[fin]

I can use some help, my 9 yr old son has stolen things, and then denies he has done it.

He usually steals from school, and then gets caught. He now has lost recess for the rest of the week. WHen he gets home from school, he said to me that he doesn't want to talk about it. He knows he shouldn't steal. On one of his projects for school, he had to write a 'family value' and he wrote "not to lie"

I have talked to the school, that if he 'earns' anything, which he does sometimes, that they need to tell me what he earned, I dont want to find it in his back pack, because I will automatically think he has stolen that. Does anyone have any suggestions on how I can handle this? What have you guys done with your little 'stealers' and 'liers'? I'm sure I'm not the only one who had to deal with this.

[lucyjoy]

Stealing is a tough one. I'd let the school handle school. My stealers owed double the amount for what they stole-returned or not.

As for liars well, I try to make it their problem. I just assume they are always lying. And if I can't trust them, they need to stay close to me. Bummer for them.

I have a friend who lied to her kid. "We're having ice cream" and then served vegitables. With an "Oh, I was just kidding(her daughters lying reasoning)

[etaag]

Nancy Thomas addressed this one way that I thought was clever. She said she asked if the child wanted ice cream (something they liked). The child said yes. Nancy went and fixed only herself a bowl and started eating it. When the child asked where their bowl was, she said "Oh, I'm sorry. I thought you were lying. I didn't know you were telling the truth."

[Lorraine123]

My daughter is no longer in school, but when she was, I tried to back out of happenings there. You can't control what happens in the classroom, so let the school system deal with it. If he steals at school, they need to determine the consequence.

My daughter is a stealer and a liar. Her world is very limited because of that.

I give her few opportunities to steal and her room is quite bare, so she would have no where to hide stolen stuff.

As far as lying, I try not to ask her questions where she can lie. I never ask "why" or "did you", because I will not get the truth, so why bother.

I have heard or read that stealing and lying are two of the last things for our children to let go of. Until they feel really, really safe and can trust us, they will continue to steal and lie. Not really what you wanted to hear I'm sure.

Its hard because these things go against all morality that we have been taught. I know how tough it is.

[bandareed]

I agree completely with letting the school handle what happens at school.

I took a similar approach to lying as others have stated. I heard or read about it somewhere. I told my dd that it's important for family values to "match". And since she didn't want to match my values in regards to honesty, that I would do her a favor and match her. For a few weeks, I did a lot of "We're going to go/have/do whatever" (something she wanted) but then do something different. When she protested I would simply reply "Oh, I was lying". It took a few weeks of me "matching" her lying, but I did see a difference in her behavior.

That being said, my dd still lies...a lot, mostly about nonsense things. It's automatic to her. She is much better about not lying about the big stuff, but I think that is because I have trained myself, not her. As Lorraine stated, I try to not ask any questions that will result in a lie.

Also, there have been many times in which my dd wants me to believe her and if there isn't proof, she knows that my reply will be to calmly state that because she does lie so much, that I have to assume that she is lying now. Like Lucy said, "Bummer" for her.

As far as stealing goes, I keep my dd's room and backpack pretty bare. I also keep all her clothing in my room (for other reasons). If something shows up in our house that is not ours, I know (usually).

[AmyAnne]

My son used to make up stories about what he had done in previous families. I finally told him we did not approve of lying, but I wanted him to use his imagination. So if he wanted to make up stories, to begin them with "once upon a time" so I'd know we were imagining, and I'd play along.

Sometimes when he gets going on an obviously fictitious story, I'll say "Did this happen once upon a time?" and he'll usually nod.

[Kansas Girl]

ditto to what everyone else has said. We went through a period of stealing money from mom, so I still keep my purse locked up when I'm at home. Finally one day, I don't remember the exact conversation (we were driving down the street, just him and me!), but R told me he couldn't steal from me anymore because it made him feel bad/icky/didn't feel right (something like that).

I agree - the lying must be the last to go - it's just so automatic. I call him on it - or doublecheck with DH for verification before I believe R. It seems like it's just little stuff now - like did you brush your teeth, etc. So when he's actually being truthful, he gets the compliment for being truthful and doing the right thing. He seems to be making progress. R knows it's a bad behavior and that mom and dad don't trust him because of it - he still has to prove that he can be trustworthy to us and it seems like he wants to do that.

Fran

[ajjhmf]

I do double payback for stealing (or purposeful property damage). I also do in person apologies to the victim(s).

Lying is a loss of trust. Always. That usually means close to home activities and doubling check things and so on.