[gigigeorge]

When we first looked into adoption I too wanted a closed adoption, I didn't want the birthfamily interfering in our life... BUT before we signed with any agencies we did a lot of research and realized that perhaps we would be open to some level of contact... for me the realization came because of my family and our dynamic which perhaps makes me more accepting of open adoption... I grew up in a divorced and remarried household, even though I had a mom & a stepmom, I still *knew* who my mom was, in essence I really didn't have two moms. I just had two wonderful women who loved me... I was never confused, I was just loved. In the end, thinking about that is what swayed my decision. I am glad for my sons sake that we did. He (and us too of course) have this whole other family that is now a part of our lives. That doesn't mean that he has two moms (he has two women who love him) or that he is confused. He knows that A. loves him, and we visit, phone and email... our son will grow up just knowing this part of his family... it will never be a secret, or a heartbreaking reunion - he will just know them... and for us that made sense.

Now of course, open adoption isn't for everyone, and it isn't our place to try and convince anyone otherwise, that's how we end up in situations where pap's promise everyting under the sun only to change their minds and disappear once the papers are signed... some people aren't comfortable with the though of open adoption, some people don't understand what it really means (we didn't until we were in the midst of it)... it's like any other familial relationship - it has it's up and downs... in fact we've had some situations with our birthmom that make me question it all over again, but unless my child was in direct physical danger I would never change anything. But we are waiting for baby #2 and sometimes I admit, I think about not having any contact this time... but in the end I know that I will because despite everything, I KNOW it's the right thing for my children.

But there are agencies and even pbmom's who look for closed adoptions, so they do exist and no one is a bad person for wanting that. In the end, you are the one who has to answer for your childs future - our son could just as well be royally pissed off that we made the decision to keep contact... You have to do what's best for you and your child. You have to live with the decisions you make and only you have to answer to your child when they ask about it.

g.

p.s. I KNOW I will get blasted for saying that my son does not have two moms, but what I mean is that he doesn't have me and another mom who are responsible for his life... I mean I am the mom who makes the decisions, yes she is his mom too but not in the same way and I think that's where some people get confused and think open adoption is co-parenting.

[SchmennaLeigh]

Originally Posted by gigigeorge

p.s. I KNOW I will get blasted for saying that my son does not have two moms, but what I mean is that he doesn't have me and another mom who are responsible for his life... I mean I am the mom who makes the decisions, yes she is his mom too but not in the same way and I think that's where some people get confused and think open adoption is co-parenting.

Nah, not "blasted." I don't really call myself Munchkin's "Mom." Being a Mom to my Nicholas, I know the connotations around that word. I am her Mother; the one who brought her into the world. I am her Firstmother. If she so desires to call me Mom one day... I'd feel weird but be respectful of her wishes. I just simply adore, at this time, to hear her call me Jenna. It's too darn cute.

Originally Posted by michellesnook

My son's first family lives 2220 miles away from us. We are in a TOTALLY open adoption, but obviously they can't co-parent. It's silly to think that they would have any influence on our day to day activities.

This is a great thing to remember. Munchkin and her family live about eight hours from me. While we email frequently, we often just talk about the craziness of parenting. We do occasionally offer advice to the other if one is having "one of those days," but other than that I completely respect her parenting of all of her children as she does respect my parenting of the Nick-Man. Even if we lived closer, I have no desire to step on toes and tell her how to parent the Munchkin. Friends don't do that to one another and, thankfully, D is my friend.

Originally Posted by timni

Jenna - As always my admiration for your patience. You continue to suprise me.

I'm full of surprises but not always patience. I've been working on it. I have my moments which I believe we all do, of course. Thank you for your kind words. What a nice thing to read at work.

[Barton]

Since the moderator of thuis forum has joined in with the chorus of the choir, I would like to remind everyone to be respectfull of others on this forum that do not subscribe to your point of view.


Just because a pap does not subsribe to the "open adoption" theory does not:

1.) mean they have not researched it and fully understand. (as it has been suggested)

2.) mean they are unenlightened.

3.) mean they are bad people.

4.) mean they are wrong.

5.) mean they are damaging their child by not having an open adoption.

It just means they have a different point of view on the matter.

It seems like there is a healthy sense of self-righteous indignation toward anyone on this forum that does not goose-step to the "open adoption" agenda.

Again, please be respectful to different points of views on this matter.

Thanks!

[BrandyHagz]

Since the moderator of thuis forum has joined in with the chorus of the choir, I would like to remind everyone to be respectfull of others on this forum that do not subscribe to your point of view

Barton, one of our twenty moderators is particpating here...I think we have it covered...so lets leave the moderating to them, ok?

[Mommy24]

Thanks for your help Barton I in no way said that gimpsta was wrong in his way of thinking, everyone is entitled to their opinion and what works for one will never work for all! I simply asked a question that I felt was sincere, as everyone else I am also entitled to what I believe. That said, I dont see anyone thus far having a problem with respecting others opinions Thanks for your input though!

[JPDakota]

I always love how those of us who disagree about open adoption are confused, lacking information, have unreasonable fears, try to explain things away, etc. There is intimation that I am not concerned about what's best for my child, but am selfishly threatened. I am none of those things. I simply disagree after growing up as an adopted child and after considerable research. Not popular, I know, but there it is. That in no way means birth mothers are second class citizens. We send DD's birthmother pics and letters, but we send them to the agency. Her choice and ours.
To suggest I "don't want to learn about her story" because it will invalidate my conclusions is simply not the case. Anecdotal information is not compelling. There will be a body of results to study some years from now. Time will tell.

[SchmennaLeigh]

Time is all ready telling. Brandy offers her story up all the time yet no one wants to listen. There are MANY more stories, both good and bad, as these first children in open adoptions are now adults. But we don't listen.

Why is this?

[JPDakota]

Don't know what "we" doesn't listen, but I've been here a long time and am familiar with lots of aspects of her story and many others. Why am I automatically not listening if I don't come to the same conclusions?

[SchmennaLeigh]

Don't know what "we" doesn't listen

In direct reference to your "time will tell" comment. Time is all ready telling.

[mom2GRLC]

Originally Posted by Barton

Since the moderator of thuis forum has joined in with the chorus of the choir, I would like to remind everyone to be respectfull of others on this forum that do not subscribe to your point of view.


Just because a pap does not subsribe to the "open adoption" theory does not:

1.) mean they have not researched it and fully understand. (as it has been suggested)

2.) mean they are unenlightened.

3.) mean they are bad people.

4.) mean they are wrong.

5.) mean they are damaging their child by not having an open adoption.

It just means they have a different point of view on the matter.

It seems like there is a healthy sense of self-righteous indignation toward anyone on this forum that does not goose-step to the "open adoption" agenda.

Again, please be respectful to different points of views on this matter.

Thanks!

I agree and thank you for sharing your opinion. I've felt this way over and over in the past as well.Maybe it never meant to come across that way but I always felt it. Especially at times when I was having a lot of trouble in my open adoption(no promises of openess were ever made and children were adopted through fostercare) I was just testing out the waters of open adoption and if it work for us. Thankfully it has but we have had some really rough periods where it was not best. Yet I felt as you posted above...that I was being told I wasn't putting my childs needs first and I was doing her a disservice, as well as not giving the birthmom what she deserves.

Finally we are each at a point where we can have a healthy relationship and I do enjoy having an open adoption. However i do not feel it is "the only way" as so many on these forums have suggested. Our child would have been just as happy in a closed adoption if that is what she grew up in.

[JPDakota]

Annecdotal evidence actually comes down on both sides, but regardless, it does not constitute a body of evidence. For that we must wait, as is often the case in empirical research.
It is really evident, however, that this discussion has reached its saturation point. I think we can probably agree on that.

[Vogi2002]

Originally Posted by gimpsta

i personally couldn't see how anyone could do an open adoption unless there were special circumstances within a family.

IMO - the child has ONE mom and ONE dad reguardless where their first 9months were spent. I for one stay far away from open adoptions for the fear of any involvement from an actual birthparent. This is one reason for my wife and I considering foreign adoption.

but to answer your question, i probably feel the same way you do. the child has ONE set of parents. otherwise IMO it gets turned into nothing different than what happens when parents are divorced and the child expierences a long term relationship with the parent he/she hardly sees.

Just a reminder that THROUGH this post, we took it as saying that he hadn't done any research. "Considering foreign adoption" leads me to believe that they have not really dug deep into things. But most of all "IMO it gets turned into nothing different than what happens when parents are divorced and the child expierences a long term relationship with the parent he/she hardly sees" this tells me that they haven't done research on open adoption at all. There ARE people who are not comfortable with it, and that's okay. But this was a harsh comparison, first of all, it's a generalizatioin of kids who are raised by divorced parents, and second, that has NOTHING to do with open adoption. THAT is why we assumed that there was little research done, because it was a VERY uneducated response.

I also haven't seen any bashing going on in this thread, simply explaining. I completely respect everyone's opinions, just don't throw generalizations out there and harsh comparisons with nothing to back it up.

I respect an aparents decision to have a closed adoption or open adoption, I just think this should be fully researched, if it is, and you choose closed adoption GREAT I think that is wonderful!!

Natalie

[SchmennaLeigh]

Natalie; great point about generalizing children of divorce. My Husband had a close relationship with BOTH of his parents, even after divorce. Every single situation is different and making harsh generalizations solves nothing. A lot of this thread has been discussion on education and dispelling myths. One myth being open adoption is co-parenting or just like a divorce situation. It's simply not.

[Vogi2002]

Originally Posted by JPDakota

From my information gathering and my personal perspective, I believe that open adoption is a mistake. I also believe, since life is cyclical, that there will be a return to more closed adoption. I must have read on this board a thousand times that open adoption is not co-parenting, but I don't know about that. I can understand why birthmoms would want openess.

"Open adoption is a mistake" is very harsh. You aren't just saying you don't agree with it, you are saying it is a MISTAKE. I also hope adoption isn't one of those fads that go in and out of style like jeans. I hope we can learn and grow from the research involved, in whatever option is right for our families.

"I can understand how birth parents would lean toward openess". Do birth parents get a great feeling seeing thier child and knowing they are happy? Probably, but read closely to posts from bmoms, for most of them, visits are HARD on them, it is HARD to see thier children happy without them. They do it for their child. I'm not saying that bmoms in closed adoptions are harming thier child, I'm not saying that at all. I am saying that a big misunderstanding in open adoption is that it is purely for the bmom (i know that is what I thought at first). I have now realized how bmoms and aparents have open adoptions really for the child, because WE believe that it is best for them (and the extra perks that we get, like security, knowledge, understanding, love, etc from each other).

*******I am IN NO WAY saying that closed adoptions will harm a child, I hate having to put fine print in all of my posts that we state our opinions, but I guess I must, so this is all MY OPINION!!!********

[gigigeorge]

To me, when you say that you are interested in international adoption because you don't want any involvement from the birthparents, it comes across as naive as when people say it is impossible to adopt a caucasian infant in the US who isn't addicted to drugs etc.... it does question your research.

Becuase there are still quite a few situations in which potential birthparents are specifically looking for closed adoptions, that's what makes it seem like you haven't really researched it. Your reasons for wanting a closed adoption are yours, and the decision is yours to make. As parents we do the best we can but somewhere along the line I am sure we will make a decision that isn't the right one but one that we made out of love.

As for the person who doesn't believe that the statistics show open adoption to be a good choice, there was recently a study done in Britain where open adoptions have been the practice for more than 30 years - the study interviewed children in both closed and open adoptions and both adoptive and birthparents. The children who were raised in open adoptions were more well adjusted in their adoptions, more comfortable in who they are, more stable in terms of relationships both with family and with others, had better self esteem and self confidence... on and on... I'll have to see if I can find the link to the story. This of course does not mean to imply that children in closed adoptions aren't well adjusted, because A LOT of your child has to do with how they are raised, just that in this particular survey the results were overwhelming.

The point is, no one willingly hurts their child (okay some do but they are low lifes)... choosing a closed adoption doesn't mean that your child will be completely screwed up but I do believe that an open adoption does allow for a certain amount of closure which we all know is paramount to healing.

My grandmother was adopted in NY in the 1920's, the only piece of information she has about her birthmom is her name - we searched for years and years to find the smallest piece of information for her... my grandmother just wanted to know why? Imagine her life of pain searching for that answer, when in an open adoption she could have just picked up the phone and asked...

g.