[rindava]

I could just cry and cry.....I thought we'd found something M could fit into

he is back to all the old crap, the growling, acting like he is too retarded to follow basic rules, doing very gross things, and pretending his finger is a gun....i really don't know why that bothers people around here soo much since there is sooo much military... M had not gun toys, not violent anything, and he isn't allowed to play video games..

i had just paid for the last 3 weeks of camp, and bam, it is so bad he is probably getting kicked out.....I was hoping to use this against the school when they say he can't do large group activities....

I honestly don't know what to do with the kid. I spent 1/2 the day trying to find a therapist as everyone has stopped taking medicaid around here, and no luck....I have a call into mental retardation services to try and see if they can help us any.

[qs mom]

I really don't have any suggestions or advice - just know, you aren't alone, although it certainly feels that way.

I don't know you, or your son, or situation, but I do know what my little guy is capable of. He was thrown out of public school Pre-K after a couple weeks. In fact, he was sent home after only an hour during the first week.

He returns to the same school for kindergarten in September. I'm so nervous. OK, I'll say, it - I'm scared.

Just keep up the fight for your kids. Try getting in touch with Medicaid and ask them for a list of participating providers. Maybe that would help.

[rindava]

I think our county house a good summary of guidelines
http://www.vbschools.com/speced.html#process

it is federal law and is the same everywhere in the USA, but in the 3 states I've worked in I've seen some little differences....basically the school system can do anything they want to do accomadate for your child's needs, but you have to fight like heck....

I can see head start kicking a child out, but they should have refered you to special ed......

Everytime we get something good going for my son it is gone at the end of the school year and we seem to have to start over in Sept.

[qs mom]

Oh, this wasn't Head Start that threw him out . . . it was the regular public school program.

Fortunately, CPSE got him into an integrated program with Head Start and a special ed/behavior mod program. I wasn't thrilled at first, because his behavior is secondary to his SI/attachment. But it's been a GODSEND for us.

[rainbowmom]

As a parent of a special needs child I can tell you that it is imperative that your child be placed in special education for either emotionally disturbed or behaviorially disturbed. While labels can be frightening, those very labels will protect your child. A child in special ed has way more rights than those of a child not. It is also your right as a parent to request your child be tested. DO NOT take no for an answer! Also, check in your community, there are often advocacy groups who will help you out. The school district in which my child lived in prior to placement with me is currently being sued because of their negligent actions of ignoring his needs. He was in kindergarten, and spent most of his day in the third grade class with a male teacher (it here that I will say that my son was abused by his birth father, so he was terrified of males). No child should be forced into compliance through coercion, especially our special needs kids. Anyway, I tend to digress, march into that school like you own the place, demand an equal education for your child, and don't take no for an answer. Look into IDEA 97 (it is the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act), it should give you more comfort and confidence with your battle and the public schools.
Happy Energy Sent to You!

[Barksum]

Rinda: Take what you like, don't be offended by what you don't want. I'm just throwing some ideas out.

How long has M lived with you? Does M do these kinds of behaviors at home? Is he developmentally in step with his chronological age?

Have you considered (I know, I'm unconventional) not sending him to K this year but "holding him back"? I know that for many people holding a child back is controversial, but most agree that being held back at the K level is better than at later school levels. Is there a particular reason why he must go to K this year? Perhaps, and this is just an idea, he does not feel secure enough to be out of the home yet, or his ability to cope with social situations is not developed enough at this stage of the game.

We've had conflicting recommendations from "experts" regarding our son. One, after telling us that our son was developmentally behind his chronological age, said that it was time to have him learn to deal with other authority figures and how to function in a peer-group setting. This expert defined 'peer' as those children who were chronologically our son's age. Remember the dysmaturity thing, about being behind his chronological age? This was NOT a good idea; and for those who need expert support for parental decisions, we found 2 experts who've met and worked with our son who agree with us. When we even considered sending him to outside lessons that were not one-on-one we just shuddered and couldn't do it. There is no way that our son could have done well in a setting such as the psychiatrist suggested. It just wasn't going to happen at that stage of the game.
For us this has boiled down to not allowing our son to spend time in peer-only group situations that are not family oriented. Our family does some things together socially, with other families who have sibling groups in a wide variety of ages. We went to family camp together. We supervise what he does and where he goes. Don't get me wrong -- we do have respite care, but ONLY with other family members or people who know our son well. We do take breaks. We NEED breaks! But we also do much of everything we do with all of our children in tow.


We homeschool our son partly because I KNOW he would not be able to function in a traditional classroom setting. Additionally I know how fragile he is emotionally and I don't wish to expose him to teachers and others who will trample him with their impatience and lack of tolerance for his little quirks. This is not to say that I'm always a paragon of virtue, but I am his mother and we do have a reciprocal, trusting relationship. Additionally, since his special needs would be labelled as emotional/behavioral we knew that he would be in a classroom with other children who would have rages or a variety of other issues. This was not something I was willing to promote as being in my son's best interest. I knew he would pick up on their behaviors (he is a follower) and we'd be dealing with a whole 'nother set of issues before long. Additionally, he would only be home for about 3 waking hours per day if we sent him to school. There was no way we could work on his family issues in that space of time.

With this laid back, unconventional approach this particular son has done very well. His individual needs are met, he has friends with whom he has good relationships, and he is making academic progress. Most importantly for me (and him, I suppose) is that I can see overall progress with the areas where I know he struggles. He's not without ongoing issues, but they are, in general, becoming more managable for him. Notice that I say "becoming more managable for him". This means that he's in the process of learning, we haven't arrived - yet. There are ups and downs. He's a kid and all kids go through times of more need; he's also a kid with some special needs, so the ups may be a little smaller and the downs seem a little more down when viewed in comparison with the norms associated with childhood. I just had to step back and see what I could do that was outside of the box.

The big and shocking thing for me was that I didn't really introduce formal academics until about 6 months ago. Honest. We did alot of reading together, lots of enriching stuff around with the family, and a varitey of different kinds of games, but very little book work. He did do mazes, dot to dots, that kind of thing. PreK-K level activities. But the main focus and the things we really worked on were the social graces. Teaching him to be able to recognize when he was going to lose it and things he could do instead of tantrumming. How to sit at the table during meals. (We're still working on that....) How to be polite, listen to directions, cheerfully do the chores he is able to do at home. (Still working on the cheerful part.) Shaking hands when introduced. Looking at a person's face when they would speak to him. That kind of thing. I can see that it is starting to sink in, and so we've started doing reading, writing and math now. He's doing well...but we only do very small bits at a time. I had to recognize that it was ok for him to be "behind" his peers, as long as he was learning well what he was being taught.

This isn't the way for everyone, but it is one way that can work, particularly for special needs children.

[rindava]

If I were q's mom I would also say homeschooling is the way to go, and get him into SI occupational therapy and spend as much time with him as possible

My son is going to be 13 in October and was tripple promoted from 4th to 7th grade (not my idea, but I am sick of fighting for someone who doesn't care anyway).... My son is very, very RAD. i have had him 4 years now. I spent the last 2 years working with attachment therapy and off from work, most of the past 3 school years he was homeschooled....

I have to work at this point because I am a single parent and since M is not making much progress and he gets on everyones nerves sooo much back to school he goes. I think we have some kind of a better understanding with the school system over M though. I have also signed him back up for mental retardation services, even though I don't think he is retarded at all, but it is one of his favorite RAD games to play.... We did probably find him a regular therapist to work on the sex abuse issues and hopefully through the MR services some one to work on other issues or at least spend time with him....

I think homeschool can really be helpful to many of these kids. In our case with this child he ends up being a lot of work and never does much of anything. For example he will sit 1/2 the day because it is too hard to hold a pencil, even when you drop the pencil issue and go on to try and do something else...

he can read, probably on at least 5th grade level...but he hasn't made much progress in any other area...

he spent about 3 months of last school year in a 3 student 2 adult ED class which was wonderful....If trouble starts in middle school I'll probably just let them send him back to MR class or to day treatment... the program that runs days treament is bad, so MR class is probably where he'll end up.....If I take a look at it realistically he really at this point probably needs that level of supervision anyway. He is bright and with at least average IQ, but has only tested there 1 time......He is able to behave like a normal 12 year old, but those times are few and far between. He seems happiest getting the neg. attention he gets by acting off the wall, crazy, and mentally slow. He often switches his behavior to suite the pet peves of who ever he is around. People who have mental retardation do no do that. Also his behaviors come and go depending on who he is around, for example his speech is basically fine, but one of the students in that 3 student class had a articulation problem and M developed the same exact problem that suddenly resolved itself 3 days after school was out, amazing....

I have given enough speechs about jail (for the sneaking away and getting into unlocked cars, etc... behaviors) and mental hospitals (for the fire setting, etc...)to him and I am not even going to do that any more....I just try to enjoy the good times and and ride out the bad.

[kamamsm]

Rinda- I thought mine was the only rad kid who wouldn't do schoolwork. She pretends not to know words or how to add 4 + 3 -- stupid stuff- to drive me crazy. She even admits doing it. We home educate too. My other kids excel - at least they try. This drives me wild because education is so important to me! She's brilliant. Could be anything she wants & yet won't try at all! Had to be kept back in the second grade! ( she belongs in the fourth) Its soooooooo frustrating!!!!!! But what can you do? Noone can make a child "learn" even when you know they are capable. If anyone has a suggestion I'll try it.

[dadfor2]

hi rinda

first day of school, you should ask for an IEP meeting....bring someone with you.

if he does need special education....then if they give you a hard time, you will have someone on your side.

as for homework from school.....i know this sounds crazy...but why bother..(i know i know)...but for us, the important thing that we can do is parent our children.

for us, with our kids, its not worth the battle everynight for homework...both my kids are special needs...so homework is not our priority.

what happened when they put him in 4 to 7th grade...what was the reasoning behind it...his age?

he might need to be in a smaller classroom...the stimulation of alot of kids, might be to much for him...at least thats what happened to my little one.

i know its hard, thats why im throwing out what we experienced.

have you applied for DMH services, instead of MR services....not sure where the mental retardation stuff is coming in....you mentioned he acts that way, but he is not...so im not sure what the school is also saying.

if they felt he was MR, why on earth did the promote him in a regular school....im a little confused on all the MR stuff you posted.

DMH (dept of mental health) has a lot of services, much more then DSS..im not sure about DMR....

anyway, my point, is try to find an advocate that can go with you to these meetings...there are programs where people actually go with the parents to these IEP meetings...

is he in counseling now?..thats someone that might be able to help you....

the school system if messed up...they can offer alot, but dont want to pay..plus sometimes they can be intimiadating..so its important to bring someone who is working with you and not against you....

[dadfor2]

rin,

one more thing...my son on his IEP due to behaviors and 'catch up' we asked for 'an extended school year'...which basically means, the school is responsible on sending him to camp. they have to pay for it too.

this one is not easy to get, but if you feel that next year, he still needs help with his 'social skills' then you can ask for this.

again, bring someone with you...its nice to have someone who is not so wrapped up with our daily day to day battles.

[rindava]

public schools can do anything they want to to help a special needs student...

Out of the 12 or so times M has had is IQ tested all but one time came back with scores in the MR area from 42-74...so 11 out of 12 times he tested mentally retarded from mild to almost severely. one time he got a total IQ of 107, ther person giving the test was a young nice looking woman who M thought was "hot" as he put it and it was at a local christian college and all he had to do to tick her off was say minior swear words, so he didn't need to play stupid/

Our community services board mental health program is total crap and they also run the public school's day treatment (I worked with them on 3 of my foster sib groups and every time it was bad....they were the ones who said a 5 year old boy having full on sex with a 4 year old and 1 1/2 year old sisters was normal for unsupervised children....and I can give you many other example) so we stay away from them like the pleg.

M has an IEP and is in self contained special ed. they also grade place here. Up until the last day of school it was my understanding they were puting him in 5th grade at elementary school in the wonderful 3 student emotionally disturbed class with 2 staff member. We had an IEP that day and they dropped the boom on me and are placing him at his age level in a cross categorical class (LD/ED)...

He is currently served under other health impaired for ADHD and Autism (no one who has evaluated him in the past 3 years thinks he is autistic, but hey it keeps him out of the TMR class with his 42 IQ points) In the TMR class kids do things like learn to go potty and brush their teeth.

Also the school thinks I am nuts and M is retarded....but he has had a few teachers say things like, he is smartest mentally retarded person I know...and his ED teacher last year thinks he is severely learning disabled and not ED or MR (he isn't learning disabled)...

Most mental health therapist do not like to work with mentally retarded people because they think they fail to benefit from that kind of therapy....Just as the school can make a case that a mentally retarded child is working up to their potiential in say hand writing and cut OT services...

I have seen parents fight and get just about everything under the sun either through special ed or FAPT teams though. SO if you have the time and energy you can usually win a big part of your case.

[rainbowmom]

Rindava,
How about 501? I'm not totally familiar with it, but I know of a few kids who qualify for that and get help through that program. Also, I was reading what happened to you at the last IEP meeting for your son; the school can't just change his diagnosis on any whimm. You are also protected under No Child Left Behind, it put an end to social promotion. Has the school ever given you a copy your Parental Rights? I work for a federal school, and any time a parent of a child with an IEP is spoken to, they receive a copy of this little book. I am so sorry that this is happening to your child. Keep fighting. Peace to you.

[rindava]

M is served under Other Health Impaired (OHI) for ADHD and a past diagnosis of PDD and autistic spectrum disorder because the school district here kept dumping him in classes with students with moderate levels of mental retardation what used to be TMR (trainable mentally retarded) 4 years ago our state stopped spliting certification for teachers of students with MR by the levels on TMR and EMR (educatable mental retardation or mild mental retardation) the state govenment did this to make teacher certification for teachers less trouble and it has resulted in all MR students getting dumped together in some districts and many are just dumping ED/LD/EMR kids together if their behavior holds out (my son's behavior always becomes a problem)

I have fought and fought over many different issues and I am sick of fighting ...they never really do what they say they will anyway.

504 plans are great for students with mild disablities.