[Jackiejdajda]

RavenSong

They then proceeded to strap both my legs and my hands down, and an anesthesiologist appeared out of nowhere with a gas mask. My doctor didn't say a word, just sat down on a stool and started making the episiotomy incision without waiting for the anesthetic to take effect. I tried to fight off the gas mask, but it's kind of hard to do when your hands are strapped down to the table.

I am right there with you.. I have a terror of being tied down..
I went to the hospital two weeks overdue.. and the labor stopped and we had given up the motel and I had nowhere to go..
I went into labor and then all memories are gone.. except for one time when I came to in the elevator.. they were taking me for x-rays.. and I made a joke by saying I wanted a picture..
36 hours.. the record says..

Lifton believes that all members of the triad carry their own ghosts with them. For birthmothers, one of the ghosts is that of her newborn infant. Sometimes it's just hard to reconcile the "ghost" of that infant with the real-life adult son or daughter. This is where that meditation/visualization really helps me, I believe.

In another thread I wrote about how some of us are broken by all this.. and was trying to explain why a birthmom would disconnect with her grown up birthdaughter after reunion..

I was thinking yesterday that its like we drown when the connection is made and some of us do not want to go into that drowning.. that emotional emotional place.. its too darn hard.. so Lifton’s ghost theory works.. for me..

BTW, today is my son's 36th birthday. So today I've been remembering that early morning so long ago. Bittersweet, sad.... But I'm going to be calling him in a couple hours, so now I'm feeling kind of nervous. Wish me luck...

A time for you..

How did it go?

Jackie

[RavenSong]

Originally Posted by Jackiejdajda

I am right there with you.. I have a terror of being tied down..
I went to the hospital two weeks overdue.. and the labor stopped and we had given up the motel and I had nowhere to go..
I went into labor and then all memories are gone.. except for one time when I came to in the elevator.. they were taking me for x-rays.. and I made a joke by saying I wanted a picture..
36 hours.. the record says..

Jackie, your memories of being in labor are probably gone because of the drugs that were administered. In the 1960's and 1970's, a lot of us received scopolamine, mixed in with either morphine ("twilight sleep") or meperidine. The scopolamine was added because it is an amnesiac...the sole purpose for it was to ensure women would not remember the pains of labor and delivery. It did not always work, and it's not used anymore...

I did not remember a lot of things about the whole hospital experience until I obtained my medical records many years later. And I had totally forgotten the horrible experience I had with the OB/GYN floor nurses following my son's birth until I read The Girls Who Went Away last year. And then it all came flooding back instantly...and made me really sad for that 17-year-old girl who was trying so hard to pretend everything was okay...and who believed that the nurses' attitudes and treatment were what she deserved. People can be really cruel sometimes...

Originally Posted by Jackiejdajda

I was thinking yesterday that its like we drown when the connection is made and some of us do not want to go into that drowning.. that emotional emotional place.. its too darn hard.. so Lifton’s ghost theory works.. for me..

I think that is why it is so critical for birthmothers to join some type of support group at some point in the reunion process, hopefully before the initial contact stage. It does indeed feel like we're drowning at times, and we all need to grab onto something so we don't go under the water. In support groups, both online and in real life, other birthmothers can be that buoy when we feel ourselves drowning.

Originally Posted by Jackiejdajda

A time for you.. How did it go?

Another birthday come and gone, and I survived the day! I tried calling my son, but he was out celebrating his birthday last night. I left messages on his home phone, cell phone, and email. Of course, I immediately feared the worse, thinking he was avoiding me. Today when I checked my email, I found the most touching, beautiful message from him. And he signed it, "Love, DS"...a huge step forward for us. He had always signed his messages to me this way up until our meltdown. And today was the first time he signed his emails with the "Love" prefix since he reopened communications with me last month. I am on Cloud Nine...

[Jackiejdajda]

RavenSong

Jackie, your memories of being in labor are probably gone because of the drugs that were administered. In the 1960's and 1970's, a lot of us received scopolamine, mixed in with either morphine ("twilight sleep") or meperidine. The scopolamine was added because it is an amnesiac...the sole purpose for it was to ensure women would not remember the pains of labor and delivery. It did not always work, and it's not used anymore...

I should have gone through the experience.. I should have gone through the delivery and I should have held him and I should have made the decision to give him up then and there.. Avoidance.. and having others help me avoid.. is wrong beyond words..
And what really gets me is the not talking about it..

If one were to stand back and really look at that.. today in today’s world one would say.. ha.. that woman/girl is heading for trouble.. To go through such an experience and then not process it.. is beyond wrong..
It cuts a person off.. A person is cut off from others and there is no help and no connection on terms of love and support..

I did not remember a lot of things about the whole hospital experience until I obtained my medical records many years later. And I had totally forgotten the horrible experience I had with the OB/GYN floor nurses following my son's birth until I read The Girls Who Went Away last year. And then it all came flooding back instantly...and made me really sad for that 17-year-old girl who was trying so hard to pretend everything was okay...and who believed that the nurses' attitudes and treatment were what she deserved. People can be really cruel sometimes...

I thought I deserved it as well.. and when I had my daughter ten years later I went right back into that frame of mind.. When I was in bad labor with my daughter I sent my husband out of the room.. I felt I had to do it alone.. Its how I got through it the last time and it was how I got through it with her.. and then the nurse found my shoes or slippers.. and brought them to me wrapped in paper towels..
I felt so ashamed when I saw that.. I felt that I was dirty.. even tho I was legal at that time..

My goodness when a person thinks of it.. not being married and not having a ring on a finger makes a person dirty.. wrong..
How stupid..

But I bought into it.. I accepted the condemnation.. and acted accordingly.. and never talked about how stupid it was..
Kept it in.. I was guilty as charged for a long long time..

I think that is why it is so critical for birthmothers to join some type of support group at some point in the reunion process, hopefully before the initial contact stage. It does indeed feel like we're drowning at times, and we all need to grab onto something so we don't go under the water. In support groups, both online and in real life, other birthmothers can be that buoy when we feel ourselves drowning.

We should have gotten help when we relinquished.. (so many shoulds in this post).. We should have been told that what we were going through was one of the worst things a person could and has gone through.. have our feelings validated instead of shamed..

Its part of my life now tho.. Part of who I am..

I do not expect emotional support.. I do not need it.. When I was in labor with Naomi I found my husbands emotional support distracting.. as I wrote above.. I had to throw him out.. make him go away..
And whew I felt guilty after I had done that. I felt that there was something wrong with me that I would not share the most important time in our lives with him.. I am amazed that this man has stayed with me through the years..

Another birthday come and gone, and I survived the day! I tried calling my son, but he was out celebrating his birthday last night. I left messages on his home phone, cell phone, and email. Of course, I immediately feared the worse, thinking he was avoiding me. Today when I checked my email, I found the most touching, beautiful message from him. And he signed it, "Love, DS"...a huge step forward for us. He had always signed his messages to me this way up until our meltdown. And today was the first time he signed his emails with the "Love" prefix since he reopened communications with me last month.

He pulled away and now he is back.. how wonderful.. and you let him go.. you gave him space.

I really believe we need to do this in reunion.. give the other person space so they are not obligated to be nice and pretend feelings that are not there..
My bson and I touch spaces and then pull away.. connect and then get on with our lives..
If he came at me and wanted to know me I would know him.. I would make the effort like I do with my second and third born.. but he has not asked for it..
My third born son has moved to Toronto.. He has an apartment.. and I can not disconnect from my feelings towards him.. The apartment is wrong.. there is a terrible noise in it.. a fan that will not shut off.. he could not sleep the first nite..
So I worry and fret and can not let it go.. and think.. this thirty year old man can take care of himself..
I do not worry about my daughter.. more than thirty years old.. just him..
My daughter is strong woman.. and I know she could go anywhere and survive.. like me.. but my son I worry..

A very big storm is heading our way.. We are going to be totally snowed in soon..

I am rambling today.. worried and rambling.. I wish I had a meeting to go to.. friends to hug me..
We have kids and we are forced into life.. forced to connect.. or engage..

Thanks for listening..

Jackie

[keds]

Jackie, for what it's worth:

(((((((hugs))))) I can so relate. All of my children, raised and bson are living away and I'm feeling the anxiety that you describe. I know they are adults but, still, want to protect them. I too am digging out form 40 cm of snow - AAGGH! However I am leaving tomorrow for the sunny south and hope that in 2 weeks the worst will be over. that old dog - if you love something set it free, if it comes back it is yours, if not, it never was, is so true. I am giving all my kids space and they seem to be responding - some more quickly than others but that darn 4 letter word - patience is driving me crazy but, at the same time, is likely a good thing. As each day goes by it gives me time to reflect and realize that if they want me to be part of their life that doesn't mean that I am their "whole" life. I too speak rarely to my parents. Not because I don't love them but because I know they love me and I have my life to live. How many things on our "to do" list is left over for the next day????

Raven - (((hugs))) to you too. I was fortunate enough to remember every detail of my bson's birth. Although, I have blocked out holding him, spending that first week together before relinquishment but my hubby (bdad) and parents have told me how wonderful I was with him and I think I have blocked it for the last 28 years to make it easier (the brain does protect the body, after fall). Since reunion, I have had snippets of memory flash back but we are all in the same boat. Wishing for a second chance. So far, I think we're doing OK. I didn't get this as a youngster but for me, there can be nothing that anyone could possibly want more than have someone love them. Take care. kate

[mariarippy]

I wrote my mom emails and have left messages. I've indicated to her a number of times how much it would mean to me to get a response. Nothing different since 2005. So getting no response means i shouldn't keep emailing letting her know how we are as a family? I get the feeling my behavior is not usual based on some of the sharing of bmom's.
I phoned her last October. Left a message saying my daughter(age 4) and I were going to visit. Instead of talking to me she had her husband call my husband to "keep me in check." My mom's husband stated we had no realtionship, they were in the room when my first child was born. So I am like, what?! I put this bull**** behind me. I tell myself someday she will ask about us. Someday she will care about us rather than about how awkward and or embarrased she felt in a room full of acqauntainces who learned I was the child she gave away during her son's funeral.

[Jackiejdajda]

Keds wrote

that old dog - if you love something set it free, if it comes back it is yours, if not, it never was, is so true

Ah… Just what I needed to hear or read today.. My son called and all is well.. He just made it into Toronto before the next storm and he has been offered work for a couple of weeks on a new film just starting up.. He has a career ahead of him.. and I am sooooo pleased..
And he has been offered another apartment down the hall for April first.. so there it is he is okay.. and all is well and all things are well..

And here is hubby and me snowed in.. totally.. We could not get out if we tried.. I got double of everything milk etc.. before it started this second time.. The snow is beautiful and the sun is hitting the bank of the creek.. We have an injured woodpecker that is hidden in our tree and I am watching for it..

Its about control this saying if you love something/someone set it/them free.. We can not control anything other than our lives.. other than stocking up cause a storm is coming.. I can not control how my bson interacts with me.. such a hard hard lesson to learn in the early days.. I wanted and I did not get and I bet he wanted and did not get..

Have a wonderful trip to the warm places..

Jackie

[Jackiejdajda]

Mariarippy

Someday she will care about us rather than about how awkward and or embarrased she felt in a room full of acqauntainces who learned I was the child she gave away during her son's funeral.

I do not think she is developed beyond thinking of herself.. and as I just wrote in my previous post.. we can not control this.. We can not force the woman to think in another direction.. She is angry IMO.. Secrets and lies are beyond painful.. especially for the one that has no control over any of it.. other than showing up and doing the best a person can..

Accepting what has happened and no blame.. What a thing..

Jackie

[keds]

Jackie, great news about your bson! I too spent 3 hours digging myself out of the house. I've been keeping the birdfeeder full (the cardinals, mourning doves and a very loud blue jay have relied on me all winter). The snow is so deep the squirrels can stand on the snow and eat straight out of the feeder! Little bums but I'm feeling generous as they have to eat too. I've stocked up as well. I'm not sure if there is another storm coming but my holiday is this week so I'm hoping not. I would love it if spring arrived while I was gone!

mariarippy - (((hugs))) I had to get over feelings of humiliation, guilt and shame when my bson first contacted me (even though I was ecstatic and hopeful that he would come searching for me). I soon realized that it was what others had said about me that made me feel badly about myself. As a young girl I internalized everything but now, I realize that I can decide whose opinion I should consider and pay attention to and those whose really don't matter. For me, they are my children - all of them. Even my family, including my husband (bdad) cannot influence my decision to maintain contact with my bson and to help foster a relationship with his siblings. I do hope that your bmom can overcome her emotions. Keep true to yourself. Nobody can make you feel uneasy about yourself - only if you let them. IMO she is missing out.

[mariarippy]

IMO she is missing out. I don't want her to miss out. She doesn't feel the same when she changes I'll be first to announce it from the rooftops.

[Mockingbird]

We all descended on my parents for Easter and my son (and his wife) met his half-sisters for the first time. They were all nervous; but I was sure they would like each other as they are much alike in certain ways/interests. It went really, really well. We all had a good time. We also had some other relatives to stop by to meet him. He did really well through all of the "inspections" ;-).

That was my second time to meet with him; but I find myself wishing that I had him to myself. I was in tears a few times thinking about how much I like him and how much we missed out on by not being together. While I'm glad that he is being pulled into the family circle and made to feel welcome, I'm feeling like he's moving further away emotionally. We still talk, but it's more superficial and not really about our feelings like it used to be. I know this is selfish; but I find myself wondering if he's satisfied with learning about us and now doesn't feel that need for me anymore. I think I don't really like sharing him so much.

[kune]

Mockingbird
I think it's possible that instead of being superficial it's becoming more common-place. Over the 7 years I have been in reunion I have noticed the change in our attitude to each other. Where we were once at that exciting time - the "getting to know who each was" stage, it was sooooo one on one - both trying so hard to connect and make it real. Then we moved onto the stage where I think you are. We both knew the other was not going to run - we knew enough about each other so the "obsession" with facts had gone. More like family, but less intense, each sort of settling into a pattern. From my reunion experience, I doubt any couple whether romantically or familiar, could sustain that level of emotional intensity for too long. I too missed the excitement and total commitment, but what you have now comes without the fear and the moments of panic.

I guess too, reality bites. We now know we can't make up for lost time. We have shared the stories, but it's not the same as living it. We have to make a future that is ours, because the past is gone and we can't change that. I remind myself often that we will make lasting memories.... (I already have a few of them) and make the most of every opportunity.

It sounds like your family gathering was great. I would think his head was reeling with all the new names and trying to fit them into the family frame.

((Hugs)) to you. You'll get your time alone, and I hope you have many more family occasions to share with him.

Ann

[kathy79]

Mockingbird,

I completely understand where you are coming from. I've been in reunion for a little over 8 months and I fear that my bson and I are moving further away emotionally but in reality we are just in another phase of reunion. And for me that is so hard to embrace b/c at times it seems so superficial.

I have to remind myself that we don't always have to talk of our feeling and deep subjects but that we are at a stage of creating new memories and just enjoying and getting to know each other. I don't like sharing him with his own family!

I spent 5 days at his house over Easter and how much better can that get! I will have to continue to remind myself that we are still getting to know each other and the relationship will not happen over night but we have such a bond that I don't think can be broken.

Hugs and just try to relax and enjoy your reunion.

[Mockingbird]

Thanks kune and kathy79. It's good to know that I'm not out there alone in my feelings.

I just feel like I'm emotionally starved for him. We have been in reunion now for going on 5 months. I have been able to see him twice (for several days each time). It has been so hard to leave him. We talk on the phone every week; but I want to be doing something with him--creating memories and having shared experiences. You can't do that by phone.

I had thought that the rollercoaster ride was over; but I see now I was just in the first dip!

[keds]

Mockingbird, I'm almost 2 years in and I can't see an end to the roller coaster but the hills and valleys are smaller. Kune's post rings true - I'm past the initial woohoo! phase and I feel that bson knows I'm not going anywhere. His life is quite busy at the moment so I'm holding back calling but our e-mails keep us both updated and f2f visits are quite enjoyable. We both know that we can't make up the time but know that neither of us are at fault (which is a huge relief to me). I just wish the rest of my family was as accepting but that's their issues, not mine. All the best and remember, you will make your own memories, in time. All good things come to those who wait. take care.

[kune]

Mockingbird
Oh...5 months is soooooo new. It's so intense and it's like your whole day is paced around how often you think of him and how many times you question your new relationship. It's big breathe time......knowing you can't run ....... take one step at a time. It's allowing yourself to settle down and for both of you to make sense of this familiar stranger who has entered your lives. Don't hurry it.......let it take it's own pace. You have so much time ahead and slow for the first year (at least) should be your present goal IMO.

I have to smile here Mockingbird.....someone wrote the same stuff to me about 5 months into my reunion and I thought......"I'm going so slow I'm almost at a standstill" BUT.....I wasn't. I was pushing my own person emotional and physical boundaries. I was lacking sleep and being totally obsessive. My hubby was spending more time in "his cave" because this unpredictable women had taken over his wife's body and was hovering somewhere between Pluto or Mars. Give yourself time to sort it.....give your son time too. You have the rest of your life to make this wonderful.

(Smile)) Ann