[MustangLippy]

Has anyone broached with their agency what happens to the fees we've paid if a moratorium does happen in the Fall?

Do we lose all the money or are the fees refunded?

Anyone asked?

MustangLippy

[sunstroke]

Our agencies policy is that if you should drop out of the adoption process before you get a referral, all fees are refudable except $5000.

I would suspect that if you have accepted a referral and even made 1 trip, a good portion of those fees you have paid have already been used and is no longer available for a refund. Just my take.

My wife and I are already discussing other countries, specifically India, Korea, and China. Fortunately we are in the early stages of this process. If there is no good news withing a week, we will most likely cut our losses and startup with another country.

Scott

[jmchowat]

It's all going to depend on the agency. A lot of agencies have very tight binding contracts where the vast majority of the responsibility falls on the clients and fees are not refundable unless there is gross misconduct by the agency. Several agencies will abdicate responsibility on changes in the adoption situation in specific countries and will not refund your money when the process is out of their control. Most of the time, your only option is to switch to one of their other programs.

They know that they have what we want, which is always going to put the client at a disadvantage right from the beginning.

[kimber413]

If I had a dollar for every time the moratorium, or even complete stoppage of adoptions, talk has come up, I'd be able to take a nice vacation. This talk has been going on for years. Of course the recent deaths add fuel to the fire, but I have to believe calmer, more sensible heads will prevail. I don't think I'd be freaking out and asking for a refund just yet.

Scott, I think a week is a bit too soon to expect to hear anything. As I said, this talk has been tossed around on and off for years, and still adoptions keep happening. Many people from this forum are in Russia as we speak for court or to meet their referrals. Patience is a virtue in this game, whether you are talking India, China, Russia, or any other country (Adopting from India can take as long as 2 years, and that's AFTER you have your referral. Talk about patience!). To expect to hear something within a week on such a complicated, international issue is just not realistic (I'll print and eat this post if something does happen within a week).

If I'd bailed any one of the numerous times that a shutdown rumor was posted, I wouldn't have my wonderful daughter. I'm not saying you shouldn't do what you feel is right for you and your family. Of course you should. I'm just saying that nothing may ever happen of this current talk, just as it hasn't happened in the past.

I do wish the best for all of you, whichever country you choose to go with. This journey isn't easy. It takes a lot of patience and determination, but it is so worth the wait.

[ZTALDY]

Here is my take. Agency fees generally go to pay the agency's employees. If your paperwork has already been submitted and reviewed. A referral already made I would gather that it would not be refunded. Since the case worker has been working the case. I know that our CW got paid a set amount per family. She worked very hard for the small amount that she got paid. I know that once we paid the child fee it went directly to the facilitating agency..none of the funds stayed with the agency. So the agency would have really no way of refunding this since they would not have this in their budget. This would bankrupt an agency if they had to repay child fees that they never got.

[kizibits]

I think it really depends on your agency. My agency's policy is to allow the PAPs to switch to another country that they work in. All the fees paid in to date transfer to the new program as well. I'm still hoping it won't come to that, but at least it is a viable option.

[KimOH]

Read your agency's contract. The agency we used for our first adoption spelled out when each fee became non-refundable in their contract. (translation fee was non-refundable upon translation of your dossier, foreign fee was refundable until your adoption was completed, etc.)

My current agency does a more pay-as-you-go sort of fee structure. So, presumably, the fees are non-refundable as soon as you pay them. However, it does say in the contract that if the country "ceases its adoption program" you'd be entitled to a refund of any money not already spent. However, it also says that they are not responsible for 'delays'...so I think then the discussion would have to turn to whether a moratorium is a cessation of the program, or merely a delay.

Good luck. I agree with the other poster, though...they were also talking about moratoriums back in 2001 when we adopted the first time. So there's a lot of talk...it doens't necessarily mean that it will happen. But it did happen in 2000, so it is a possibility.

Edited to add: I did talk to my current agency about this during their time of lapsed reaccrediation (they have since been reaccredited.) They considered that a "delay" not a cessation.

[mrbkr]

I agree with Kimber.

The biggest problem with forums such as this is that they are filled with poor adoptive parents who have had terrible experiences with their individual adoption process. These are the people most inclined to share their experiences and they are scaring the heck out of a lot of folks who really have nothing to worry about. I know because I fell into the same trap with all the doom, gloom, misinformation and negative speculation. My mind went wild with all kinds of crazy scenarios. This can't be healthy folks.

I wish more successfull adoptive parents (and there are a lot more of them) would post on this site.

[MustangLippy]

I wish more folks would post too. There are hundreds and hundreds of lurkers.

However, to clarify I didn't say that we are jumping the gun and pulling out. I just wondered what the agencies policy will be IF a moratorium occurs and a lot of PAPs are stranded in the abyss.

And I don't think next week is too soon for Scott to expect to hear anything. We were all told by our agencies that reaccreditation is supposed to happen again mid-August. If it doesn't happen (yet again) you have to evaluate just how long you're willing to sit in limbo.

[Kasey]

I agree with those that say check your own specific contract and also speak with your agency, ask what their plans would be in the event of a moratorium, hopefully they would already know of contingency/backup plans like rolling into another program or getting some money back.

As far as only people posting doom and gloom on this site, I find that not to be true, I think this site is much more positive than FRUA, but the fact remains there are issues going on in Russia right now, that may/may not affect current and future adoptions, there is no hiding that fact, so if PAP's want to post their concerns and worries and everything they are stressed over, that is ok, they are looking for support and guidance and reassurance, that is what these boards are supposed to be for.
Yes many of us had successes and easy journies, but most of those occured prior to the recent delays and issues and truthfully many times I almost feel guilty posting about my experience, because I feel terrible for those stuck in the current crap, because I don't know how I would have handled it? So maybe that is why you see alot of lurkers and no posters and just like any forum, maybe alot of people don 't feel they have any good info to add?

Again I am so sorry for all those caught up in this and I truly hope this is all sorted out and adoptions can go back to being smooth again!!

[sunstroke]

If we choose to seriously consider other countries, we will effectively have 2 irons in the fire. Since we haven't accepted a referral we won't lose any more money.

I just spoke with my agency today and they told me that there is some meeting in Russian on the 15th that maybe will tell them something. We discussed referral times and what not as well.

The agency of course has a "typical" referral time. We talked about if the agnecy got accreditation what that referral time would then be. Would it still hold true or would it most likely start from when the accreditation happened. Of course no one has the answers.

So it seems that we really don't have too much to lose by having two pokers in the fire.

I truly feel sorry for those that already have a referral and are waiting for accreditation.

I also am extremely happy for those with agencies accreditation that are moving forward.

Lotsa rambling...lotsa frustration. You come into the process with certain guarded expectations. Sure they may be optimistic or even unrealistic. But what has been frustrating for me is the fact that there has been no real progress made toward adoption since May for us personally. I feel better about waiting if there are baby steps made toward the end.

No one's fault except maybe those who couldn't control themselves and abused and killed their children.

Assuming that the slowdown in the accreditation is due to the deaths, I completely understand why the government would want to make sure things are done properly to prevent similar incidents.

But at the same time there are other countries out there that are forging ahead with adoptions with completely wonderful kids.

From a financial perspective, adopting from another country would still be cheaper (including the potential $5000 loss to the Russian program) than what I would have paid to adopt from Russia.

Lots of things to consider and again more rambling and releasing.

We haven't made our decision yet, but I think we will end up with 2 irons in the fire.

Scott

[CeltiaSkye]

I guess I'm confused by this whole reaccreditation business. I thought that if the agency wasn't reaccredited that they couldn't do adoptions, but the agency I'm working with hasn't been reaccredited yet and they're still getting referrals and court dates. Is this unusual?

[bam125]

Just a thought, if you are really considering switching to another country, start doing your research now. While we kept waiting for something to happen in Russia (never did for us), I researched my agency's China and Ukraine programs. Also, I completed the entire China dossier and it was ready to be sent when we finally did pull out of Russia.

Beth Anne