[nickchris]

Is not that the truth. I think a lot of us are too scared to reach out and get to know someone of another race and culture, thus all we have as reference is the garbage given to us via the media. That is why my kids watch limited/screened little TV.

Originally Posted by mommamarci

Nickchris- I totally agree with you. Dh and I are CC. When we were trying to decide, I considered cutlural differences. To me it seems it would be easier to learn and teach culture to an AA child that was born in the US. We celebrate the same holidays (for the most part, depdending on religion and such). We eat a lot of the same foods, watch the same TV shows, etc. Because we live in the same country!!!!!!! However, if I were to adopt a child that was born in a different country, I would have to learn everything: food, holidays, clothing, music, etc. (I do want to say I would be willing to learn all of this for my child.) Unless you already have a connection with that culture, it does not make sense to me that it would be easier to teach a child about an Asian culture, etc.

It also rubbed me the wrong way that AA culture is all about baggy clothing and poor speech. I think that is the culture displayed by the media, but the AA people I know do not dress any differently than dh and I do and speak just like we do. I also know plenty of young CC men / boys who wear very baggy clothing.

[ilenewatson2]

This has been a very interesting thread, and I wanted to chime in with my experiences. We are CC adoptive parents to three children, a six-year-old AA son, a five-year-old AA/Asian son and a one-year-old AA/CC daughter, so our family runs the gamut of racial differences.

In response to people who plan to adopt either Asian or Hispanic children because they think it will be "easier," I wanted to relate my experience in choosing a school district in the city that we are moving to. My best friend happened to move to this same city last year. My friend is Hispanic and her husband is CC. They have two beautiful boys who are a perfect blend of the two of them. She has had trouble finding a good school system that has other Hispanic children in attendance, just as we have had trouble finding a good school system that has more than just a few African American or biracial students.

This is something that we never thought about prior to adopting, but now that we are in the thick of it, it has become a big deal. In trying to find a neighborhood/school/part of town to live in, the best schools are not necessarily in the most diverse neighborhoods. We will either have to compromise on diversity or test scores, neither of which is a good option for us. My friend has had to do the same. She ended up compromising on diversity and now her son will be one of about ten Hispanic kids in an elementary school of about 700 students. He will no doubt get a great education, but now she has to worry about other students asking why his skin is so brown, why he "looks dirty," and she has to explain to her son why he doesn't look like any of his friends. Granted this could happen at any school, but it's more likely in a school that lacks diversity.

This point of this is that a parent who adopts outside of their race, any race, is going to face issues. If someone is not prepared for that, then I think it's great that they have identified their limitations BEFORE they bring a child into their lives and then discover that it's more than they can handle.

My husband and I know that it would have been "easier" to adopt a child of our race. We wouldn't have to endure stares in the store, people constantly asking if they're "real" brothers and sisters, and we could pick any neighborhood we wanted without thinking twice about diversity. But we also wouldn't have our three fantastic children, our diverse group of friends, and the many people that we have met along the way who have gone on to adopt after meeting our children. Transracial adoption is not for everyone, but I know for us taking the "path less traveled" was the best decision we could have ever made, and I wouldn't change a single thing along the way.

[maggie_va]

Originally Posted by nickchris

Regarding AA culture as only big clothes and poor speech; it is only based on all the negative aspects, and these AA kids would end up white if you take these things away? (considering the AA I see everyday; big misconception there) The history that I have read/studied about other race/cultures has/had good and bad aspects as well.

As I said before, I can only comment on the AA culture as I see it in person in my community and the surrounding areas. Both clothes - having to have name brands even if they are unaffordable and poor speech - on purpose that is not because lack of education are very real part of the "culture" in this area and since my child would be living here I can't dicount those things.


I ask this with complete sincerity becaue I really do want to know - I would like to hear from those who are CC and adopting AA children what it is they are going to teach their child about their culture? What is it that you define as the AA culture? What things will you bring into your home tht will help blend the AA culture with your own CC culture?

[mommamarci]

Originally Posted by maggie_va

I ask this with complete sincerity becaue I really do want to know - I would like to hear from those who are CC and adopting AA children what it is they are going to teach their child about their culture? What is it that you define as the AA culture? What things will you bring into your home tht will help blend the AA culture with your own CC culture?

We plan to bring in art work and toys that reflect all races. Dh wants baby dolls / Barbies, etc. of all shapes and colors in our house. I also want to ask the birth mother if there are any special cultural events or holidays they celebrate. We will teach our child about AA history and try to provide role models: both of the past: Martin Luther King and present: sports players or actors, Senators, etc. It depends what the child is interested in. If we have a child that loves basketball, we will point out AA basketball players that can be role models. If our child wants to go into politics, we will point those people out. A lot depends on the child. We will expose the child to the stereotypes (baggy clothes, poor langauge, etc.), but will not try to mold the child into those.

This is just the tip of the iceberg. I know once the child enters our lives we will see so many other things we can and should do. We do know we will not focus on one race. we don't want our child to think the world is CC and AA. We want them to be exposed to every race.

[Fran27]

Originally Posted by mommmmy

But being in an intimate relationship with someone...I would think you would have a pretty good idea of how they feel about racial issues.

Another question comes up for me in this area...so if you are raising CC children...would you not want to make their environment culturally diverse? And why would it be "ok" for the CC children to be around those who are family members or friends that are racist and make comments? Don't you think that will effect them?

Again, you are generalizing.

About the husband part, again being restricted to race doesn't necessarily mean racist. Because someone isn't comfortable raising a child from a different ethnicity doesn't make them racist. Because someone cares for their family and doesn't want them to ignore their child doesn't make them racist.

For the environment thing... you're probably not aware of this, but you can be raised as a CC in a mostly CC environment and still be open minded about race. It's called education.

For the family and their racist comments - why again is a family that wouldn't be comfortable with a grandchild of another race necessarily be racist? Why would they necessarily make racist jokes or comments? You know what, lots don't.

Frankly, I feel a bit sorry for you if you can only see things in black and white and not even consider the things in between... it's as important when it comes to race as being totally open, IMO.

Originally Posted by CashCrew

I have little knowledge on this subject because I grew up in an all CC family in a predominately cc neighborhood, but we are in the process of adopting a transracial baby. This is just speculation because I've never gone though this, but when people say things like "how would it feel never seeing people 'like' it" I wonder exactly what they mean by that. Even all CCs are vastly different...pale skin, dark skin, red hair, black hair yet we are cultured don't "notice" that. I hope to raise my child to only look at the inside of a person just as I have my biological children. They truly never even consciously notice different races. Of course they see that everyone is different, but they don't see it as one race verses another. They just see that ALL of God's people are different and there's no race attached to difference. I know this isn't the norm for our society, but as far as empowering the transracial child within our family, I think it will help tremendously. JMHO as I have not experience it first hand yet. This is just what I'm basing my decision to adopt transracially on.

I agree with Ryan that unfortunately it's not realistic. You can't ignore racism. It could really hurt a child. As Ryan said, celebrate differences... don't ignore them.

This is exactly why IMO some families should not adopt transratially... I think it's very wrong to raise a child in an environment when he/she WILL be subject to racism, no matter what YOU feel about it.

And no, Mommmmy, everyone can't afford to move... adoption is expensive enough as it is.


Something else that occured to me is about the generalization people do about Asian culture... I think that between Vietnam, China and Japan there are very different cultures, and going for a China adoption because you like Japan culture seems really weird to me. I think it's one of those cases where people should really research more, IMO...

[maggie_va]

Originally Posted by mommamarci

We plan to bring in art work and toys that reflect all races. Dh wants baby dolls / Barbies, etc. of all shapes and colors in our house. I also want to ask the birth mother if there are any special cultural events or holidays they celebrate. We will teach our child about AA history and try to provide role models: both of the past: Martin Luther King and present: sports players or actors, Senators, etc. It depends what the child is interested in. If we have a child that loves basketball, we will point out AA basketball players that can be role models. If our child wants to go into politics, we will point those people out. A lot depends on the child. We will expose the child to the stereotypes (baggy clothes, poor langauge, etc.), but will not try to mold the child into those.

Yes, those things are important but are they really "culture"? I guess I see them more as window dressing so to speak.

My feelings are that by saying "We will expose the child to the stereotypes (baggy clothes, poor langauge, etc.), but will not try to mold the child into those" that it like sort of denying the AA culture experience today. To me its like saying rap or hip hop music is sterotyping but too me its not. Lots and lots of AA individuals find a lot of meaning in rap and hip hop and feel it speaks to them.

I guess I feel that culture in more evasive - its more than dolls and pointing out important racial figures - but maybe I am overthinking it. I am not sure in my own mind exactly how I am going to go about this for my DD so I am truly interested in others ideas.

Growing up, I had several friends from Central and South America. Even thought they were "Americanized" going to their house was always an experience because of the sublities of their culture that was brought forth - from the language, to the food, to the decorations, to the manners.

Maggie

[hotspice58]

maggie va: First off: hip hop/rap doesn't equal AA culture. My parents, both AA mix, don't listen to rap nor do any of their peers. There are CC, Hispanic and Asian people who do listen to it. Baggy clothes are mostly young boys; I however, won't let my sons wear them. Poor speech is the same thing although I ALWAYS correct my sons' speech. They can speak slang and they cans speak "proper" English. I tell them slang is only to be spoken inside with their friends. First impressions are alot and I won't have society thinking my boys are thugs/idiots because they're AA.

Second: for you to generalize people like that, it would be better if you adopted within your race. All Asians are different as are AA/Caribbean as are Italian/Irish as are Mexican/Puerto Rican. Don't lump ethnicities together. It will bite you on the butt.

[Sleeplvr]

This is ridiculous… Where do you live? I’m AA and my kid’s exposure to poor speech and baggy clothes is limited to TV. That’s another gripe for another day. I guess I shouldn’t have adopted AA kids since I have to (Or am I supposed to?) expose them to stereotypical blacks all the time. I guess my kids just won’t have any culture. I wonder how I missed that memo.

[mommamarci]

Originally Posted by maggie_va

Yes, those things are important but are they really "culture"? I guess I see them more as window dressing so to speak.

My feelings are that by saying "We will expose the child to the stereotypes (baggy clothes, poor langauge, etc.), but will not try to mold the child into those" that it like sort of denying the AA culture experience today. To me its like saying rap or hip hop music is sterotyping but too me its not. Lots and lots of AA individuals find a lot of meaning in rap and hip hop and feel it speaks to them.

I guess I feel that culture in more evasive - its more than dolls and pointing out important racial figures - but maybe I am overthinking it. I am not sure in my own mind exactly how I am going to go about this for my DD so I am truly interested in others ideas.

Growing up, I had several friends from Central and South America. Even thought they were "Americanized" going to their house was always an experience because of the sublities of their culture that was brought forth - from the language, to the food, to the decorations, to the manners.

Maggie

I guess my thing is that the AA people I know do not have much of a different culture than I do. They eat the same foods and watch the same things on TV. They listen to the same music and they dress like me. Maybe some AA people do have a completely different culture, but I am not familiar with those people. Bottom line, we are all American. That is our culture. I don't think you can even compare AA culture to Asian or Hispanic culture. If they were born in a different country, they will have a vastly different culture. I am not syaing I will discourage my child from baggy clothes and rap or hip hop, I will just not push it trying to make my child into the media view of AA teens. I want my child to listen to whatever music he or she likes and to wear the clothes he or she is comfortable in whether it is viewed as AA, CC, Asian, or any other culture.

[Sleeplvr]

Marci

You are right...there isn't a major cultural difference with AA's because they are American. You are seeing the true diversity of AA's and not just the stereotypes. Thank You! There are slight differences regarding customs but there are a myriad of reasons explains that. People from Texas may do things a little differently than those in New York. The main difference is how AA's are treated in this country and that's what people really need to prepare for. People who so willingly slap stereotypes to them are the people to watch.
This stuff about baggy pants and poor speech is a cop out plain and simple.

[kidmd2b]

It is interesting to see everyone's take on the situation. As for exposing the kids to stereotypes as their culture, I am not on board with that. Children have to be aware, but to bombard them with only one part of the culture or supposed culture is wrong. Many movies depict AA people as uneducated, poor and only involved in crime and drugs. I would not want my child to think that this is what it means to be AA or that this is what his future must hold for him to be true to himself. In the last year, I have seen few movies that depicted AA people as regular citizens and those weren't hyped up by the media. Because of this, many CC people think that this is how AA people are. It is true that there are people who live that way, but there are also doctors, lawyers and people of all social classes who are AA and make a good honest living like any other race. Why is this not perceived as their culture? I grew up in the inner city and taught in the schools there as an adult and I don't deny that in a lot of places people have lost hope and they have the thug mentality, but to assume that this is how the entire race operates and this depressing depiction is all they have to offer is really sad. To sum up, I am Italian and if I had birth kids I would not show them gangster movies and say that this is their culture and encompasses being Italian. In the same manner, if you ask someone about Italians, they will most likely bring up the Sopranos or organized crime. This is not to deny that it is not a part of our history, but it is a diservice to assume that it is all our culture has to offer. In the same light, most AA people are normal people with a rich history which includes a lot of pain, but also triumph. The baggy clothes and rap music are a subsect as some CC youths have blue mohawks or wear all black. As for racism, it is everywhere. I married a Filipino and when we went to the midwest he was discriminated against with slurs, stares and not being allowed to take communion in church. Racism is everywhere and not just CC against AA. I would never dream of not marrying my husband because life would be harder because of racism. I know we have to protect our children from hurt, but racism is everywhere. An AA who is adopted by AA will face it too. Should AA doctors move out of their neighborhoods which may not be as diverse as the inner city because of this? If these same parents wear business suits and don't listen to rap, but can teach their kids about AA history from the positive to the negative, is that okay? Of course, it is easier to teach about your own culture, but if you make the effort you can learn about other cultures too. We are lucky to live in CA where there is more diversity and more understanding. This is not to say that there is no racism and our future child will not have to be aware or on guard, but from our life experiences outside of this state, things are much more progressive. My goal is not to offend or attack anyone with this. I am just relaying what I feel from my experience. Sorry that I went on for awhile.
Cindy C

[maggie_va]

Originally Posted by hotspice58

maggie va: First off: hip hop/rap doesn't equal AA culture. My parents, both AA mix, don't listen to rap nor do any of their peers. There are CC, Hispanic and Asian people who do listen to it. Baggy clothes are mostly young boys; I however, won't let my sons wear them. Poor speech is the same thing although I ALWAYS correct my sons' speech. They can speak slang and they cans speak "proper" English. I tell them slang is only to be spoken inside with their friends. First impressions are alot and I won't have society thinking my boys are thugs/idiots because they're AA.

Second: for you to generalize people like that, it would be better if you adopted within your race. All Asians are different as are AA/Caribbean as are Italian/Irish as are Mexican/Puerto Rican. Don't lump ethnicities together. It will bite you on the butt.

Actually, I do think music plays a part in culture. I am suprised you don't As well as language.

I never said that I think that any of those brand individuals as thugs or idiots nor did I ever imply this. I don't associate either of those with being thugs or idiocy. Why do you?

I stated several times that this is the "culture" or lack of better term that I see in the area in which I live. I am certainly not generalizing a race or saying this is true for all areas but I had to consider it because I am not moving.

And I am very well aware that not every peron with dark skin is actually going to be of African descent.

Maggie

[hotspice58]

"Music" does; "rap/hip hop" doesn't. I listen to songs from the '60 and '70. In elementary school, I loved square dancing. That's not "AA" culture. AA and CC culture are more similar than you think.

[nickchris]

AA/blacks are just as varied as any other race, if you want to be totally open minded listen to what others are saying. Culture is varied, and AA takes from their ancestors, speech varies based on education or wanting to fit in...slang abounds with others.. as it did in the 60 with cool...hip etc; so it is also mixed with US culture..that is where you get the variety... good, bad, neutral. And how AA percieve such also lends to the variety as a people. Some AA parents will not let their child experiment and wear baggy pants etc; because of fear of how they will be treated..this is based on the US racial issues.
Check out websites regarding the other contributions to US society. Defining culture to what you see on TV or where ever you live or get your services rendered is tunnel visioned. Go to other places..go to a middle classed subdvision if you are in Northern VA, many intelligent, successful, affluent AA in the DC area.(pushing golf carts, wearing yuppie clothes etc.go to Prince George. Cetral Va has lots of professional Aa, go to the Hamptom. *Talk* to these people, go to their churches, and you will see what AA are about. Part of understanding folks is to immerce your self in all parts of what make them up. I turn around at times and am no longer surprised to see a CC kid with booming bases listening to rap.
Music made by AA, do you know Scott Joplin? he wrote opera pieces. Lets not think that becasue what tv is spewing out is all there is, that is waht sells.. to all races in the US.....
I hope you come to peace with your search, prior to adopting.

[maggie_va]

I don't know where the baggy clothes and poor language came from and I certainly never said that was culture.

I do believe their is a definte AA culture that goes beyond just being American but maybe I am way off base. I am going to stop posting though bc I think I will bring up the issue with an AA friend and ask his opinion on the matter. If anyone is interested, I could post after that.

thanks though to those who replied to my question

Maggie