[kretzklan]

That's exactly it. I have hope...but I want to have reality as well. I have a friend living with RAD that isn't on any forums...I try to persuade her to come here or to any others and hear that others (besides her and I) are living what she is living. The isolation is the worst...absolutely.
And, DH and I are also always happy when teacher starts to figure it out.
Another reality for us - appointments with doctors are just another way for them to con. At ortho yesterday, DD 'pretended' to run into the Xray machine (yeah, that HUGE thing hanging from the ceiling) and the tech came to tell me all the while rubbing DDs head as she smirked. I said "not shocking, she did it on purpose" and stared DD down. The tech was shocked and needless to say the rest of the appointment wasn't real fun. I'm just not nice anymore...that is the reality. I don't want to tell you, stranger lady, that touching my child and telling her how cute she is (yes, she did that over and over while rubbing) is bad for her. I don't want to ask you if you know what RAD is and then explain it to you. You are not a part of our lives in a big enough way...and I want some TINY piece of privacy. Yet, I can't pretend that allowing my DD to con you so convincingly is a good thing...I can't let her see me as weak and pretending it's ok.
BTW, ortho tells her the loose tooth has to come out and she says "Oh, my mommy is good at pulling teeth, she'll do it for me tonight". So, I sit her down to pull it (her idea, remember?) and she screams like I'm killing her. I hung in and got it out and she was ANGRY the rest of the night (the whole 10 minutes until bed) and telling bros and dad how mean I was.
It's not worth the breath to point out all the obvious...not worth it.
Another reality for us...there is no conversation between me and my Radlets. There is talking and on my side a prayer for conversation...but for them - no. DS2 talks so circular that I have no idea what he's talking about and that is when he's NOT mumbling so severely that I can't even tell if he is speaking English. I'm done saying "what?"...

[mommytoEli]

kretzklan- in regards to talking in circles, dh and i were JUST talking about this last night. our dd does this...which bugs, and also answers the wrong question with confidence- i think partly out of an attempt to make me feel crazy, and partly so that later she can say she didn't say something.

for example....when i ask her, where did you get the answers to this assignment? she'll say, our teacher passed out the books last week. oh, did you get the answers from the book then? yesterday our teacher did a review game. you get it. so it happend again last night, and dh and i had this conversation>

me: dh, do you like burgers?
dh: yesterday i had spaghetti.
me: yeah, but did you pack your lunch for tomorrow?
dh: friday i am going out with my friends.
me: ok, but really, are you coming home early tomorrow?
dh: yesterday i had a staff meeting.

dd looks at us like we are crazy, but seriously, this is what it is like when we DO talk with her.

i find it hard to pray for her much anymore. so last weekend when the senior group at church asked if they could take dd's picture and send it home with one of the senior ladies for them to pray for her(they did this with our whole youth group), my answer was PLEASE!

[kretzklan]

OMG - YES! That is it exactly. It's also that he 'starts' a conversation in a way he knows will cause the other party to ask a lot of questions.
DS2: That thing is cool. (he says cool about a million times a day...uses it for everything)
me: Which thing
DS2: the one over there
me: Great
DS2: You don't know what I'm talking about
me: dinner will be ready in 10 minutes
DS2: I studied about a bug today
me: I hope you learned a lot
DS2: mumbles
me: wash up for dinner

See...that is NOT a conversation. When I read you and DHs conversation...it made me laugh!

I did ask DH last night: Can you understand what DS2 is saying most of the time? He says:
You mean when he actually speaks English?

[sistomany18]

For me and my family the realities of parenting not just one but many children with obvious RAD now which was unheard of back then in the early 90's has been

-Having to keep my purse with me or in my bedroom which is locked when I am not home because I never know which child will get the idea into their mind that stealing from me is okay when I choose to be responsible and work and save and they choose not to.

-Having to lock our pantries and food storage freezers because even though we eat three meals a day and have regular snacks a few of the children who aren't hungry by any means and have been with us since infancy and two of which are on the overweight side from eating so much at school (double helpings at lunch and whatever junk food they can con their teachers into giving them when we specified no junk food) find it fun to take huge quantities of food (we are talking months worth) and just eat until they are ill and vomitting and this isn't pre pacakged food we are talking about its frozen food like pizza and meat and with a family of 12 kids we can't afford to keep replacing months worth of food over their lack of control so we have to lock the pantries and food storage fridges.

-Having to alarm doors at night because they like to make unsafe choices like playing with fire or breaking and entering and into our neighbors house with lies of not being fed and starved when the child was fed regularly, but was naturally tall and skinny like her biological family.

-Having one child stay at my sister's home to give my mom a break for a day as respite and the child in anger decides to run away from my sister's home and go to the local store near her house and start shoplifting and when caught and the police were brought in she gave them a sob story of not being fed when the child is clearly fed and is overweight and the police believe that they are dealing with a child who is abused and neglected and starved when in reality she is a child who is mentally ill and makes impulse choices that are not the best.

-Having to keep all bathroom toiletries put away because last time someone thought it would be fun to put chemicals in my mouth wash which I didn't end up using because I opened the bottle and it had a funny smell to it and I immediately knew something wasn't right.

Those are just a few examples of things that have happened in my family dealing with RAD kids who turn into RAD teenagers and eventually adults who are completely unattached. It's hard because you pour your heart and soul into these kids and want so much to have that normal loving bond, but no matter what you do they don't want to bond or love you in return and it hurts to put your heart into a child to have yourself basically slapped in the face over and over again. It is emotionally draining and it's hard when your child is the sweet loving amazing kid to teachers and relatives who refuse to believe that they are capable of such henious things and make you look like you are the strict, mean, crazy parent. It's also hard when you are dealing with RAD in the early 90's when it wasn't really acknowledged or heard of and when you look for help it's basically obslete and are told to basically deal with it.

[LisaF]

Ooohhh, I love reading everyone elses conversations. It makes me feel a little more sane. Conversation with daughter yesterday......

DD: The police called yesterday and I hung up on them.
Me: Are you supposed to answer the phone when I am not home?
DD: I can answer it when you are home......
Me: Are you supposed to answer the phone when I'm not home?
DD: When you are home.....
Me: Are you supposed to answer the phone when I'm not home?
DD: Kinda......

I know, I know. I'm not supposed to ask a question that I actually expect an answer

[saranbr]

OMG...I thought I was the only one that had nonsense conversations with someone who only occasionally uses intellegent English with me (but can carry on lengthy conversation at will with any perfect stranger). I'm laughing about the answering the phone while you're gone conversation-- yesterday I had the same da** conversation about what I had asked him to bring up from the swingset. I feel your pain-- but am a little happy to hear that I'm not the only one feeling totally crazy.

[momraine]

Do any of you have kids who love to repeat what they just heard you say to someone else? For instance if we are in the car and I tell dh I think it will rain tomorow, within minutes, ds will pipe up from the back seat, "Mom, do you think it's going to rain tomorow?"
Or Dd will ask me about something, and we will have a whole conversation about it. Then we arrive and he will start asking me the questions I just answered for her in the car. Then I look nuts when I am curt with him. I look like the mean mom that won't even answer my kids questions about the weather or our weekend plans. I know that he already knows the answers. Makes me crazy.

[mommytoEli]

Originally Posted by momraine

Do any of you have kids who love to repeat what they just heard you say to someone else? For instance if we are in the car and I tell dh I think it will rain tomorow, within minutes, ds will pipe up from the back seat, "Mom, do you think it's going to rain tomorow?"

YES YES YES!!!!!! rofl! all the freaking time! she usually does it about something i said to dh too...then she'll say it to me like she came up with it.

dd: mom, did you know that xyz?
me: um, yes, i knew yesterday when you were standing next to me when i told your dad. i know you were listening because you made a comment about what i said.
dd: hmph (pouts)

it happens almost daily. i hate it. i feel that in addition to having a fake conversation, it really is an attempt to undermine my sanity and intelligence....like i'm not going to remember i'm the one who said it in the first place. i'd say it was a mistake, but it honestly happens way too often, and usually to me. she knows what she's doing. i've told her that if she is really dying to have a conversation with me, but she just doesn't know what to say, i'd rather her talk about something dumb, but not mine. ilke point at a tree out the window and say, "i like trees." i can have a conversation about that.

oh oh oh. i almost forgot...she also asks questions she already knows the answer to..not just stuff like you described, but way more obvious. about 2 years ago, so she was almost 13, it was thanksgiving, and she walked up to grandma, pointed to the turkey, and said, "what's that." really? a minimum of 4 thanksgivings with us, with a turkey every year? grandma lost it and was like, "REALLY, it's a TURKEY! you KNOW that!" lol. i about died laughing.....but everyone else in the family is fed up with the fake convos as well.

[peregrinerose]

I'm truly sorry for trespassing in this thread...

[lucyjoy]

I haven't posted here because I'm at a point where I find reading this depressing.

However, I find the previous post really annoying.

Parenting my children left lasting scars. I never knew I could hurt so much or that life would be so painful.

Just because people are venting the frustration of parenting a difficult child everyday, does not make them unempathetic.

Only the child is allowed to have feelings? What about when the child is 20? 30? Our feelings are still wrong?

There is no way to shut this off. It feels horrible to raise a child who throws hate at you all day long.

We work really hard trying to reach our children's hearts, trying to teach them to trust, trying to help them let go of the truama or at least learn to use it to help rather then hurt themselves. We know it's painful for them, but it is also painful for us. I think it's unfair to expect us to just sit back, hold the pain in and say nothing.

I know people who's lives have been ruined by the lies of a child, sick or not, it has the same outcome. Jail is jail.

So, my vent is that people expect us to never think about ourselves, never feel hurt, never express our pain and to excuse all our kids do because they were abused

[kretzklan]

I always appreciate hearing your input...but you have to understand how insane our worlds are on a daily basis. I don't think anyone here is looking for gratitude, we are hoping for the smallest amount of growth...maybe just an hour without trying to break us in one way or another. It helps to vent sometimes. It's not like we are sitting at home telling our kids all this. I know that my kids have trouble feeling emotions and expressing them...I get that totally (sympathy...not empathy because I haven't 'been' there)...however, I don't feel that holding them to a standard of behavior is a bad thing. I can't simply say that everyday it's ok for them to lie, cheat, steal, do physical harm (to themselves or others), manipulate, con, etc, etc...because then I wouldn't be holding up MY end of the deal. Ok, maybe they didn't want me or ask for me...but life gave me to them and vice versa. I'm working my *** off to help them and expecting a normal conversation from time to time doesn't seem that out of line. So, when I haven't had one in FOUR years...yes, I need to vent.
I'm sorry for what happened to you and just as I feel about my children...the folks that did that should pay, pay, pay...I'm tired of my kids thinking they have to pay. Their birth parents threw them away...I just wish they didn't have to keep throwing themselves away every day.
From reading all your posts, both about your childhood and about the child you are raising now...I would never lable you as 'uncaring'...so you were able to heal. Thankfully someone cared about you - as you mentioned - even if it wasn't someone in a parental role. I want so badly to be that person for my kids...and I hope that someday they can say things you say. That they get what happened to them and understand why their daily lives weren't what other kids daily lives were...

[mommytoEli]

i am glad that you posted. it is always nice to know what the other side is thinking. but as hard as it is for you to read what we write, it is hard for us to live with what is happening. yes we chose it. it doesn't make it less difficult. when we come here to vent, we are venting. i didn't start the thread for the purpose of posting all the hopeful things in a RAD child, i wanted to post the realities. and these are our realities, those are yours. there are obviously 2 completely different sides here. but the bottom line is if i don't get to talk out what happens in my home, and meet up with other parents that experience the same thing, i have less patience for my daughter. i NEED to see that what happens in my home, is "normal" for a home with a RAD child. she is bent on making me crazy, and when i see i am not the only one, it does allow me to take a breath and realize it isn't me, it is RAD. when i can step back and not take every attack of hers as personal, i believe it makes me a better mom who can parent a RAD child another day.

Truly trying to wrap your brains around what the kids' perspectives are may help

i think most of us can say that we have. i understand her horrible life before she came to live with me. what happend to her should not have happened. it is awful. it does not make the behaviors any less difficult to deal with. life is hard. i am frustrated. my biggest source of encouragement comes from other parents who have been there done that are still alive. when i come here and see these posts, i know i can keep going.

[kretzklan]

I want to make sure I came across as I meant to.. I DO LOVE hearing what you have to say - it gives my children a voice of some kind that I can't always get in therapy and certainly don't get in daily life. It gives me hope. I just want to protect the rights of the RAD parents to vent and laugh and tease and share...we need it. The isolation of raising RAD kids can sometimes be the worst part. So, I know that no one here is trying to hurt you...but I can see why it might. Just know that we need this the same as our children need us to be sane...this helps!

[crick]

Peregrinerose - I'm sure everyone here thinks about these things all the time...likely 24-7 in fact. That they know their kids can't be like other kids and how hard the road to survival and hopefully healing is.

Sometimes though even parents need an outlet for their own struggles and feelings. And that would be most all parents, regardless if their child has RAD or not. Venting and having a safe outlet to do that in does not mean there is no empathy for their children. I see it the opposite actually. By having the place to share with others who truly "get it" from their perspective, they can relieve some stress and anger to keep on parenting their children.

[kretzklan]

Now, my addition for the day. YES...both my kids do the repeating thing. They'll even repeat each other. DD got busted for this last year at school. She couldn't ever think of a question - so she started repeating the questions that were just asked. We are leaving on vacation tomorrow...they all know where we are going and when we are leaving yet they both asked me this morning "why do you have the suitcases up from the basement?"...there just aren't words.