[amyfk]

Hi to the LIst,

I hope you can help me out.
I have done some reading(even here on the forums-Guatemala forum) about the administration of the MMR vaccines.
I personally doubt that the MMR given together causes autism, but I dont know 100%. The CDC seem to claim that it doesnt, but I dont know even if the medical community knows(anyone here in medicine?)
Anyway, today was Joanna's 3rd yr. checkup. The Dr. informed me that Joanna was to recieve her MMR. I asked her if she can administer them separately. It just makes me more comfortable. She said no, that the medical community believes it's a falsehood and seemed to imply that she was disappointed in me for feeling this way/not being a good patient. When I asked again if she would give Joanna the shots separately she outright refused. She said I had to go elsewhere.
I decided that it's time for Joanna to go to a new ped. It is a hassle, but the new place doesnt believe in the theory, but they let you get the shots separately.
I wanted to know if this is common protocol-I thought the patient had the right to ask to get the shots separately if they are comfortable with it. I also thought that there is a working Dr.-patient relationship where they work together. I felt like this individual is an authoritative figure.
Anybody more informed than me on what kind of treatment that I, as a patient, and an informed patient, is deserving of?
(I dont care of what folks'opinions are on the MMR and autism, I want to know what rights I have as a patient).
Thanks in advance,
Amy K, NJ

[Drazil]

Adrian had been given the first of the shots in Russia and they had been given separately (as we were told they do it this way in St. Petes at least). He had to continue the series here in the states of course after we were home and I had no problem with his Dr. at home. We moved to another state almost 2 years ago and as he was due for the remainder with his new Dr. here they really gave me a hard time when I requested (and showed them the records of what his Dr. did at home) the vaccines be done separate (to finish out the series in the same format). They really fought hard against it but I pushed until they admitted that its rare to do so but they could order the separate vaccines in order to finish the series out. It took some time but I pushed and they finally relented. If they had not backed off I would have just waited until a visit back home and had his original Dr. finish it before school started. Also, just a note, the Dr.'s office here insisted on giving him an additional shot that I knew he had already had almost 2 years ago. They said they could not find it on his records (this Dr. here had given it to him in early 2007 so I knew they must have a record somewhere). I refused to allow it (would not sign off on the paper they wanted me to read). The nurse was furious with me and started to lecture me as I packed up my stuff and grabbed Adrian to leave when there was a knock on the exam room door (we had been going around and around on this issue for over 15 minutes). Another nurse called the one in with me out into the hall, a couple minutes later the original nurse came back in and said that they had actually found his records from 2007 and I was right he had already had the shot in question, no apology, nothing! Point of this is that if you do not feel right about something with your child do not back down because they are the professionals or whatever. I think you are right in going elsewhere if they refused to do it your way, good luck with the new place!

[Provost21]

I dont have any information on the shots but just wanted to say that the ped you choose should do as you wish. You are in charge of your daughter, not them. I completely agree with you and would definitely find another ped with your same views or at least be willing to be more open minded to what you are wanting.
Best wishes!

[amyfk]

Thank you guys very much for getting back to me. Basically I felt this individual didnt respect my comfort zone and wouldnt work with me. I made a call to another group and while they arent in agreement with me fully, they respect my wishes to have Joanna vaccinated on a bit more staggered schedule.
I also realized that it is my right to have a copy and notice of her vaccinations. I have no idea which vaccinations my child has had to date, and which one she needs. I will be working on getting this information as soon as possible.
Amy K, NJ

[Bcelli]

You have every right to request separate MMR shots, but I do think most ped offices get the shots in the mixed format and may likely have to order the separate vaccines individually. That doesn't mean they have to honor your request. They can decline the request and then you are free to go elsewhere. I think she should have been more understanding and more willing to provide the shots in a format in which you were more comfortable. The end result is the same, except for the number of times your kid gets jabbed with a needle. I think your ped was put out that you declined to hear it her way and was requesting special handling. (Which actually may cost them more money. Bulk orders are cheaper and if she ordered one set of individual shots - it might have been quite expensive for her to do it that way - if she can even order a single set of doses. The pharmaceutical company might require a minimum dosage order.) Obviously, this is not the ped for you or your daughter. Trust has to be paramount with a physician and bully tactics just don't cut it.

[amyfk]

Thanks Bcelli. I put a certified letter in the mail today to the office to forward my child's records elsewhere. The other place will let me break up the vaccine. I have to do the legwork--to to the pharmacy to get the separate vials, but that is ok with me.

Amy K, NJ

[Jessi_76]

Hi Amy,

Don't know the medical logistics, but I'd say it's DEFINITELY YOUR RIGHT to choose separate shots. I too want separate shots for our children so I understand your concern. I'm more comfortable with it as well. Not your question, I know...but just lending an ear.

XOXO
Jessi

[Hadley2]

Personally, I like a doctor who listens and is open to thoughts and feelings and will explain what they're doing. I hope the op is happy with the new ped office on that score.

I have to say, though, on patients' rights...you have the right to request what you want, you have the right to your records, you have a right to privacy, you have the right to refuse treatment--unless you are incapable of doing so and it is an emergency. And your doctor also has the right to refuse you as a patient except in an emergency.

But a "right" to order how a doctor treats you medically? No. I don't think you even want that--it would be dangerous.

If people had that right, drug addicts would have carte blanche to prescriptions. Stage mothers could be getting their 12-year-old daughters double-Ds, and so on to name a couple of extreme examples.

The doctor has a legal, ethical, and moral duty to treat you according to her/his best medical judgment and public health law. So, no, it makes sense that you can't walk in and order up a treatment plan like Chinese take-out. You can, of course, refuse treatment you don't like and/or go elsewhere, which can be frustrating and annoying.

In this case, it may be that they don't want to go to the trouble of ordering separate vaccines, the vaccines may be more expensive separately, your insurance may not cover separate visits for the shots, etc., or other reasons. It may simply be that the doctors feel that giving the shots separately is allowing proven best practice to be changed by what they consider to be (at least as yet) unfounded popular fears and don't want to contribute, on principle, to promoting that kind of thing.

Anyway, of course you have a right to your child's shots record. It should be a simple matter of asking for it any time you are at the doctor's office. You will need it for preschool, kindergarten and school every year in addition to a school medical form.

Good luck with the new doctor.

[MustangLippy]

It's good that this happened now over something fairly minor and that you didn't discover this incompatability with your pediatrician over something more urgent. Now you can move on and find a ped that you trust. I think it is important for both the doc and the patient that they be compatible.

[Mykidsmom]

I am confused when you say you do not know what shots Joanna has had or needs to have.

Don't you sign for each vaccination? Our ped has a list of the vacs and what interval or age they are needed and I sign beside each vac when it is given.

Maybe that is state specific.

Anytime I need the form for school or sports we get a copy of the form. It has their earliest vacs all the way up to current.

I agree you should switch Dr. sounds like you are not working well together.

[ddahl]

Basically as the mother, its our sandbox, our ball and our rules.... the thing is they try to bully us at the Ped as well. When we came home, M had very well documents vaccination dates, dose etc. St. P is not a back woods region. I had to insist that they run the titers (sp?) They were insistant that he be revaccinated for everything. I refused until the labs came back. Turns out he already had chicken pox so no need to vaccinate there. his labs showed vaccinations for MMR as well. My Ped said and I do quote "What.. do you want to be the only mother in Boca Raton with a kid with Polio or worse"..... ( his point was that there was no way to know the strength of the vacs that were given) It was sobering and I caved! M's behavior was off the hook shortly after that so I will never know. Autism is not in the spectrum but WOW! I can not believe how they bully. I should have come back another day. I was new what can I say! I like the above poster insisted he had already been vaccinated for a round of shots they gave earlier in the year and sure enough the files showed just that. I think you have to question everything and make the choice you feel best with. Above all, I believe our kids health care is a partnership. I have a new Ped but I never get her when we go. I do feel as though she listens on the times I have gotten her. Good luck!