[dadfor2]

im a little confused. I thought she said she didnt think her child has RAD. Why should she be worring about how too get treatment for her child with RAD when the child doesnt fit they symtoms. maybe i missed something.

BOth of our boys were dx with RAD and quite a few other Dx because of the past abuse.

However, when i look at the symtoms of RAD, he only fits two of them. When i go under ADHD/ BIPolar, i feel were getting a little closer.

I talked to the DSS/social worker, and she said that most kids in the foster care who had trauma history are DX with RAD when in fact only a small percentage of them actually have it.

The more i read on this forum, it seems alot of other parents are finding that their children arent fitting into this RAD catergory. So im wondering if she is on target with DX being overly used.

Basically, not every child who came from an abusive home have RAD. I would go with your gut instinct on this, we are the parents, we see these children more then anyone.

Doctors make mistakes, im sure you heard stories with someone going into the doctors office with some symptom then getting released with a bottle of asprin and that there fine, and then poof, there dead.

doctors/ therapists/ make mistakes as we all do, you just need to be cautious. If you really feel your child doesnt have it, then he probably doesnt.

im a nobody when it comes to DX my sons, but i know my sons better then anyone, more then a doctor in a 1/2 hour session. IF you feel the doctor gave you a mis DX, then seek out a second opinion and then a third if you have too.

dadfor2

[lucyjoy]

Part of the problem lies in lumping attachment issues, attachment disorder, and RAD all together. Treatment wise, you handle it the same way(just varies by intensity). There is no way a child can go through foster care and not at least have issues with attachment. Just my opinion.

[Dr. Art]

Generally, the diagnosis of attacment disorder or RAD is often under-diagnoses as few mental health professionals have actually had training and real experience in this area. I'd generally recommend using someone who is a member of ATTACh www.attach.org as they've had to meet specific criteria for training and experience.

The epidemiological research and clinical research does show that the majority (vast majority) of children with chronic histories of maltreatment have attachment disorders and meet the criteria for RAD...but not all. Therefore, it is important to get a good assessment and not just read checklists are try to self-diagnose your child. Since the treatments that are effective for ADD and such are not effective for Attachment disorders, accurate diagnosis is vital to getting the right treatment (only attachment-based treatment such as Dyadic Developmental Psychotherapy) is effective for such children.

[dadfor2]

Dr art,

i do agree that you cannot dx a child by just reading symptoms from a book. i also agree that alot of kids have issues around attachment who enter the foster care system who had histories of abuse, who wouldnt, i know i would, alot of it has to do with trust.

But time does heal old wounds with proper therapy. I dont know if my children have RAD, im pretty sure they dont. Why just the other day i gave them each a betta fish, and they carry this stupid little plastic bowl with them where ever they go, they named them and they treat them like there their (babies). Its very interesting to watch, how they pamper them, they do it with thier stuff animals too. Both love hugs and touch. Both at this point iniate the hugs.

basically, i know they have some attachment issues, but when i read things on RAD, they just seem to fit these kids at all. I know i have asked for some advice about my older child, and alot of responces seem to head towards RAD. To be honest, it does get frustrating. There is something definitly wrong with my seven yr old, and id hate to think treating him for something that he is just seem to have.

The other question i have is, if there are only a few RAD specialists, then who is DX all these kids with RAD?

dadfor2

[lucyjoy]

My first intro to RAD was a diagnosis by a doctor who was not an attachment specialist. He did know what was wrong with my child, but couldn't treat him.

Also, as for the animals and stuffed animals, my son that wanted to kill people is great and loving with our animals and loved to cuddle stuffed anilmals. He said animals were smarter then people and that's why people had to die instead. (He's on the extreme end.)

Also, RAD children will often initiate hugs(their terms). It's how they react when you touch them, hug them, make loving eye contact with them that matters.

Attachment is a continuum and is ALL about Trust. Babies learn to trust as infants when thy are well cared for. Their moms learn what each cry means and the child knows how each cry will be answered. A neglected/abused child will not get the same answer for a hungry cry over and over. He'll get nothing or sporatic responses. This tells him the world is unsafe. If he survives and continues break after break in foster care, it reinforces the unsafeness of the world. The well cared for child continues to learn to trust and goes through wanting to please parents and eventually develops a conscience he can use to regulate himself. The neglected/abused child is still stuck not being able to figure out how to get his needs met. He knows that noone can be trusted, so he does what he needs to get by.
This is one of the reasons these children often so and say things that don't make any sense. They can't get from point a to point b. You get RAD
A child who maybe got good care for a few years then maybe mom got sick or died or something and the child goes into care. Mom left them, wether she could control it of not, so they began to question their system of trust. Each move adds to this lack of trust. This is not RAD, its issues with attachment or, could be attachment disorder, depending upon the circumstances that led them there.
Attachment therapy or attachment parenting will NOT harm a child even if you felt that wasn't the problem. A lot of the techniques used are also helpful for SID, ODD, PTSD and other things as a lot of children with RAD also have these problems.
Also, in kids with constant movement, Hypervigilence is often misdiagnosed as hyperactivity. One is a learned survival skill, the other is a chemical problem.

[Dr. Art]

You may find the book, Attaching in Adoption very helpful (by Deborah Gray). In addition, if your child does not have RAD and "only" attachment issues, you might also consider Theraplay...it can help fix a "twisted" relationship and inject a lot of fun and joy into things.

Regards

[dadfor2]

lucyjoy

i know you know alot about RAD. Maybe my kids have it. But what i have read, if a child has RAD and doesnt get the proper therapy, their future is pretty bleak.

If there are only a few RAD specialists around, i checked the website, what are we all doing then.

I guess i need to look at my placement of my two kids. yes, they were both DX with RAD, and to be honest, i dont think i can handle the future if they are. We do not have a RAD specialist in our city.

I guess we might be really screwed. maybe your write, maybe my oldest son has RAD and not what i thought it was (ADHD, bipolar).

Oh well, i will see where this goes, but im at my end with this childs issues. It seems from what you wrote, it might be RAD, after all this time, im thinking this kid has attached to us. If it is RAD, then i guess we need to think about if we can handle the future of this child and maybe someone who has better knowledge with RAD would be a better fit.

If we were told these kids defintily had RAD, we probably wouldnt of taken them, due to what ive read. anway, you gave me alot to think about, maybe it is RAD after reading what you wrote, ill have to call the social worker and talk more about this. maybe we are not the write parents for these two kids.

I love these two guys, but your write, there are only a few people that have the knowledge around this issue.

dadfor2

[spaypets]

I know there are people out there who know much more about this than I do, but it occurs to me that one avenue to get funding for his treatment would be through the special education department of your school district, rather than through your private insurance. Is he in school and does he have an IEP? If you can get the therapy mandated as part of his IEP, under federal law the school district has to pay for it.

[lucyjoy]

Dad,
I was going to send you a message the other day, but you don't accept personal messages and I'm not sure what I'm allowed to post. I will be tatally honest with you. If I read a profile with the descriptions you've given of your sons behavior, I'd say he had RAD and treat it as such. These boys are young enough to heal, but will require major parenting changes(I know your a good parent, I mean a different kind of parenting) and you will have to find therapy. Also, they may be better off not together. Could you handle the five year old if the seven year old were placed elsewhere?Nobody like to do that, but sometimes it's best.
Would you be receptive to a therapist that came into your home, evaluated your children, and taught a different parenting? There are people who do this. It's best to find a therapist near you who will participate in this therapy and be able to help you follow up on it. There is a therapist I've used out of Evergreen(use to be in Utah)who travels. She's an MSN,PHD and developed the RADQ. She's also a former RAD child. NOw I'm stuck because I'm not suppose to promote professionals and I don't feel comfortable giving out my email.
If your interested, pm me and I'll see if I can send the info back to you.
I have also used a professional out of New York, but I'm not sure she'd mix with your situation. She has a very different style. It works great for some people, but for others, it's very difficult(I fit the "others" on this one).
As for the horror stories, while they are true, not all RAD kids are that way. They are hard to live with, but most can heal. I have seven "unadoptable" RAD children from disrupted placements.
All but two have healed(they still have issues, but no more then the rest of us). Of the two that haven't, one has a Ted Bundy type diagnosis(although he's made a break through recently)and the other, has permanant brain damage, FAE, and many other hurdles to climb.
The question I always ask parents is, "Are you willing to change your life to save your child?"
If you don't feel you can raise the seven year old, don't feel pressured to. It already sounds to me as if they tried to gloss over information before he came to you.
Tough decision.

[dadfor2]

hi lucyjoy,

well, im not sure how to turn PM off. Didnt even know it was an option. Anyway, as for now, we are handling both boys. We were worried for a while that they were being trauma reactive. BUt they seem to have settled in.

regarding RAD, it all seems so frightening to me.

I know both boys are still in the trust phase. The older boy especially. after one of his tantrums, he had said "am im i going to stay here?" hes petrified of getting placed somewhere else, but he does test the limits. I know he is waiting for me to yell or hit him, but i refuse to do it. however, i know i raised my voice before because he caught me on a real bad day...

but when things are calm, and he is acting 'normal'; and i commnet on well he is doing, he has said "so can i stay here forever" He also stated a few times that if he has to move, he wants his brother to come with him. He does not want to be seperated from his brother. He also has stated that he wants to stay with us forever because his foster mother beats him (which i dont believe, she was crazy, but i dont think she beat him. when i have responded with "your stuck with us" he has the biggest smile on his face and he jumps around.

I think he is going through so much, im sure he is always saying in the back of his mind "will he be here forever? will i be seperated from my brother again?" He is just so hard to figure out.

the good news, with a little magic, i bumped up his neuropsych testing for three weeks, vs 3 month waiting list.

they have a whole clinic in childrens hospital in boston, dedicated to adoptive/foster care kids. Its one of the best childrens hospital in the country.

the original testing we had, the therapist was not that knowledgable on adoptive/foster kids, so it really ended up being a waste of time. Im not going to put this kid on meds, on what if it is this? or what if it is that? I kinda want to know more about whatever they think might be wrong with him before we do the med root. The funny thing is, we actually havnt had an incident in quite a few days, but im sure that will change.

we do love them, and it kills me to watch him sometimes, to think he struggles so much.

dadfor2

[lucyjoy]

Elizabeth Randolph, MSN, PHD A healing Place 303-670-8723

Nancythomasparenting.org also has a parent training team

Marth Welch also travel to or has clients travel to her. Can't find her number at the moment. Bryon Post trained with her also, but he is under his own thing now. He does travel to people. He's got a web site.

Adoption subsidy wil sometimes pay for this type of evaluation and needed intervention, especially since the child's reports indicate attachment disorder.

[Dr. Art]

You should be able to find someone in your region at the website for the Association for the Treatment and Training in the Attachment of Children. I'd not recommend anyone who's not a member of that group. see www.attach.org

Regards

[Dianna]

Dad4two, It is scary when we read about RAD and all the other diagnosis and behaviors that the kids can have. It is right to see the human being behind the diagnosis, as you do. You may think that you can not face RAD or whatever the issues are, but you are doing it right now. I think that there are a lot of parents doing far more than they thought they could right now. And you are one of them. God bless you and best of luck with your sons.

[Dr. Art]

With the right tools and guidance many, most, children can be helped to heal. One only needs to recognize that most often "automatic" parenting does not work (automatic parenting is what we do automatically and is usually based on how we were raised...fine for a child from birth but often inadequate for a child who has expereinced trauma and has various difficulties associated with trauma). One needs to often use "therapeutic" parenting and often a parent needs a guide/advisor/support/therapist to help the family through the process necessary to help their child heal. But, most children do heal.

Regards,