[debsdone]

Obviously this is a very personal issue. First, I think all the references to not "looking" jewish is just another way of saying something else......that all the different nationalities that are being represented are good to see. It is more than that, but I don't seem to have the words right now. Re: converting babies......For myself, it is important that a child be raised with a faith. Any change that same child would choose to bring about as an adult would then be his/her choice. But "belonging" is very important. I personally find much comfort in tradition...to a point. Anyways, our children will be who they will be. We simply guide them the best we can. And if religion is a part of that guidance, that is great. If it isn't, that is fine too. I just personally have always felt it was important to provide a good solid foundation for my kids to build on. I have always said that if they find another truth as adults, I will honor it. I may need to be reminded of that promise if and when it ever happens! LOL Love, Debi

[Carol Bird]

My daughter was raised Jewish and always thought I was. When we reunited in 1986 and she discovered that both her birthfather and I were raised Catholic and were of Italian and Irish ancestry, she opted for a Micvah to officially convert to Judiasm; in spite of the fact that she had a Bat Mitzvah when she was 13 and had been a member of a Temple (Conservative) all of her life.

Although my son in law is not Jewish, he made it a point to familiarize himself with the Faith before he and Susan married, and I did the same thing when she and I reunited.

I was an honored member of the family (the THIRD Grandma) at both of my granddaughters' Bat Mitzvahs and am very proud to be a part of her wonderful family.

Hugs, Carol Bird

[Bonnie S.]

Actually the article referenced in this thread says:

"The answer is based on the Talmudic principle, zachin leadam shelo befanav, "we can act to someone's advantage even without their permission." (Ketubbot 11a) However, at the age of Bar/ Bat Mitzvah, the child has the right either to reaffirm or to protest the conversion. Many rabbis see the Bar/ Bat Mitzvah ceremony itself as a reaffirmation, thus giving it special significance for an adopted child."

[spaypets]

Deb is right, the point of my post was to say that in my temple my child is not the only non-European child and wondering if this was true in other places. Of course, there are Jews in all corners of the world, including India where my daughter is from, but in the United States, most Jews are northern European and, as a result, often have general similarities in appearance.

There's a bit of an inside joke going on too, that I suppose isn't clear to those who weren't raised Jewish and that's that it used to be if you were blonde and blue-eyed you didn't "look Jewish."

While my daughter's conversion might not be recognized by the very orthordox because it wasn't performed by an orthodox rabbi, it isn't my intention that she be orthodox. And, by extension, if she decides to be orthodox, she will have the knowlege to convert again.

If I didn't convert her she wouldn't be Jewish in anyone's eyes except for the most liberal Reform (I am a Conservative Jew by belief but I attend a Reform Temple because it is the only nearby synagogue with a full-time rabbi -- I live in a very rural area) rabbis. My own rabbi expressed a preference for converting adopted children rather than just raising them Jewish.

I consider converting my daughter a gift to her, not something I imposed. To not convert her because she's adopted, when any child I gave birth to would automatically be a Jew, would be to religate her to second best in my view. If being Jewish is something I value (and it is) then why would I not bring my own child into the fold?

Obviously when she is an adult, she, like I, will choose the path she wants to take. It is my hope that she remains Jewish and raises Jewish children. So it is up to me to provide the education, faith and culture that will encourage such a choice -- just like I would teach any value I held dear.

It's not a matter of "satisfying my need to parent a child that's my religion." It's a matter of sharing my beliefs, culture and life with my daughter.

[Shoshana]

i will have my child converted for the same reasons you innumerated. -- so that she will belong to the jewish faith, just like bio children belong. i am very happy to 'impose' these values on her.

nice post :-)

[gamzultova]

What you have to say is interesting and I thank you for your responses. I would love to explore it more, but feel I am walking a fine line and do not want to offend anyone.
Therefore, I will just say to all those who are Jewish- I hope all 3 holidays are wonderful (Succos, Sh'mini Azeres, and Simchas Torah)!!!!!!

[34andhopeful]

I really so not want to offend anyone, But to reply to the original post "funny, you do not look jewish" I thought that being jewish was a religion not an ethnicity. Please correct me if this AA jew is mistaken. Plus, I was born in England, so imagine the funny looks I have received.

[spaypets]

The fact that you are AA and Jewish, proves my point, that the silly phrase "Funny, you don't look Jewish" is even more irrelevant than it was 40 years ago. It was an attempt at humor -- sarcasm, irony. If that wasn't clear and you thought I seriously meant that there was a particular Jewish look, I apologize. In fact, I was saying the opposite.

But as I said, in the United States, most Jews are northern European by ethnicity, therefore until recently most congregations were made up of white European looking people. I had noticed in the past 5 years that was no longer the case and this year in particular (what makes this particularly striking in my case is I live in a predominately white state). I was asking if this were the case elsewhere.

I asked because I hoped my daughter, born in India and now Jewish, would no longer be unique in not being of Eurpean decent. In the Jewish community of my youth she would have been the ONLY child of color. To my delight, that is no longer the case--even in my rural community. She isn't unique in a) being adopted, or b) being non-European.

Once again, I apologize for any confusion. I thought it was clear I was being light hearted and mocking a phrase as common and silly as "Some of my best friends are...(pick your minority)."

[Friedsheph]

In reference to your interest in sending your daughter to functions and camps that are interracial Jewish camps, I have one idea for you.
Last summer I attended a Hebrew "camp" at Brandeis (in Boston) and, while I was there, Brandeis was holding it's Jewish Identity Camp for students 14-18 (I think that's the age bracket). I forget what the camp is called, but we Hebrew students were all surprised at the multi-ethnic make-up of that camp. The camp strives to teach kids to be proud of their Jewish Identity and the kids seemed to become VERY close by the end of their camp. I plan to send my children there when they are old enough.
-Jackie

[yael]

I'm going to jump in here, though I am an orthodox Jew (who, by the way, converted to Judaism) and I have a particular perspective. Your question is interesting, too. What you look like has NOTHING to do with whether you are Jewish or not. According to Jewish law (which orthodox Jews follow), a particular kind of conversion has to take place for a non-Jewish person to be Jewish. Three rabbis have to preside and a dip in the mikvah is necessary among other things.

As far as people getting excited that Jews come in all colors, that has always been the case (Ethiopian Jews, for example, are black). I think people are reacting to feeling good that others are doing what they themselves have done and paid no attention to a color/race barrier when they adopted. Everyone likes a little company in their choices.

Yael

[Friedsheph]

Not that it is QUITE the same as being an African American or Indian Jew, but I am a blond haired, blue eyed Jew and I have heard, "You don't LOOK Jewish," all my life. My entire family is short with very dark hair and I managed to come out tall and blond. But my great-grandmother who was straight from Autria was also blond-haired and blue eyed. I think that in many ways society (we Jews included) is still clinging to racial stereotypes about Jews that have been used to profile us throughout history.
Although it is a pain to have to laugh and say, "Well, I AM Jewish," every time the subject comes up, I do feel that it helps to break down people's misconceptions about Jews looking and acting a certain way.
Jackie

[twogreeneyes]

Can someone please tell me, what does a Jew looks like? ...

what does a Jew look like?

I am Jewish and very proud to be the parent of 4 adopted children. Twin boys who are iter-racial, caucasion and dominican, and 2 girls, caucasion. My husband was raised Catholic but has not practiced religion since he was 12.

All four children were given hebrew names, and have certiificates to prove it...However, when it came time for BarMitzvah, I learned that was not enough. Being raised in a house-hold that practices reform Judiasm, circumcison-at age 5-due to handicap) and having been named in temple, means nothing!

When it was time for Hebrew School, and the costs were outrageous--(multiplied by two sons had to join temple, sunday school extras, hebrew lessons extra) I opted for private tutorials. When it came time to do services in a temple, there were none that would have us, unless we wanted to pay large fees...(Over $3,000 for Sat morning Torah reading). Even if we paid the large fees there were questions as to whether they were Jewish.

It was at that point that my son refused to go back to tutorials to learn about being Jewish. Added to this was an issue about the color of his skin...He is dark. (So are Israeli's). (He actually made me cry when he said that no one would want to come to see a black boy read torah)...

Our family was turned off--Whatever we had done for years no longer mattered?

Now, my children know that I am Jewish and that makes them Jewish. We celebrate (things I learned from my childhood--especially the foods, but no longer wish to go to "G-d's House. "


I now teach that it is important to believe that God exists, you do not have to look at the ceiling of a religious building to believe He his there. It is what is in your heart, it is that you follow the 10 commandments, it is humility and Humanity that makes you a good person.

Yes, I would have loved to go to Temple on Fri nite/Sat morning. The gathering of the few..a community of many. But, because I do believe in God, I feel this is the way he wants it...NO HARM DONE, just different.

Bless you all.

[spaypets]

I'm so sorry you were treated shabbily. I can assure you where I live we would welcome you with open arms. I'm always shocked at fees at suburban synagogues.

Perhaps you could try again? Maybe things have changed?

I know in some communities the local JCC's are a good way to be part of the community. In fact, that's where I went to Hebrew school instead of being part of a synagogue (back in those days the Conservative shul wasn't friendly to converts -- that was before they got a rabbi with 2 AA children).

[twogreeneyes]

Thank you for your caring, concern and input. There is a JCC close by, bu they do not offer Hebrew School-Bar Mitzvah training.

Besides, it is too late! the boys will be 17 tomorrow, my Middle daughter was 13 in November and the 10 year old is developmentally delayed and is haveing enough problems just learning English!

Giving the children the best foundation I can has been a salvation.

I suppose I really wanted to point out that just being named in temple is probably not the same as a conversion

[spaypets]

While B'nai mitzvahs traditionally happen at 12 (girls) and 13 (boys) the ceremonies can happen at any age! Technically, just being called to read from the Torah is a B'nai mitzvah.

One of the most moving things I ever witnessed was the Bat Mitzvahs of women in their 50s -- they'd been raised in a time and community where women weren't called to read from the Torah.

My rabbi (an adoptive mom) actually became a rabbi because she had to teach her dyslex son in preparation for his bar mitzvah. By the time she was done it started her on her career as a spiritual leader.

At any rate, I never had a Bat Mitzvah ceremony because of the tradition I was raised in -- you can still make the community part of your children's lives. The younger kids can participate in youth groups, they could go to Jewish summer camp and your boys might want to check out Hillel when they get to college.

In fact, my family, because of where we lived, rarely went to services -- we were never part of a synagogue community but we were part of the Jewish community (my brother even married a girl he met at Jewish summer camp!).