[Mailbox13]

I was curious as to whether anyone has made a trip back to Russia with their adopted children. How old were your kids at the time and what kind of an experience did you have? Our DS will be 7 soon and has been with us for almost 6 years. In a few years we hope to take him back to Russia to visit the town where he was born. We would also like to tour some of Moscow and St. Petersburg.

[GCS]

We haven't done this but are considering it. You might want to post this on FRUA - I know there are families there that have traveled back to Russia after adoption.

Good luck!

[kretzklan]

We have not gone back either - but I've heard of folks doing it through tour companies who specialize in adoption heritage trips and enjoying both the trip and meeting other families! Of course, as you know, the travel is hard and our oldest son was 8 when we traveled (he came too) and he did not enjoy those flights or the 'weird' food or other things. If we go back, we'll be waiting until our children are much older.

[Shark01]

We took our 8 year old daughter (adopted in 2001) to Russia with us twice last year to participate in the adoption of her "ses-trah". She spent over 3 weeks in-country.

It was a wonderful experience for her, and we highly recommend it.

Here is a couple of pictures of Katerina inside the GUM and next to St Basils (she was cold....even though it was May)

[votemom]

i definitely want to... but since it really is the trip of a lifetimes, i think we will probably wait until they are at least in their teens so the memories they make there will be ones they will always remember.

[momraine]

We are thinking about taking our two youngest when they are in high school and doing Russia and Poland with them. I am hoping that they will both be more wheelchair accesable by that time.

[angelkisses0102]

We will be doing this when they are in their teens...as long as they want to. At this point, both kids would choose to go...but who knows.

[Mailbox13]

Obviously, DS would get different things out the trip at different ages ( 10 vs 13 vs 16). Unfortunately, it is unlikely that we will be able to afford more than one trip as a family. (We will also have a similar trip to China a few years later for DD.) I am hesitant to take my son once he gets to 15 or so. Since he is technically still a Russian citizen, I am concerned about the possibility of him getting drafted.

This may sound a little farfetched. However, Russia has a serious population issue and a lot of borders to protect. It is not unheard of countries to draft as young as 14 or 15. Also, Russia's political climate in only a few steps away from some form of government other than a democracy. Putin weilds a lot of power for someone who is not technically the head of their government.

[britfish]

I spoke with a group that does heritage tours and I believe the recommended age 10-12 for a return trip. This organaztion had counseling and that type of service for the kids on the trip so I thought that was a plus.

[k8c]

I would think that 10-12 would be a great time for the trip. All my reading (yes, that's still all I'm doing at this point) says that having all information possible before puberty is extremely helpful to adopted children. This would certainly be information!

[sak9645]

"Since he is technically still a Russian citizen, I am concerned about the possibility of him getting drafted," said Mailbox13.

You raise an interesting point. Russia, unlike many countries, considers internationally adopted children as retaining their Russian citizenship. The only way that Russian citizenship can be relinquished by an adopted person is for that person to attain age 18 and then go in person to a Russian Embassy or Consulate to make a formal renunciation.

Because the child did nothing to acquire Russian citizenship, except to be born in Russia, the U.S. government has no problem with him/her being a dual citizen. The U.S. government has a problem only if an American purposely seeks out citizenship in another country; that action, just like serving in another country's army or voting in its election, can be cause for revoking a person's U.S. citizenship.

Do be aware, of course, that, because the child adopted from Russia and made a U.S. citizen holds dual citizenship, he/she will have to travel to Russia with two passports. Russia will NOT allow a person adopted from Russia to enter the country on an American passport with a Russian visa. The child will need to obtain a current Russian passport and use it to enter Russia. And the U.S. will want the child to return to the U.S. on a U.S. passport, since he/she is a U.S. citizen.

Some people worry about an American child going to Russia on a Russian passport. They fear that, especially if Russian/U.S. relations cool, the child can be detained and not allowed to return to the U.S. The reason given could be the military draft, accidental violation of a Russian law, or simply a nationalistic belief that international adoption is wrong and was conducted illegally in the case of that child.

The U.S. State Department indicates that it will make every effort to protect dual citizen children in such cases. However, it also indicates that there may be limitations on what it can do, caused by the fact that the child is considered a Russian citizen in Russia, holds a Russian passport, and thereby is obligated to comply with all the laws that Russian citizens must follow.

At this time, there is probably little risk for a child who accompanies his/her parents to Russia. Russia is very conscious of world opinion, and unlikely to want to cause a major international incident over some child with dual citizenship. If it causes a major incident, it will be over something like actions by neighboring countries.

Still, things "could" happen, and no one knows exactly how U.S./Russian relations will go in the next decade or so, in any event. Nationalistic sentiments run strong in some parts of Russian society, and international adoption isn't always well perceived. As a result, some parents are choosing not to travel back to Russia with their Russian-born children, until those children turn 18 and renounce their Russian citizenship.

I did not adopt from Russia -- my daughter is from China and lost her Chinese citizenship upon adoption. If I had a Russian child, however, I honestly think I WOULD take him/her to Russia, either to adopt a second child or to do a birthland tour, especially if he/she was under 13. I think that the risk is pretty low, or at least not much higher for a Russian adoptee than for anyone else traveling to a place where there is a certain amount of political instability or unrest.

Would I feel this way in a few years, if the Russian government changes? Who knows? Anytime that one travels overseas, it is important to consider what is going on politically at that point in time. Increased nationalism in Russia could become a real problem. So could increased lawlessness. And so could a war between Russia and one of its neighbors, which requires a larger group of conscripted soldiers

But, of course, every parent ultimately needs to make his/her own decision, based on his/her own read of the situation at a given time.. There comes a point where "Mama (or Papa) Bear" comes out in each of us, and where we draw our cubs close to us and growl at the world. As the Mom of a 13 year old girl, I can tell you that I get pretty Mama Bear-ish at times and want to keep my daughter far, far away from even small risks, even though I know how important it is to teach her to be independent and street-wise.

Sharon

[Mailbox13]

Sharon,

I think you spelled out my concerns very well. As you said, any of these things "could" happen. A lot of what could happens depends on the political atmosphere at the time of the trip. I think the combination of those concerns plus the advantages of taking them at 10 or so mentioned by some of the other posters, is a good reason to go earlier rather than later.

We also have a daughter from China. I have little concern about taking her back there. The Chinese attitude toward international adoption is much different.

I know you commented that Russia would not allow a child adopted from Russia to enter without a Russian passport. I wonder how they would know that a particular child entering under an American passport was adopted. It's not indicated on the American passport. They would have to have some database linking the child's original Russian name to their new American name.

[sak9645]

Families sending their child's U.S. passport to the Russian Embassy for a visa to enter Russia have had the passports returned, with an indication that the Russian passport had to be used. My assumption, therefore, is that the visa application requires information like place of birth. And if the parents' birthplace is listed as U.S., while the child's is listed as Russia, it's a dead giveaway.

Sharon

[kretzklan]

While what Sharon states is the correct procedure (enter on Russian passport that is up-to-date and come back on a valid US passport) - however, that is not reality. I know of 6 families that have traveled to Russia by using their child's US passport and receiving a Russian visa. So, law versus practice are different in this case.

[momraine]

I think it probably depends on who is processing visas that day or even in that office. The american passports of both of my adopted kids list thier country of birth. (one Russia and one Poland) So they would know, plus they do have a registry at the consolat of adopted children. Unless that has changed, I had to register my daughter, with her new name and address and such at the Russian consolat back in 2000. I am sure there are some workers who do everything strictly by the book and some not so much.