[Free_to_be_me]

I loved reading about your relationship with your child's birthfamily. My situation is really similar except I am the birthmother. I have taken both of the kids (my birthdaughter and her adopted sister) to the beach or to the playground or whereever, sometimes even in the adoptive family's car...oh no, I might have stolen their car and thier kids! *please note the sarcasm*

The kids spend the night at my sister's house all the time and are BOTH going to be in her wedding this summer. My parents are known by their first names, not grandma and grandpa, but my parents consider themselves to be grandparents. They don't get hung up on titles, but treat the kids the same as my brother's children.

Of course the amount of openness and contact birthparents and adoptive parents and the children can have needs to be tailored specifically to the people involved. In our situation having this close of a relationship works perfect for us. The children have no question at all about who their parents are, I am certainly NOT co-parenting and have no intention or desire to. I am betting that at some point my birthdaughter will ask if she can live with me. (She has asked once, but she was 8 and looking for limits, not really wanting to live with me) The simple answer to that is "no". It really isn't that difficult.

[niece]

I think that people need to but the child first and their feelings second. I know that I am a hopeful adoptive parent and I am all for telling the child that adopt the truth. I think that before people can be honest with their children they have to be honest with themselves and understand and cope with their own reasons for adoption.
I am very open about my infertility and there is no way that I could keep that fact from my child.
I think that honesty is the best policy !

[Kelli]

To Brandy and to any other adoptee that is here that is also an aparent, was your decision to have an open relationships with ongoing contact in any part due to what you wanted while you were growing up? Would full information disclosure been enough to answer some of your most pertinent questions or was a relationship with your birthfamilies what you would have desired more as you were growing up? I guess this last question can be answered by any adoptee.

I have a lot more questions on this subject but I'll try to contain myself for now.

Peace and blessings,

Kelli

[BrandyHagz]

Kelli,

My story is odd.

I had a very short “relationship” with my maternal birth grandparents at a fairly young age. I also “knew” my birthmom, but never had a relationship with her. So for the most part, my adoption was as very open for the early 1970’s.

Was having that short stint of a relationship helpful? Nope. While I was able to get some answers, I was young, and didn’t really understand the scope of the relationship. I also had a hard time understanding why they didn’t want to see me anymore.

The above was one of my main reasons for having to think long and hard about open adoption when I became a birthmother in 1996. I wasn’t sure that I had the emotional fortitude to maintain a relationship with a child I had placed. I didn’t think I had what it took, but in the end, I decided that it was for the best…she deserved to have any part of me she wanted in her life…so I agreed to continued contact as her birthmother, it was the best decision I ever made.

I’m not sure how I feel as a perspective adoptive parent. I want an open adoption, a 100% open adoption, with visits and calls and such…but at the same time, I’m a little gun-shy from my experiences as an adoptee…I know how it made me feel.

I think if I were matched today, I would try very hard to create a relationship with the expectant mother…I think that connection has to be there before the birth. It was there for me as a birthmother…and I think that has made our relationship successful.

In the end, I believe that a committed open adoption is in the best interest of all children, if its possible…it isn’t always possible in all cases.

[hopefuladoptee]

As far as my personal experience, yes, what I went through growing up had a great deal to do with my wanting an open adoption with my son. For me, it's more of the fact that I wasn't given a choice. I don't know that I would want a relationship with my bmom and/or bfamily but it would have been nice to have the choice. At this point in time, it would be nice to just catch a glimpse of her just to know what she looks like. I'm trying to find her but I don't have the monetary resources to use a private detective and I'm not having much luck with my online searches. I guess that's why I'm a "hopefuladoptee". I don't want to hurt my afamily because they have really been wonderful (no matter how horrible I thought they were when I was a teenager ) but there is a void in my life and I feel like there is only thing that is going to fill it. I feel like I'm never going to be me until I meet them. I wonder if my bsister and I would argue like my asister and I do; would I be close to my bbrother; would we see each other weekly or just on holidays. I don't want my son to wonder about all that. I want him to know exactly how much his bmom loves him and how much he means to us. I want him to know all about his bfamily in case he ever has any health problems or just because he's curious. I'm not saying it may not bother me one day but I'm going to do my best to put his needs above my own and be happy for him that he wants to know. I see pictures of where school kids have done a family tree and hope that my son will do a bfamily tree and an afamily tree if he's ever asked.

And ask away! I can be much more honest with people I don't have to talk to face to face .

[Shoshana]

I wanted so badly to have an open domestic adoption -- being single kind of squashed that idea. I thought long and hard about my comfort in pursuing a 'closed' international adoption.

Even though I had a 'good life", even tho' I love my parents dearly, I was very aware I was adopted. I was very aware I didn't know who I looked like, my nationality - nada, zilch. I felt disconnected from other people - I felt like my placement in my family was just a random twist of fate. So yes, having ANY sort of information at all would have made my 'emotional work' SO much easier. You know, it wasn't the "why was I placed for adoption?" question, or even the "did she love me?" question -- my difficulty revolved totally around identity issues - I needed some sort of information that simply wasn't there. And that made my grade school and high school years very challenging.

God, I hope my daughter doesn't have the same questions I did. I hope I can help her if she does. I do have her birth mother's name, some family history, and a very wonderful, beautiful photo.

[BrandyHagz]

God, I hope my daughter doesn't have the same questions I did. I hope I can help her if she does. I do have her birth mother's name, some family history, and a very wonderful, beautiful photo.

Ya know Shoshana, I think even if she does, you’re likely to be more understanding, or even receptive to her issues.

I have a good friend who lives across the breezeway from me. Her husband, her and her four boys moved here for Guatemala City this past September. I’ve talked to her a lot about the country and adoptions and such… She was a school teacher there, and saw many young girls go thru the process.

She said that the Guatemalan people are very receptive to post adoption contact, even years later. She told me a story about a good friend of hers who lost her husband and couldn’t care for her children. She placed them, and they were adopted by a family outside of Guatemala (I failed to ask where). Anyway, she said when the kids got older, I assume in their teenage years, there is a language barrier…so again, I assume. Anyway, when the kids were older, the adoptive parents sought the birthmother out, and they had a wonderful relationship via mail, with some family vacations to the area to boot.

While its certainly not feasible to do something like that now for Xiomara, I thought it would be nice for you to knows that it does happen in Guatemala…in the event she decides she wants to search.

[Shoshana]

I do feel rather uniquely suited to help in this situation - I hope it's not just narcissism on my part

I also have a very strong desire to ensure that Xio becomes fluent in Spanish - And then we're going back! Whether to meet her birth mom, or just to tour - We WILL be in Guatemala again!

[NCMom]

I think if I were matched today, I would try very hard to create a relationship with the expectant mother…I think that connection has to be there before the birth. It was there for me as a birthmother…and I think that has made our relationship successful.

We had a close relationship with our childs Birthmother (before she decided to pull back), and our current Potential Birthmom is living with us. Long story. I have seen some posts that say they do not think that establishing a relationship with the birthmom is a good idea. It can be construed as coercive or cause the birthmom to relinquish even if she did not really want to because she did not want to hurt the A Parents. Those are valid points that I have taken to heart. But in my case, I had close relationships with these young ladies before they even got pregnant. I didn't think it made any sense to demote them to stranger status just because they picked us. But I drive the point home constantly. "If you decide to parent, it's 100% OK with us, just tell us so we can support you in that plan"

Every adoption is as different as every child. I would never presume to say which is better for someone else. But in MY particular case, I prefer 100% open. Just imagine how much time, energy and brain power can be freed up in their wonderful little heads not having to wonder: Who do I look like? Where did I come from? Why didn't my Mom keep me? Do I have siblings etc etc etc. No scanning the crowds for faces that look like them. No time, expense and emotional roller coaster of searching and reunion. No ever having to fret or worry if their A Parents are going to get their feelings hurt if they dare ask questions or search. Just having the ability to answer a medical form with 100% confidence for pitys sake!

If I am truly commited to having my adopted kids feel just like regular ol kids, and not "special" or "different" than I have to just suck it up, let go of my insecurities and give the rugrats the tools, information and the actual people in their lives so there are no mysteries. And speaking of mysteries, as an A Parent I much prefer having everything out in the open than waiting for the other shoe to drop. I prefer not to live in dread of the day when (after much anguish) my rugrat finally gets up the guts to say "Mom, I want to find my birthparents." Living in fear is no way to live.

Hugs! Laura

[Kelli]

Originally posted by hopefuladoptee

And ask away! I can be much more honest with people I don't have to talk to face to face .

Ok, hopeful, you've opened the door for me . . . I'm stepping out on faith here, you guys, with a ton of questions.

From the moment I heard about open adoption (the agency we used stressed the importance of maintaining semi-open arrangements) I have also wondered what some of the benefits are, vs. a semi-open arrangement, and how this belief came to be. I’m still left with a few observations and many questions.

I understand that this forum in general is not a total representation of the many different thoughts and feelings that adoptees have. However, from what I hear and read from some from the closed era, not only here, but in other literature as well, what seems to be the most troubling aspect, if anything does in regards to their adoption, is the lack of personal information, i.e. birthfamily info, medical info, physical resemblance, inherited traits or talents, etc. That makes so much sense to me! Many have said that in looking back, that had there been no secrets and if they knew this information and if it was freely discussed with them whenever they wanted to, this would have filled some of the spaces where there were previously blanks. Interestingly, the first thing I usually do not hear from adult adoptees that have assessed their childhood is that what they felt they really needed at the time was ongoing contact with their birthfamilies (maybe I’m just not reading or seeing the right information?). Where does this information that this is what young children really need derive from? And when I do read these kinds of stories from people who spent an unusual amount of time longing for their bparents, (rather than longing for dates, friends, sports, parties, music, and all the other things young people are typically involved in) it seems because of non-disclosure of information, some sort of mistreatment, or somehow being made to feel “less than”, by the aparents. I have seen these types of stories here, but in all fairness I have also seen stories from people who had “typical” childhoods and still wanted a relationship with their bparents. Again I realize this isn’t a full representation of all feelings and situations. Am I way off the mark? Is the bigger picture a lot different?

When I have previously asked the question here how one knows for a fact that “open” is really what’s best for a child, I’ve been shown fairly new research data (from organizations or person’s whose business or personal interest is tied to this belief) that stacks children in open situations, against children in closed situations or those with very little or no information in regards to their adoption. Since it’s already pretty commonly known that closed adoptions were not the best situations for most people because we’ve now heard it loud and clear directly from them, it doesn’t surprise me that this data would swing in favor of fully open. I have never seen a study that shows or indicates why an open situation would be more beneficial for a child then a semi-open one with information available, an avenue to receive more information, and the ability to contact the bfamily when the child chooses to do so. Is there such information out there yet? Finally, is it just me, or does it almost seem to be a taboo subject to even discuss or consider that the current industry wide belief that open arrangements are what’s best or more beneficial for a child could also subsequently be a beneficial thing for the birthfamilies, and to the "industry" part of adoption, as well?

Even though I see this is technically a debate thread, I’m not looking to debate or dispute anyone’s belief that an open situation is what they feel is best for themselves or their children and I’m certainly not saying it’s not a wonderful and positive thing. Just here to learn so I can make informed decisions on my daughter’s behalf for her life and her future.

Peace and blessings,

Kelli

[hopefuladoptee]

Kelli,

It's time for me to go home on Friday afternoon so I hope you won't mind if I wait until Monday to post my reply to your question. I hit the road at exactly 5:00 pm everyday and don't wait around for anything!

[Aneni]

How does semi-open adoption benefit the child?

In several ways, just like open adoption: Both the adoptive parents and the child have access to medical information about the birthparents now and in the future. The child knows the birthparents are maintaining an interest in their well-being. If visits are included in the semi-open adoption arrangement, the child and birthparents have direct contact. (They might not know the birthparents' last names or their exact address, and there will probably be a neutral present, but that face-to-face contact occurs.)

There are more indirect ways that semi-open adoption may benefit the child depending on individual situations. I don't see this discussed much on the forums, but a number of birthparents have significant emotional and/or behavioral issues they struggle with, and which contributed to their decision to place a child for adoption. These issues can be beyond the ability of either the adoptive parents OR the birthparents to handle on their own. Thus, a semi-open adoption, in which an agency acts as an intermediary, can be very beneficial to the child. For one, the adoptive parents who might, under an open adoption arrangment, simply shut down all contact because of perceived concerns about the birthparents, may continue contact with the birthparents in a semi-open arrangement because they know there are safeguards and/or help in place from an intermediary.

There are birthmothers who do not want direct contact with the child they placed. Period. But they still want to be assured the child is loved and well cared for. And they want to know the adoptive parents speak of them with respect and honor. Semi-open adoption may be the best arrangement for them.

Hopefully, I don't leave the impression that I believe open adoption should be the presumed arrangement unless there is a problem that warrants semi-open. What I believe is that each triad group needs to make the arrangement that works for them and not feel the need to justify to others why they chose the arrangement they did.

Well-meaning people (including experts) decided in the 1920s that closed adoptions were in the best interests of the children, the adoptive parents and the birthparents. I believe there is a consensus now that they were mistaken. (Before the 1920s, adoptions were generally open.)

Today, many well-meaning people (including experts) believe that open adoption is THE arrangement that is in the best interests of the children, the adoptive parents and the birthparents.

As another poster put it, however, it is too soon to say for sure. Additionally, there are not yet (to my knowledge) any research-based guidelines to help people make informed decisions about designing or evaluating a healthy open adoption arrangement.

Again, I believe people need to make the arrangement that best fits their respective needs and abilities.

[BrandyHagz]

However, from what I hear and read from some from the closed era, not only here, but in other literature as well, what seems to be the most troubling aspect, if anything does in regards to their adoption, is the lack of personal information, i.e. birthfamily info, medical info, physical resemblance, inherited traits or talents, etc. That makes so much sense to me! Many have said that in looking back, that had there been no secrets and if they knew this information and if it was freely discussed with them whenever they wanted to, this would have filled some of the spaces where there were previously blanks.

Absolutely! I think having the basic information is a great start. In my opinion, I think that’s the basis of a “semi-open” adoption. It provides information for the birthparents, and for the adoptee, without the face to face contact. In its basic form, I believe that is where “open adoptions” came from…sharing of information for the benefit of the child.

Interestingly, the first thing I usually do not hear from adult adoptees that have assessed their childhood is that what they felt they really needed at the time was ongoing contact with their birthfamilies (maybe I’m just not reading or seeing the right information?). Where does this information that this is what young children really need derive from?

I think each adoptee is different. As I said in my above post, I gleaned as much information as I could from my “birthfamily” when I was younger…and I mean young, I think I was around six or seven when I first met my birthmothers parents and my half brother. I wouldn’t give up the time for anything in the world. It explained a lot of mannerisms…at least for me. While I don’t think its absolutely necessary to have face to face interaction in the triad, I do think that it adds another element, a bonus if you will, not only for the child, but for the adoptive parents too…I cant tell you the number of emails I’ve received from my daughters parents saying, “Well, you can definitely tell she’s your daughter today…(add character trait here).” I would have loved to know where all my little quirks come from!

And when I do read these kinds of stories from people who spent an unusual amount of time longing for their bparents, (rather than longing for dates, friends, sports, parties, music, and all the other things young people are typically involved in) it seems because of non-disclosure of information, some sort of mistreatment, or somehow being made to feel “less than”, by the aparents. I have seen these types of stories here, but in all fairness I have also seen stories from people who had “typical” childhoods and still wanted a relationship with their bparents. Again I realize this isn’t a full representation of all feelings and situations. Am I way off the mark? Is the bigger picture a lot different?

Wow, I don’t think I have ever known someone who was in such turmoil over not knowing their biological family, not saying that it doesn’t happen, but that seems pretty extreme.

I cant really offer much insight on this, because as I said, I had some contact…

I can tell you that this last summer, I tried to reconnect with my birthfamily because I was feeling especially alone. I have little to no contact with my adoptive family, and I guess I was trying to fill that void. Either way, the attempt failed miserably, like I knew it would…

I honestly believe that an adoptees “desire” to search for the birthfamily, and the intensity in which search is conducted is in direct correlation with the type of relationship they have with their adoptive families.

You’ll see a large number of well adjusted adoptees here on the forum that search and/or use an intermediary to search for their birthfamily, and the manner in which the search is done is more of a passive intrest, more for the answers than the relationship itself.

You’ll also see posts made by adoptees searching for mommy…I believe that these are most likely the people who probably didn’t have the greatest family growing up…

There are also a lot of adoptees that fit somewhere in the middle of both.

I think that most adoptees probably wonder about their birthfamilies and would like some sort of information, whether that’s medical or genetics…you’ll find a number of posts on the forum from adoptees that only want information, and don’t wish to have additional contact. Again, I think each adoptee is different.

When I have previously asked the question here how one knows for a fact that “open” is really what’s best for a child, I’ve been shown fairly new research data (from organizations or person’s whose business or personal interest is tied to this belief) that stacks children in open situations, against children in closed situations or those with very little or no information in regards to their adoption. Since it’s already pretty commonly known that closed adoptions were not the best situations for most people because we’ve now heard it loud and clear directly from them, it doesn’t surprise me that this data would swing in favor of fully open. I have never seen a study that shows or indicates why an open situation would be more beneficial for a child then a semi-open one with information available, an avenue to receive more information, and the ability to contact the bfamily when the child chooses to do so. Is there such information out there yet?

I think any study showing the long term affects of open adoption on a child are a bit premature. At this point, open adoption is in its infancy. Most of the children in the very first waves of open adoption are still fairly young, and may not even have a grasp on how their relationship with their birthfamily affected them. I think any study that you see now is a work in progress, just like open adoption.

In regards to your comment regarding the childs decision to have contact, I’d like to ask a quick question if I could. At what point would you honor the childs wishes for contact? Theoretically of course, assuming you were to do a semi-open adoption, with the understanding that it would open up, if the child wished it so. Would you allow contact at age 5? 8? 10? Or 18? I think that would be the first hurdle to overcome, at least for me.

At any rate, I think when a study is done on “Open Adoption” the usually lump them all together in one big study…I don’t think they study them individually…but I could be wrong here.

Finally, is it just me, or does it almost seem to be a taboo subject to even discuss or consider that the current industry wide belief that open arrangements are what’s best or more beneficial for a child could also subsequently be a beneficial thing for the birthfamilies, and to the "industry" part of adoption, as well?

I’m not sure I understand what your asking, are you saying you believe that the industries fixation on “open adoption” is a for the benefit of the birthparents?

Even though I see this is technically a debate thread, I’m not looking to debate or dispute anyone’s belief that an open situation is what they feel is best for themselves or their children and I’m certainly not saying it’s not a wonderful and positive thing. Just here to learn so I can make informed decisions on my daughter’s behalf for her life and her future.

Questions and information gathering quests are always welcome!

Feel free to post anymore that you might have!

[Kelli]

Brandy, thank you for your response to my avalanche of questions and for clarifying some things for me.

Wow, I don’t think I have ever known someone who was in such turmoil over not knowing their biological family, not saying that it doesn’t happen, but that seems pretty extreme.

I thought these types of feelings seemed a little extreme too, but since I'm not "walking a mile in those shoes" I'm not in a position to really say for sure. I remember when I first joined how horrified I felt while reading some adoptee stories. Some said they were in such emotional turmoil that it effected all aspects of their lives and they spent much of their time feeling like outsiders looking in. I'll never forget these types of posts because I remember vowing to do anything and everything I could do to ensure that my daughter would not feel that way.

In regards to your comment regarding the childs decision to have contact, I’d like to ask a quick question if I could. At what point would you honor the childs wishes for contact? Theoretically of course, assuming you were to do a semi-open adoption, with the understanding that it would open up, if the child wished it so. Would you allow contact at age 5? 8? 10? Or 18? I think that would be the first hurdle to overcome, at least for me.

That's a good question and one that I ask myself. I think I'll have to respond accordingly based on the time, manner, and reasons behind asking. For example, is it 10 year old curiosity, or is it 16 year old rebellion and anger. It may not make a difference and "yes" might be the answer in both situations if we feel it's the best thing for her. I guess this is a "wait and see" situation for me.

At any rate, I think when a study is done on “Open Adoption” the usually lump them all together in one big study…I don’t think they study them individually…but I could be wrong here.

That makes sense which is why I probably haven't seen anything specifically geared towards semi-open. Thanks.

I’m not sure I understand what your asking, are you saying you believe that the industries fixation on “open adoption” is a for the benefit of the birthparents?

I'll tread lightly on this one No, I don't feel like "open" is all for the benefit of the birthparents, however, I do believe it IS a favorable piece of the puzzle, for some birthparents nonetheless, and it seems almost taboo to even suggest or discuss it. I think the "business" is more successful, because this is a piece they can market too. Similiarly, I find it interesting that it also seems taboo to even suggest or discuss that aparents have very little choice if they want to be parents through adoption. Either you "get" along or you "go" along. The self-serving desire to be mothers, fathers, and have families of our own, when in some instances, it's the only choice in family-building, is a big motivator in doing this. IMO, all these things are hidden under the umbrella called "Doing what's best for the child." All of this, of course, are just my opinions based on some of my own observations.

Questions and information gathering quests are always welcome!

Feel free to post anymore that you might have!

Thank you for your helpful perspective and insight.

Kelli

[hopefuladoptee]

I think maybe I see a semi-open adoption a little differently than one of the posters. She said something about an agency being involved to mediate. I see it as more of a "relationship" between the bparents and aparents that the child isn't necessarily involved in. Maybe the aparents send pictures and updates to the bmother and/or bfather but the child doesn't have a relationship with them until later and only then if they ask. We almost adopted a baby a few years ago where this is what the bmother requested. The woman in charge of the home where the girl was living said this was the norm in semi-open adoptions. Until we met our son's bfamily, I thought this was the only way to adopt. Being adopted myself, I am extremely aware of my own insecurities and frankly didn't know if I could handle the "rejection" of my child wanting to meet their bparents. This seemed like the best of all worlds for me. Then we met this family. They seem to share our views whether religious, political, or social and it just works for us. As I said, not many people understand it and think we should have gone with little or no contact. My husband and I both feel like in the long run, it will only help our son. He's not going to have to wonder why he's so much taller than everyone in our family or why he's so "stout" when none of us are. All he'll have to do is look at his extended family and see where he gets whatever he's wondering about. And believe me there will be no doubts. He is the spitting image of his bgrandfather! I do feel like a semi-open adoption is better than a closed adoption simply because you can find out about medical information and you don't have to spend hundreds of dollars trying to track down your bfamily when you're ready. I can tell you from personal experience that an open adoption has worked wonders for my brother; I don't know any other adopted person who is as sure of himself as my brother. He doesn't really have a relationship with his bmother (my cousin) by his choice. She has been pregnant 5 times and has given the first 2 up for adoption, kept one, had a miscarriage and kept the last one. Her third child though has chosen to live with his dad and I think her last one would too but she feels sorry for her mom so she stays. Oh yeah! All 5 had different fathers so she's a real great example for all our family . So there may not have been any studies of how semi-open or open adoptions affect the children but I'm convinced most of the children you speak with would say it has been a positive one. I know there are many things we as parents need to decide for our children and I don't think the child is ready to make the decision too early but I don't think we should choose whether they have a relationship with their bfamily for them. I think if they feel comfortable with having a relationship we should help foster than relationship as much as possible. I look at my current foster (soon to be adopted) child and see that neither her bmother or bfather want any contact with her. Well, that's not entirely true. Her bmother wants contact but she wants it on her terms and isn't willing to do things the way DFACS wants her to. She thinks she can raise a child while working at Waffle House and moving from family member to family member. She may grow up wondering why her bfamily isn't as involved as her brother's bfamily and it may cause more problems for her. I guess her's is kind of like a semi-open adoption in a way except that we won't be keeping in touch with the bmother. I would gladly though if only she would show some kind of interest. I would love to be able to tell D one day that I know exactly where her bmother lives and what she's doing now and that we can contact her and see if she wants to see her. But that probably won't happen. We are lucky though that our son's bfamily wants her to call them Popa and Grammy just like all their other grandchildren do and are including her in things for the grandchildren. It reinforces how wonderful this thing is for us.