[shy_bear]

My son is in therapy, but it is looking like he is not going to qualify for prek through the school district; very long story!! Anyway, we were talking with his OT as she also works at one of the prek's in the metro area. We thought it was a very diverse school with a good rep. She discouraged us from sending A. there. They are having a lot of problems this year with the AA kids not wanting to interact and be friends with the other kids. They have had to have sit down meetings with several of the parents; it seems the AA parents are informing their kids they can't be friends with the white and Hispanic kiddos. My son is Hispanic so a big red flag went up for me. I guess my first thought is we always hear of whites being racist towards others, but at least for me I don't hear of it the other way around. Why is that??? Second in my mind I would think that people who have prob. experienced racism would not want to teach that to their own kids.

[Amber76]

Just want to share this story that happened to me at the Children's Museum several months back. My son, who is Guatemalan, was crawling around in what we called his "army crawl" (on his elbows rather than on his hands) in a play area at the museum. An AA woman and her son, who was just a little older than mine, came into the area and her son was playing as well. She looked at me, (having only seen DS from the back) and said, "Oh, that crawl is so cute. He looks like one of those Mexicans sneaking under the fence at the border." I was totally floored. I picked up DS, turned him so that she could clearly see his face, and then stated, "We call that his army crawl because we don't say racist things at our house," and then walked away. I also couldn't believe that someone who has probably heard hateful and racist things as part of her life would say something like that about my son. I know she probably didn't even realize he is Latino because his hair and skin is the same as mine, but I still couldn't believe it. I hope this isn't a problem in society as a whole, though, because that's the only negative experience I've had and everyone I know who is AA loves my son and has never said anything negative about him.

[sbaglio]

Originally Posted by Amber76

She looked at me, (having only seen DS from the back) and said, "Oh, that crawl is so cute. He looks like one of those Mexicans sneaking under the fence at the border."

Oh my God, that just takes my breath away. How horrible.

<sigh> I have to think a bit before I post about this topic, because it's one, like you Amber and shy_bear, that upsets me to no end.

[Quesita]

I just wanted to say that just because someone has been the victim of discrimination does not mean that they will be anti-discrimination. Actually, it is often the opposite. I work with immigrant communities, and I've worked on issues of bias/discrimination on many levels.

Historically, many immigrant groups are victims of discrimination. And sadly, a historical trend is that first and second generation immigrants often become the most vocal critics of the current wave of immigrants. Also, historically, recent immigrants (of all colors and races) often look down upon the US born AA communities. We work to try and combat these trends, with mixed degrees of success.

When economic times are tough, people who lose jobs or suffer hardships are most likely to seek out a scapegoat. "Everything was fine before X group moved into the neighborhood," even though X group's arrival had nothing to do with a complex economic reality.

Also, individual communities develop complex dynamics. The Latin Kings are a powerful force in a community adjacent to mine, (primarily Puerto Rican) and they are periodically in conflict with the Bloods, (primarly US born AA) who live a few neighborhoods past that. When a latino kid gets beaten up (or worse) by an AA kid, or the other way around, the effects resonate deeply within the ethnic/racial communities that have nothing to do with either of the gangs.

I don't pretend to understand the dynamics going on at this school, but I am sorry that your attempts to get your son into an integrated school are presenting some complex questions. If I were you, I would learn more about the situation before making a decision either way.

[peregrinerose]

Originally Posted by shy_bear

My son is in therapy, but it is looking like he is not going to qualify for prek through the school district; very long story!! Anyway, we were talking with his OT as she also works at one of the prek's in the metro area. We thought it was a very diverse school with a good rep. She discouraged us from sending A. there. They are having a lot of problems this year with the AA kids not wanting to interact and be friends with the other kids. They have had to have sit down meetings with several of the parents; it seems the AA parents are informing their kids they can't be friends with the white and Hispanic kiddos. My son is Hispanic so a big red flag went up for me. I guess my first thought is we always hear of whites being racist towards others, but at least for me I don't hear of it the other way around. Why is that??? Second in my mind I would think that people who have prob. experienced racism would not want to teach that to their own kids.

Ignorance and racism is not unique to any single culture or race. Some people just don't see race, others actively teach that other races are bad, and the entire spectrum in between. I was a Big Sister when I lived in Philly, and the parents of my little sis had taught her to hate white people. She was frequently telling me that she hated white people, all white people were mean, etc. When I'd ask her what she thought of me, then, as a white person, she would get very confused (she was only 10, so had a hard time with abstract thought like this). It was really sad to hear such hatred due to a superficial trait come ouf of a child's mouth.

I'll never understand why we all can't just get along.

[SupaModel]

I wont write a long post but I think every culture can be and have been racist. No one group owns that ignorance. Im AA and I have had Asian, Hispanic, Indian AND AA etc... say off color things to me. I am also just as guilty of saying or at least thinking something about every culture that could be considered prejudice, racist etc.... Now do I consider myself raciast? HECK NO! I am just saying I dont belive NO ONE GROUP is exempt from being that way.

[sugarandspice697]

Although the parents in both Shybear and Amber's situation were out of line, I'm not surprised this even happened. I'm not sure if you read the story I posted about the racist and homophobic comments DP and I received in the airport, but the perpetrator of the heated discussion was also AA. Because America has such a complex history in regards to racism, I doubt there is even one American who is unbiased.
I remember when I was in college, my first "real" girlfriend was a gorgeous butch/tomboy girl who was half Puerto Rican and half Mexican. When we visited my grandmother over the holidays she constantly talked about how all the "********" we're taking all of the good jobs and wanted to know whether or not ex-GF came here legally.

Also, these biases remarks are not only in the AA community but also in the LGBT community. I remember when I told my friend (who is a feminine lesbian) that DP and I were getting married she said "why in the world would you want to marry a ****? There so ugly, fat and look like men.

[millie58]

not sure where you live but I would think this has to do with income level. I consider myself middle-income (although I live from paycheck to paycheck) and I teach all 4 of my boys to associate with people based on their positivity, not race or ethnicity. They have friends of all races. The problems my oldest one faced had to do with being adopted and the meanness of kids.

Sorry you all had to go through that. My mom was the victim of racism and harbors some resentment... but in my lifetime things have been getting better.

[joskids]

We have a biracial granddaughter that is physically very beautiful, brown skin, fine features, beautiful long, silky hair. She's in a school with mostly AA kids and really getting grief from some of the AA girls that seem to find one thing after another to pick on her about. My daughter has had it and, just today, called the school administrator to try to put an end to it.
It sickens me that our beautiful 12 year old granddaughter has to deal with this crap. But it doesn't surprise me.

I'm with the rest who feel that racism goes across all color lines, all religion lines, all lifestyle choices. I don't really know when it will end . . . I tend to be an optimist but I'm losing hope.

I think the bottom line is parents who are NOT teaching their children to be responsible and respectful. I see it every day. Just sad, sad, sad. I guess all we can do is to raise our children to respect EVERYONE. I can't keep tryin' to get angry about everyone else's parenting style. It's about to ruin me.

[loveajax]

I agree with what others have said. I do think I would investigate further though. I mean I am sure that if someone looked into any school system they may see a group of kids that refuse to associate with kids outside their race (no matter what race they are). People tend to remember the bad and "generalize" from that. You may find though that it is really quite limited and may be a great school for your child. Good luck figuring it out.

[Sleeplvr]

This a very complex subject. First of all you can't realistically expect anyone who has been the subjected to racism to automatically become enlighted and not turn around and do the same thing. People are human and some people just don't have it in them to turn the other cheek. Racism is equal opportunity... it's just highlighted more for CC's because they weld power with their racism... minorities typically don't have any power to go with theirs so it flies under the radar.

I took a look at your profile and it says you are in Colorado. There are not a lot of AA's in that state. I was there for my step-son's graduation and it was weird. The AA's there were very standoffish. Living in the South AA's have unwritten rules of speaking to other AA's especially if you are in an environment where minorities are rare... that even crosses racial/ethnic lines in certain situations... People of color will look for another friendly face of color but it depends on the dynamics of that environment. I was surprised at how unfriendly the AA's in your state were...but I don't live there so I don't know if they are mostly transplants or lived there a very long time. You have to have insight into that particular community to figure out why it operates the way it does. There is some reason why they self segregate.

There is a big difference in not wanting to socialize versus fighting and name calling. Not wanting to socialize does not mean it will be a hostile environment but you have to decide what environment you want your kids in.

[sbaglio]

I don't think it's automatic that people who are discriminated against will do the same towards others. And I DO think that people can become enlightened from their own experiences. Humans are complex, intelligent beings who can discern the consequences of their actions. Some turn in the complete opposite direction, and this is human nature as well. The choice to "retaliate", as it were, by being equally racist is not innate; it's a choice once makes.

I am acutely aware of how I treat people who are at all different from me, perhaps to a fault. And it makes me very sad that many black people are so homophobic, and often racist as well. I can never understand how it is that a group which has experienced so much discrimination cannot empathize with others who have experienced similar. This goes for other groups as well - many Mexicans are quite racist towards blacks, I've learned (being married to a non-Mexican from Latin America), for example. I can't tell you how chauvanistic most men still are, and openly so.

I still think that racism in any form is unacceptable, and being discriminated against is no excuse for discriminating against others, be it by race, ethnicity, sexual orientation, gender, or any other trait/characteristic.

[loveajax]

Fadzi, you rock!!

[Sleeplvr]

Fadzi

I know you are trying to dismiss my comments... LOL IMO most AA's have turned the other cheek and have become enlightened from their experiences but there are those who can't or won't... it's just human nature and it unfortunately the person's socioeconomic status plays a part in it. All I was relaying to the OP was that it's wrong to assume that just because someone has been discriminated against that they are one of the enlightened ones. You shouldn't assume anything... I'm always shocked by the crazy stuff that comes out of the mouth of people I think that should know better.

Friday I was at martial art class with the kids and sitting next to E's mom who is Latina. She started asking the instructor questions about her son moving up and why another child who is her son's age was in a different class. The instructor couldn't recall by name the child and she said you know.. the oriental boy. Now E's mom can't even be 30 years old. Who uses oriental anymore? I had been trying to get a read on her since day one and I finally got it that day.

[sbaglio]

Sleeplvr,

I wasn't trying to "dismiss" your comments. We're just discussing . I'm just presenting a different viewpoint. I just got the sense from your previous post that you were saying that we can't expect that anyone who is discriminated against won't turn around and do the same. I think we can, and call out those who don't.

Why is it that some kids who are sexually abused grow up to hurt other children, while others become the strongest advocates against child abuse? I think we all can use our experiences for good. People who say or think "I was discriminated against, so it's okay to do it to others" are taking the easy way out, IMO.

Maybe my idea of the world is too idealistic LOL! I have spoken up when people make sexist jokes about women, put Jewish people down, or discriminate against other races (yep, I've dealt with the "oriental" comment as well). Because some people are homophobic doesn't make me stop doing these things.