[Howdy]

My fd (almost 9 yrs old) is very controlling and bossy due to being in a bad family situation until she was 7 yrs old.

She is having social problems and is feeling very bad about it. Lately she's been giving her snack money to kids at the day camp to try to make them like her and play with her. She told me that kids only play with her until they know her, then they don't like her and won't play with her. She told me that when she'd come back to me and returned to school here, that her friend told her that when the teacher announced her imminent return to the class, they all groaned. She says when there was a 'game' at the lunch table of showing hands to see who liked each person, no one raised their hands to show they liked her.

Is there anything I can do to help her???

[spaypets]

Howdy, can you role play situtations where she can practice not being bossy? Can you watch her playing with kids then give ideas on what she could do better? Does she feel empathy? Perhaps explaining how her actions make other kids feel might help.

[michellemartin]

Though it's drastic, maybe change schools? Though not right away, I'd do that mid year. no I'm not crazy . Combine that with counseling so she can increase her self confidence?

The Help me Be Good book series is really a nice set of books that goes through social situations where kids might be bossy, mean, lie, steal, all sorts of things. Though theyr'e designed for kids up to about age 10 ish, maybe they'd be something to look into about her bossyness.

And I'd never move Karma (my daughter) at the beginning of a school year, I'd do it in the middle.
Here's why, in the middle of the school year (say at the semester) she's the only new kid. Everyone wants to know who she is. Groups of girls usually "fight" over the new girl. At the beginning of the year all the new faces blend in and a kid can feel soooo totally alone. (My parents moved me (divorce situation) and I didnt make friends for over a full year) (then moved again in HS and again had a ton of trouble finding where I "belonged" and fell into a bad group).

[MissyB9479]

Aw, that is heartbreaking. I think the fact that she recognizes she is having a problem keeping friends and that she wants to change will be a good start. It might be a good idea for her to look at a few of her classmates and identify why they are popular and have lots of friends. I'm sure that some traits will start to be apparent in many of the people with the most friends. They are probably polite, know how to share, are good listeners, etc. These are skills that people are not born with but have to learn. So then it's just a matter of helping her learn them which means lots and lots of practice.

One "game" I remember for helping to build listening and conversation skills was "interview". One person is the interviewer and their job is to ask good questions and listen closely to the answers to learn as much as possible about the other person. Also point out good examples of friendship behavior when you see her doing it or when you see it on television or in books.

[crick]

Ouch! That's harsh....no one raising their hands for her, poor kid!

My dd is bossy too. And yes...she had some hard lessons this past school year. We had a lot of talks about what it means to be friends. Don't think she really had a clue, just figured like her brothers, they'd do what she asked, played what games she wanted and exactly the way she wanted and everyone would be happy. Really didn't understand "oh, if I keep telling them what to do all the time, they won't want to play with me anymore." Or even thinking "gosh, some people don't like my ideas, I can't believe it!" So yes...you have to teach, teach, and teach some more. Does take time to teach someone how to socialize and play appropriately when they didn't learn how to do that in the younger developmental stages of their lives.

Along with that...do you have playdates at home? Just some one on one time with another child does help. And under your supervision, it's easier to quietly point out "oh, but maybe Susan doesn't want to play the game that way. Let's see what Susan would like to do?"

Is she in Brownies or sports? Groups like that have helped my daughter learn to get a long better with others and at the same time, see what it's like to belong to something. Confidence goes a long way. Eventhough my daughter is bossy & has the need to constantly be in control, it doesn't mean she has all the confidence in the world either.

Lastly, I've learned something over this last year....one day Patty will be her best friend and the next day Patty is mean and she's never playing with her again! Now Susan is her best friend. And on it goes. Part of that is the school age drama too, not just your daughter.

[J.Ro]

Poor girl, that's a tough situation.

I agree about one on one time with other kids. When E. has had girlfriends visit, it's amazing the great peer guidance that happens. Once she was telling a story to her neighborhood best friend about how she and her school best friend get in fights and then say they won't be friends anymore. Her neighborhood friend responded with "That's so second grade!" Well I could see a shadow cross E.'s face and her friend continued, "you see, it's like if you and I got in a fight and we told each other that we wouldn't be friends anymore, well, it's like your in second grade. It's really stupid." I was sitting in the front seat doing big cheers on the inside.

It also allows you to monitor the situation and gently guide when you notice bossiness.

It sounds like she's reaching out to you for help. Is she in counseling, is it something that she might feel comfortable role playing with her counselor? E. does much of that with hers and it definitely helps.

Stay strong, it really hurts to see our kids outside the circle.
J.Ro

[lucyjoy]

Maybe I'm a skeptic-did you verify these stories with the teacher? While the groaning thing may have happened, I cannot see any teacher doing the raise your hands thing. They usually know when a kid isn't liked.

Role playing for social skills is still an excellent idea as well as finding something she likes that she can be proud of. (sports, crafts, legos-anything that she has control of)

[crick]

Lucy - lol! I hadn't even thought of that....just figured the kids made up the game at lunch while teachers are not around. The cat's away...and all that.

[lucyjoy]

Didn't think of that either-could very well have been a kids mean game to make her feel bad. I'd be doing some checking in any case as that would put teachers on alert if mean behavior was occurring.

[spaypets]

Michelle, I respectfully disagree about the timing when you change schools. My parents moved me in the middle of first grade and I instantly became the unpopular kid -- something that lasted until we moved in 7th grade. This time I started the school year in a school that was new to everyone and got friends I kept for life.

If a child doesn't have good social skills, that added attention will shortly change to negative attention. But if everyone is feeling their way with a new teacher and new class, a new kid is more likely to find a kindred spirit.

[ajjhmf]

Aw, the poor thing.

I just want to chime it that I would definately notify the school. Not just her teacher, but also the principal. What your describing is usually defined as bullying and schools take a pretty hard line about that these days. I know something like that happened to my friends daughter at the end of last year. They had the principal and school psychologist come into the class and they all did role playing and saw a video and such about bullying. Now, these kids were in kindergarten so what grown-ups say goes alot further, but the kids in class did respond and things got better.

Another thought would be to sit down with your daughter and figure out if it really is ALL the kids or just some. Girls tend to run in packs and I bet she's not the only one being treated like this. There may be some other kids on the 'outside' that she could be friends with.

My son is also delayed socially. He's much better with 3-4 year olds than kids his own age. We try and have him do things with his peers, but then I also have several friends whose kids are more J's speed. I make playdates with them to give J a break from the social pressure.

Blessings,
Jenny

[wenrl]

Our daughter is also prone to social issues, although she is getting much better.

I think that she finds comfort in being a martyr ("none of the kids like me. They are all mean. They always tattle on me for no reason.") She often complains about being treated wrongly. However, when we go to school events, girls run up and hug her and they all filled out forms to come to her new housewarming party and have been calling to make sure they are invited and we didn't forget. I think a lot of it is her projecting her own low self-esteem in others feelings. She will also accuse other girls of doing the same things that I know she has trouble with, like being bossy or making up rules in the middle of the game. Sometimes she'll say they won't play with her for no reason. We'll talk about what she may have done to upset them, but she absolutely will not accept any responsibility for peer problems. I blame it on being 8 years old and hope it will improve with age.

One thing that I've done that has helped T. though is to point out my own social issues and what I need to do to handle it. For example, I am a designer with a degree in fine art, so when I do an art project with the family, I get a little superior complex and want to be in charge of everything and tell everyone exactly what they should make and how they should work. I even annoy myself with that. So, I'll tell T. that I need to keep my eyes on my own work and have my own space when we are working, because I get too bossy with art projects and it isn't fair to the rest of the family. Seeing me admit that I have an issue I need to deal with has helped her realize that we can admit our problems and find ways to control them, so that everyone can get along. When we have game and movie night, we make sure everyone gets a turn to pick the game and we model being good sports about winning or losing. This has helped, but it does take time.

I don't know how to say this in a way that sounds at all decent, but I also remember how shallow girls were at her age. I try to make sure our daughter always has nice clothes and her hair is as cute as our time in the morning allows. It's not the priorities we want to teach our kids and in fact we advize her that it's what's on the inside that counts, but having a cute new outfit, hairdo or a little sparkly nail polish never hurts in the little girl world. It makes her feel better about herself and gets the other little girls interested. Shallow and wrong I know, but it helps.

[Howdy]

Thanks for all the replies. I will try to find the Help Me To Be Good/Let's Talk About books at the library. I told her therapist, but I'm not sure where the social problems will be in the therapists priorities since there are also anger issues and the upcoming adoption, etc.

I will try the interviewing game. And yesterday she invited a girl to come for a play date but the day/time isn't determined yet. I am not really looking forward to it, because when she had a school friend sleep over a couple months ago, it was a hideous experience for me, with my kid being selfish and defiant, and certainly no way for me to quietly clue her in about her behavior because she didn't seem to want to be a good friend.

I feel so sorry for her though. I think I've reached a new height of attachment because now if something is going to hurt or disappoint her, I get terribly sad about it, in the past I felt much more objective and detached. And I worry about her future if she doesn't learn to feel good about herself and not be willing to give things to people to get them to like her. I can just imagine how that is going to play out in Junior High (3 yrs in the future) when she starts to be into boys. (She's already into boys, but not in "that way" yet).

[dadfor2]

howdy,

i thought the same thing as lucyjoy...

however, i would go the school in the afternoon and check before talking to the teacher.

my son says that stuff to me all the time, and he is very social and has friends.

i did go....and he was fine, playing with other kids like 'normal' kids do...

im not saying she is lying either...alot has to do with interpertation...

my son does have some self estemm issues due to his past, and what he might percieve as 'nobody likes me' might be one child saying 'no' to him....and its magnified a thousand times.

i know it must be hard..but for me, i had to actually see it...

my first sign was that no one called me about him having a hard time making friends....more about behaviors then friends.. ...but thats another thread...lol

most kids are very forgiving..and a kid that a child doesnt like, might be their best friend the next day....

kids are fickle.....lol.

but i would check...but dont let her see you...find out when recess is, then spy on her....

i have a boy, so it could be different, girls are more 'one friend' orientated then boys, who have 'lots of friends'....