[Amysue1112]

Hello,
Don't know if any of you know the troubles in Russia-not worth going in to, but basically it is really screwed up. People are stuck in all steps, and most are wondering it they will ever get their children home. Soooo...our agency called us today and told us things look bad in Russia for a long time to come-so now we are looking at Ukraine. It is so very different, and it is so hard 5 months into the process to think of a new country. However, we don't think we can stand the unknowns is Russia anymore, and so we are trying to open our hearts to other options. Ukraine will accept our Russian dossier that is already completed, so could any of you tell me more about the Ukraine? ANYTHING...why you picked it, pros and cons....can you adopt children under 18months? Health issues? Can the trips really be up to 5 weeks?? Delays in adoptions? Thank you SO MUCH in advance...our hearts are hurting and we would like to hope we will be able to adopt a child one day.
Amy

[hjdeth]

Amy,
First, most of your dossier will not work for Ukraine. The homestudy will have to be re-written specifically for Ukraine. The medical form may possibly have to be re-done since they have a specific format the NAC requires. Then the I-171, POA, letter of obligation, and petition to adopt are all Ukrainian specific. You are probably ok on your marriage certificate, passport copies, and employment verification.

So, to switch to Ukraine the first thing you would need to do is apply to USCIS for a change of country (there is a form & fee info at www.immigration.gov) and get your homestudy updated. then do the other Ukraine specific forms and have the updated documents apostilled. If you are lucky and USCIS is speedy, it will take you about 2 months to get back to where you are now...ready to submit dossier for translation.

Once the dossier is submitted, assuming everything is correct, appts to travel are running 5-9 months later. The NAC is already scheduling May & June appts for dossiers received in Oct/Nov 04 and is currently not accepting dossiers for families wanting younger children. My best guess would be that if you were able to submit your translated dossier in late April you would probably be traveling late 05 or early 06.

Don't know about the Russian program you were looking at, but Ukraine is travel blind with no guarantees. You are offered referrals of children after you arrive in Kiev and there is no rhyme to how referrals are given out. If you arrive and there is a new referral of a 15mo that day, you may be offered that child. However, if you are not one of the first appts you may well be told no young children and offered referrals of much older children.

"under 18mo?" that cuts you pretty short on choices since Ukrainian children must be registered for 14 months before becoming available for foreign adoption. Seldom is a child available under 15mo and girls this age are almost impossible to find. Your chances jump up dramatically if you look for up to 3yo or 5yo.

health issues are similar to Russia

"Can the trips really be up to 5 weeks??" the average trip is 4 weeks, if the 30-day waiting period is waived. It is not uncommon for a 1-trip adoption to be up to 6 weeks if the family declines the first and/or second referrals before finding their child. If the 30 days is not waived you may either stay in Ukraine during this time or return home and then 1 parent travels to bring home the child.

delays? There are always delays in international adoption, it is the nature of the beast. Ukraine seems to be particularly changable when compared to countries like China. The best way I have heard it described is the only thing predictable about Ukrainian adoption is its unpredictability.

All that being said, I love Ukrainian adoption and have 4 wonderful Ukrainian children adopted during 3 separate adoptions. I don't feel Ukraine is a good choice for those families set on a young, relatively healthy child, but it is ideal for those wanting an older child.

[drjeanne]

Well said Hannah! Wow! So much information but, with 4 adoptions under your belt, I would think you'd be pretty close to expert by now! I don't have much more to add. My DH and I are attempting an independent Ukrainian adoption. We chose Ukraine because it was one trip. We have friends over there right now who are adopting 2 year olds so, I am not sure I understand why people keep telling us they're (NAC) not giving out referrals for younger children? Also I've heard there's a new NAC director and that this, along with a new president, may change the entire adoption process dramatically in the future! I know whatever country you choose to adopt from.....processes can change drastically and instantly so, there are no guarantees. When you decide to adopt, you also need to decide to adapt!

Best of luck!
J

[hjdeth]

J,
Congrats! All of my adoptions were indy and that is the only way I would go.

It is about 50/50 whether Ukraine will be a 1-trip adoption. Depends on the judge and how the wind is blowing that day. Some regions never waive the 30-day waiting period, others usually do. However, you never know for sure.

Have your friends already started their adoption or are they still in the referral stage? You refer to "2 year olds" in the plural. Did they receive a referral for twins or very close in age siblings? I have only heard of 1 family in the last year+ that was able to adopt 2 unrelated young children and they were in country for over 3 months completing 2 totally separate adoptions.

The NAC does still give out referrals for young children, but not often and they are not the norm. The average age of adoption in Ukraine is about 4yo. Statistically, that means for every 6yo, there is also a 2yo. For example, if there is 1 young, relatively healthy child newly available each day and 15 families with appts (10 new, 5 returning) then the chances of a specific family being given the referral for that young child is about 6%. Not good odds in my book. That is why I tell everyone with their hearts set on a young, healthy child that Ukraine may not be for them. I would much rather see a family go to Ukraine with the expectation of adopting up to 6yo be pleasantly surprised by receiving a referral for a 2yo than have that same family have an expectation of a 2yo and be devastated and return home empty handed when they only receive referrals for 5yos.

There is currently not a new NAC director, but most everyone is expecting that big changes are coming.

[drjeanne]

Hannah
Thanks for all your information. I was referring in the plural on the two year olds because the woman helping us currently has 4 families over there. Three received referrals for children just under the age of 2 and all were healthy and should be home next week. The 4th had a problem with their first two referrals due to undisclosed health issues and are working on their third referral. The woman helping us usually sends 4-5 families over at a time. I've been around long enough to see 8 families come home and all 8 got children younger than or just at 2 years of age so, saying that younger children just aren't common seems wrong to me but, these are the only groups I follow so maybe the woman helping us is just lucky!?! Who knows. Personally I'm a bit older and I put down that I would take any child from 0-6 years old and would also accept any mild health issues so, I think I opened myself up for more referral options. I think some people put down too narrow of a group and therefore, end up with narrow options. Also all the trips I've followed have been one trip and only one couple has had to stay more than 3 weeks because the judge wouldn't waive the waiting period for them. From all I've read and learned in the past year, I think it all depends on your facilitator and how good they are, who they know, if they know how to work the system, how the wind's blowing that day and just how good the NAC director is feeling! I think noone has an advantage...its' purely God's handiwork and fate! I can't wait to go! I'm sure it will be the adventure of a lifetime for my husband and I. Whether we come home with an older child or a younger one, we'll feel blessed and happy because we were given this opportunity for a family! How lucky we are!

Take care!
J

[drjeanne]

oh, and thanks for the info on the NAC director. Someone on FRUA had said they thought there was a new one. I hope changes come about soon and I hope they're good ones for all of us!

J

[Letzlannie]

One quick thought on the dossier. I changed from Moldova to Ukraine after my homestudy was written..in fact it was with INS. My social worker wrote an addendum changing the country and we attached a notarized/apostilled etc copy of that to homestudy. Both acted as separate documents, but I didn't need a totally new homestudy.
My agency was very helpful in working with the documents we had and figuring out what would or would not work.
It's not the easiest decision, but it can work out for the best.

Leslie
mother of Nicholas
b 12-29-2002 a 6-15-2004 Kremenchuk, Ukraine