believe I buried a lot of memories and emotions, which are now just coming to the surface. Are you searching for the child you surrendered?

In Washington State, you, as the birth mother, have a right to a copy of the original birth certificate. I just traveled to Olympia yesterday and ordered mine. It should be in my possession within a week, if there are no glitches. I didn't even know I could do that until I starting posting on this website, and another very kind poster let me know about that. What adoption agency did you go through? I am thinking of contacting LDS Social Services to request information. It's not necessary in order to find my son, because we have already reunited (although not face to face yet). But, I want to know what happened because like yourself, the trauma was so great that I am having difficulty putting all the pieces together. It's almost like a form of PTSD, I think.

I have heard other stories of a similar nature. You are not alone.

Best wishes,
Susan

I started searching in Feb 1997, I found my son in Oct. 1997.
I too sent for my son's orginal birthcertificate.

In WA you also have a right to any and all medical information from both the doctor and hospitals.

I was lucky, though the OBGYN had retired, the doc who took over the practice still had ALL the old doc's files. The old doc was also an adoption facilitator. He hooked up pregnant girls with a lawyer and found adoptive parents.

All my records were copied, unedited and given to me. These records are from 1967, this was done 10 years ago. The hospital, Ballard General, now Swedish, also still had my records and it cost about 80 bucks to get them. I had all 3 of me kids there, birthson and raised kids, the company charged by the page.

In WA once you are reunited you can petition directly to the judge in charge of adoptions, by letter signed by both bparents and adoptee, to have your records opened and copies. I "think", not positive that you can do it without the adoptee signing. If you are not reunited you need an intermediary CI to get them open or a lawyer and a good reason. But they don't let you see them until you are reuntied usually.

About my doc's office records, when I got them, the names of 2 sets of PAP were written there. One was crossed out. In the 1960s there was no law letting you have your medical records, the doc wouldn't have worried about me ever seeing this information.

I also sent away to the county of adoption in WA state and got my non identifing information. They only search records one day a week. Or did. She called me on Monday, did the search on Wednesday and then copied and mailed the non id.

With the non ID, with first names on it, and the last name from my medical records, I went downtown Seattle and got a copy of my son's amended birth certificate. Perfectly legal. (he was 33 when I was searching, he was not a minor child)

The record number on the amended was the same as the one on the orginal.

It took me 9 months to find him. I even paid 1-800-search to look too. Birthson having a special birthdate, 2/29, turned out to be the ONLY Chris C. born on that date in the whole country. What they did was normally send you a list of everyone born in your state or states requested, on the day and year you are searching. Then send you the list. For more money they will narrow it down. I don't even know if they are still around.

As you can figure out, I didn't need anyone to narrow it down.

I was asked to come over. As I haven't been reading this thread. I didn't know it was here or I would have.

I hope this helps anyone who lives here, WA.

Teri

[Scarlet Moon 13]

Originally Posted by soulquest81

When I gave my son up for adoption in Washington State I was in the military at the time and I signed the adoption papers several weeks BEFORE the birth. I didn't sign anything afterwards and I was so exhausted that I just went along with everything, denying that I had actually had a baby and desiring to just get on with my life. Then after it was all said and done I had a lot of second thoughts and I believe that if I had been asked to sign anything after the birth or go to court or talk with a lawyer then I would have never gone through with it. What's done is done and I know I can't go back, I'm just wondering how many other birthmothers signed the papers while they were still pregnant and had so much less emotional attachment and then later had second thoughts. I'm also wondering if this was even legal as the child wasn't even a born person. Thanks for the insight.

-Soulquest81

Are you sure they didn't bring in the final documents for your signature immediately after the birth? They cannot be signed until after the birth, then you have 48 hours to revoke.. The revoking period is something I didn't know about in 1967. Sounds fishy in any state to do that. Maybe military skips the state law.

I was a minor and I never was told that the SW was going to go to court "for me". I didn't know anything about court. In 1967 there was a great deal I was never told. Made it easier to take my child from me if I didn't know what they were doing.

In WA it wouldn't have been legal to have you sign relinquishment papers before the birth. You can get a copy of that paper. I got one from my CI when she was searching for me. Before I found others who would help.

I went though WARM, Washington adoption reunion/reform movement..
Then a searcher helped me, well he didn't help me, he screwed me.. so I dumped him. He was searching the adoptive fathers family.. such a joke. Then a friend from Bastard Nation got me an old address of my bson's and other information.

All in all, after much misery, emotional upheaval, I was and am reunited with bson. Happily... for 10 years.

[Scarlet Moon 13]

Originally Posted by 03-06-1971

Dear Soulquest 81,
I can empathize...I know I signed papers before giving birth, but honestly was so traumatized that I do not know if I signed anything afterwards. I surrendered my son at Madigan Hospital, in the Ft. Lewis/McChord AFB complex, as my father was retired USAF, and went through the LDS Social Services.

Last month, on Jan 23, I found a profile my birthson had posted on this website in 2005. I had posted a profile in 2000, but for some reason we didn't connect. We were able to make a connection this time, however. As we are getting to know each other, he stated that he thought that the records had been sealed by my request. I have to say that I do not remember doing that, but again, it was so traumatic that I believe I buried a lot of memories and emotions, which are now just coming to the surface. Are you searching for the child you surrendered?

In Washington State, you, as the birth mother, have a right to a copy of the original birth certificate. I just traveled to Olympia yesterday and ordered mine. It should be in my possession within a week, if there are no glitches. I didn't even know I could do that until I starting posting on this website, and another very kind poster let me know about that. What adoption agency did you go through? I am thinking of contacting LDS Social Services to request information. It's not necessary in order to find my son, because we have already reunited (although not face to face yet). But, I want to know what happened because like yourself, the trauma was so great that I am having difficulty putting all the pieces together. It's almost like a form of PTSD, I think.

I have heard other stories of a similar nature. You are not alone.

Best wishes,
Susan

We have open adoption in WA, and the records are not sealed if that is requsted. A CI told me. They can search open record files without a court order here.

Any adoption taking place before that law would be automatically sealed.

My bio dad adopted me back into the family when I was 35, and it is a closed adoption.. LOL funny huh. mine was a step parent adoption at age 8, so I wanted it undone.. hence my being adopted back by my dad.

[Scarlet Moon 13]

Originally Posted by mn125

(((((((soulquest and 03-06))))))))

my eyeballs are twitching with stress and anger from reading your posts about the tricks of the trade......sigh.

03-06 I got your PM about finding your son. Congrats!! I am so very happy neither you or your son had to endure WA's solution to adoption reunion (confidential intermediary)

I'm going to "grab" a Seattle mom that posts on the boards here...and give her a link to the posts. I know she has been involved with WA search/support/reforms. Lets see if she can help direct you on how to get those documents. I'd like to know myself- so I can pass that info to my mother. I'm sure looking over those papers would give us hours and hours of new conversations about what and how it all happened.

WAVING I have been grabbed..


Teri

[SchmennaLeigh]

Washington Law:

Adoption
Consent to Adoption
To better understand this issue and to view it across States, see the Consent to Adoption (PDF - 402 KB) publication.

Who Must Consent to an Adoption
Citation: �� 26.33.080; 26.33.160

• The parents and any alleged father
• The agency or department to which the child has been relinquished
• The legal guardian

Age When Consent of Adoptee is Considered or Required
Citation: � 26.33.160
A child 14 years of age or older must consent to the adoption. When Parental Consent is not Needed
Citation: � 26.33.120

• A parent's rights have been terminated in the child's best interest and due to failure to perform parental duties.
• A parent is withholding consent contrary to the child's best interests.
• For an Indian child, a parent's rights may be terminated only pursuant to standards set forth in 25 U.S.C. � 1912(f).

When Consent Can Be Executed
Citation: �� 26.33.080; 26.33.090; 26.33.160

• The parents' written consent and petition to relinquish may be filed before the child's birth, but the hearing may not be held sooner than 48 hours after the birth.
• If the child is an Indian child, the petition and consent shall not be signed until at least 10 days after the child's birth.

How Consent Must Be Executed
Citation: �� 26.33.090; 26.33.160

• Written consents may be executed out of court and mailed or delivered to the clerk of the court, but are not valid until 48 hours after signing or the birth of the child and approved by a judge.
• If the child is an Indian child, no consent shall be valid unless signed at least 10 days after the child's birth and recorded before a court of competent jurisdiction, pursuant to 25 U.S.C. � 1913(a).

Revocation of Consent
Citation: � 26.33.160

• Consent is revocable until the court approves it.
• Thereafter, consent is irrevocable, except that for 1 year, consent may be revoked for fraud, duress, or lack of mental competency.
• For an Indian child, consent can be withdrawn for any reason before entry of final decree, and for fraud or duress within 2 years.

http://www.childwelfare.gov/systemwi...rchresults.cfm
State Statute Search for Washington under Consent to adoption

So, according to law, you CAN sign before birth (which is so absolutely wrong in my opinion; not of you, but that it's allowed in general).

*hugs* Sorry

[Scarlet Moon 13]

Originally Posted by SchmennaLeigh

Washington Law:

Adoption
Consent to Adoption
To better understand this issue and to view it across States, see the Consent to Adoption (PDF - 402 KB) publication.

Who Must Consent to an Adoption
Citation: �� 26.33.080; 26.33.160

• The parents and any alleged father
• The agency or department to which the child has been relinquished
• The legal guardian

Age When Consent of Adoptee is Considered or Required
Citation: � 26.33.160
A child 14 years of age or older must consent to the adoption. When Parental Consent is not Needed
Citation: � 26.33.120

• A parent's rights have been terminated in the child's best interest and due to failure to perform parental duties.
• A parent is withholding consent contrary to the child's best interests.
• For an Indian child, a parent's rights may be terminated only pursuant to standards set forth in 25 U.S.C. � 1912(f).

When Consent Can Be Executed
Citation: �� 26.33.080; 26.33.090; 26.33.160

• The parents' written consent and petition to relinquish may be filed before the child's birth, but the hearing may not be held sooner than 48 hours after the birth.
• If the child is an Indian child, the petition and consent shall not be signed until at least 10 days after the child's birth.

How Consent Must Be Executed
Citation: �� 26.33.090; 26.33.160

• Written consents may be executed out of court and mailed or delivered to the clerk of the court, but are not valid until 48 hours after signing or the birth of the child and approved by a judge.
• If the child is an Indian child, no consent shall be valid unless signed at least 10 days after the child's birth and recorded before a court of competent jurisdiction, pursuant to 25 U.S.C. � 1913(a).

Revocation of Consent
Citation: � 26.33.160

• Consent is revocable until the court approves it.
• Thereafter, consent is irrevocable, except that for 1 year, consent may be revoked for fraud, duress, or lack of mental competency.
• For an Indian child, consent can be withdrawn for any reason before entry of final decree, and for fraud or duress within 2 years.

http://www.childwelfare.gov/systemwi...rchresults.cfm
State Statute Search for Washington under Consent to adoption

So, according to law, you CAN sign before birth (which is so absolutely wrong in my opinion; not of you, but that it's allowed in general).

*hugs* Sorry

thank you for posting this.. it is sad when the can manipulate pregnant mothers to sign before the birth..

it is so morally wrong.

[mn125]

Good to see you again Scarlet!

And thank you for that info! I'm going to talk to my mom and see if I can convince her to get the ball rolling on getting some of that paperwork. It would be such a blast to go back to Childrens Home Society together. LOL

[mn125]

What ever happened to Alana?

I still have the sunflowers site bookmarked for a link to Curry Wolfes page- First Contact..... I have passed it out many times to others. It was very helpful to me, in writing my letters (5) to my siblings. But I see that some time ago, Alana must have given the site up.

Remembering good times from the backyard here....
where you one of "those" mothers who were removed to the - what was it called? turd hurlers list? LOL

Thanks for comming over here and talking about your experience in WA, Scarlet!

SchmennaLeigh, thanks too, for sharing that info. It bothers me alot to see how bad our mothers were (and still are?) being treated.


((((hugs))))
mel

[Scarlet Moon 13]

Originally Posted by mn125

What ever happened to Alana?

I still have the sunflowers site bookmarked for a link to Curry Wolfes page- First Contact..... I have passed it out many times to others. It was very helpful to me, in writing my letters (5) to my siblings. But I see that some time ago, Alana must have given the site up.

Remembering good times from the backyard here....
where you one of "those" mothers who were removed to the - what was it called? turd hurlers list? LOL

Thanks for comming over here and talking about your experience in WA, Scarlet!

SchmennaLeigh, thanks too, for sharing that info. It bothers me alot to see how bad our mothers were (and still are?) being treated.


((((hugs))))
mel

OH yes, I was on the local list, turdhurlers, started by Terri. Terri went another direction and some of us went on to be just the hurlers.. about 30 of us are left. about 10 to 15 who still write daily or weekly. And about 10 or so who see each other fairly often. One lady, Marie, lives a block from me.. Four ladies went to Vegas for Marie's retirement party. A group of us went to Canada to Victoria for High Tea at the hotel.. 9 birthmothers, in hats, eating cucmber sandwiches and drinking tea.

Lorrie from NY, Kathy AZ, Pam, Dianne, Brenda: Canada, Marie, Teri (me), Pat, Ronda from WA..

One of the ladies had an ocean house and for a while we were all going there for the weekend a couple of times a year... then they decided to sell it.. sigh, those were great weekends. Rummy-O, fresh crab and clams, walks on the beach.. oh and the occasional tears in the early years during our searches.. We have been talking and meeting for over 10 years. Good firends.

[crick]

Please note that discussion of private organizations with fee based services is not allowed. The state registries and state sites are allowed, but not private organizations involved in offering professional adoption services that charge fees.

So please be careful in discussing your search organizations and if it involved a fee, please do it via PM.

Thanks!

[Scarlet Moon 13]

Originally Posted by crick

Please note that discussion of private organizations with fee based services is not allowed. The state registries and state sites are allowed, but not private organizations involved in offering professional adoption services that charge fees.

So please be careful in discussing your search organizations and if it involved a fee, please do it via PM.

Thanks!

Sorry, I forgot....

[SuddenlySusan]

Thanks to all of you so very, very much for your replies. The information you have given me is so helpful, and the support you have given me brings me to tears. I am beyond words. I do know, though, that once I am through this process, I want to help other adoptees and birthparents. Did you say that WARM does this kind of work? Again, thank you so much.

As I said in another post (LDS forum), at this time in my life, 36 years later, I am horrified at my own ignorance at the time. I came back with not a shred of paperwork, I was over 18 at the time, and my mother accompanied me (she was totally against the adoption) on the flight back home. She did not get one iota of paperwork, either. I guess they (LDS-SS) just wanted me to believe that nothing ever happened. Really... who else but a thief takes something from you and gives you no paperwork in return? Again and again, thank you so much!

(((GINORMOUS HUGS TO YOU ALL)))
Love, Susan