[Mamakin]

For those that have adopted already, what are your views on going on a small (5 day) vaction from anytime you come home, up to about a month after returning? Has anyone done this? I have heard that you shouldn't do this and should take at least 2 months of staying home with the child/ren to let them get adjusted. The reason I'm asking is because we will be going to Ukraine probaly in July/August (adopting 2 over 2yo)and we usually go camping with about 20 families (my brother & I grew up with) for Labor Day. I'm not sure if it would be ok to this. Has anybody done this and do you think it would be ok to do so?

Thanks!!

[EJsDad]

Well, this will really depend on your child and his/her ability to adjust to their new surroundings. Some children need a lot longer time to bond with parents and to get used to a different surroundings - others take less time.

Our son adjusted remarkably well to his new environment upon returning home, so we could have probably taken a vacation a month or so after returning; however, I can tell you that my wife and I were exhausted (both physically and emotionally) after returning home and it took us about 3 months or so for things to get back to normal for us.

You may need to wait to see about all these factors before planning a trip in advance.

Good luck!

[ll_bay]

We went on a vacation to visit relatives about 3-4 months after our daughters came home. It started out ok, but soon ended up being too much for them. They regressed, and got overstimulated VERY easily which immediately led to rages, or if we were lucky, more minor meltdowns. They were older, 3 and 6, and were still experiencing a lot of culture shock, frustration with communication and the language barrier, adjustment to us as their parents, etc. If we had it to do over, we'd probably still take the trip, but would be a lot firmer about saying no to too many outings and activities and yes to sticking to our home routine as much as possible. We're both originally from the area we visited, and everyone wanted to meet the kids and show or give them stuff. That's what we did wrong- we simply should've said no to all but a very few of the invitations and offers.
HTH

[Mamakin]

Thank you both for your replies, I'll take your experiences and will take it day by day. Not sure if we'll be going or not, but we'll see.
We've even shortened the trip from 5 days to 3 1/2 so we're either not gone that long or if we can't go at all, we won't lose that much money.

Thanks again!!

[spaypets]

We were home about six weeks when we visited my brother's family for a weekend. Everything was fine, except as I was buckling DD into the car to leave and saying goodbye to my brother's family DD misunderstood and thought I was staying and saying good bye to her. She was very upset. Even in July (she came home in May) when we visited my mother for a weekend, she was extra clingy. Be prepared for that and avoid leaving your child with any one else.

I think it's smart to make the trip very short.

[mgibson]

I tend to agree - really watch your child and maybe be a bit overprotective at this stage of transition. Dont let others hold the baby if he/she acts the least little bit upset. Keep contact with people that wont be regulars in the childs life to a minimum. I wish I would have just been rude and told folks to not visit, have parties, etc. We had two showers and several uninvited visitors after we brought the kids home (within the first 2 weeks) on every occasion our toddler (then 17M) would get very stressed. We opted just to get some of these social obligations out of the way early, but it was difficult. He would bang his head on the floor, furniture as a reaction to stress and we always had set backs with this when his routine changed, or new people came around. He stopped bangin his head after about 3 months home - now he's just a regular throw yourself on the floor and kick and scream tantrum type on those rare occasions when things get to be too much . But then it was very obvious when he was frightened or overstimulated. Even now a year later, when my dad and his wife come to stay with us, both kids get wild by the end of their trip due to the change in routine and everyday schedules.

The early childhood intervention specialist told us that for every day of change or stress you'll have at least two days of behavioral set backs. I'm sure that isnt a scientific statement, but boy I've found it to be true with ours. Play it by ear tho. Our baby girl (9m when first at home) loved attention. Each new person was another she could get to hold her while she jumped and moved her legs. She was not at all troubled by new people - some sounds frightened her. But we would have had no problems with her at that point. Our issues with her were trying to make her a little more dependent on us rather that making her feel secure so she would be less so (like with our son). Each child is different.

Good luck,

Melissa

[MkMw]

Hi there!

I know with the Ukraine you are dealing with older children and some language barriers. BUT I think if you keep some consistencies - blankets, a toy, clothes, and as hard as it is stick to a routine, you shouldn't have any problems. (IMHO)

We brought our sons "home" (in South Africa) to a B&B when they were 16 days old (from the hospital). BEFORE they were 4 1/2 months old we had gone on 4 short trips (3 times to a pediatricial approved game park, and to Cape Town) we changed B&B, spent a week in Johannesburg, flew to Virginia stayed for 1 month then went to Alaska for 6 weeks. I think kids (of all ages) are more resilient than we give them credit for.

However, we never, ever varied (well one time, but never again) the boys night time routin no matter how tired we were - bath, books, bed.

[paperchasingmom]

From what I've just learned, I would definitely wait on your camping trip, or any trip--if I'm understanding correctly you're going to adopt 2 children-wow, that's quite an undertaking and camping with lots of other people doesn't really give you the privacy of having a hotel room or somewhere quiet and seperate should your children need it....

My first thought is, maybe this is too much stimulation too soon for this kind of adoption, international with toddlers.....much different than a newborn adoption....

You have to understand that these older children have already had several disruptions in their life and they need time with just you and your husband only....they need to learn that you and your husband are now their new parents and introducing them to alot of new people will interrupt that cycle of bonding and attachment you're trying to promote.....

I know this might sound cruel and think, well, it's just a few days, but, my thought is, from what I now know, they shouldn't see anyone except you and your husband for quite a while....plus, alot of these children, (maybe not yours) but alot of these children haven't even really been outside and the sounds at night and all the people and other children might scare them and if they don't scare them it will definitely overstimulate them and get you off track of the routine you're trying to get them used to.

I would have thought just like you, other than a few weeks ago my husband and I took a wonderful 8 hour adoptive training session with a SW regarding bonding and attachment and international adoptions and all the realities and challenges aparents and their children encounter....some of them were hard to hear--especially when she told us to not let anyone else hold our daughter for quite a while--(how do I tell my mother and my mother-in-law that!!!! :eek ) But now I understand why.....our child, who will be probably a year and a half old, she needs to learn that we are her parents now and learn that we are the ones to comfort her needs for now so we can best establish this trust issue we have to overcome....so she can learn to trust us and know that we will fulfill her needs.....thus creating a healthy cycle of bonding and attachment.

Plus, like your children, our daughter is coming from another country and new sights, new sounds, new language, new color of people (my husband and I), everything and to get her finally used to us only to bring her somewhere else, like you in your camping trip, might not be in the best interest of your child....not right now, maybe 6 months from now or next year.....

Also, it was pretty much recommended to us that a family bed, co sleeping, would also be in the best interest of our child when she arrives home--it's such an easy, wonderful way to bond with them....

But, as far as the camping trip, it definitely is something that you'd have to, at the very least, wait until you're with your little ones to see how their adjusting to life here with you....I don't think this decision can be made without having them here yet....

I think our trainer just gave us a new awareness of truly what our child will be going through-how she will be greiving for the life she knew and the people she knew that were taking care of her and to realize that these children are not like biological children that we've raised since birth and have bonded with since the womb and basically they've had difficult, difficult times in their lives and we can't expect them to be these perfect little people when we get them.....as she put it, our gain is from their loss.....and they're going to be experiencing this....and even for the children that seem to be okay and go to everybody happily, her thought was, that wasn't the best thing because she felt that the child wasn't properly bonding to the parent, if they were bonding to everyone else too....there wasn't that strong, strong bond that needed to be there, her to us, if our child was reaching out to everyone all the time--that's why she was trying to teach us the importance of our child only bonding to us in the beginning....to teach her who her lifelong parents are.

I know it might be hard to fully comprehend how a little 3 day trip could be detrimental to your child, but, if you'd like more info you can pm me and I can give you the name of the SW who can email you a little more information regarding this....okay?

Hope this helps a little......

Otherwise, relax, sit back, enjoy those little ones and feel blessed!!!!

Melody

[Mamakin]

Hi Melody, thanks for you post. After quite a few emails from people and placing this post on a few other boards, I realized that if we adopt 2 children, we are definately NOT going. I realize how hard it will be on everyone. If we only adopt one child, I'm still going to see how well he does at home and with us and also how well my daughter does. I also have to take her into consideration as well. I'm just going to play it by ear. If we get back too close to the trip, then I know we're not going. Thanks for the help, I really appreciate it.

[hjdeth]

This depends SOOO much on the child.

With my first 2 adopted kids, we got stuck in Warsaw for 6 days due to 9/11 on our way home. They just didn't do well with ANY changes in routine for several months. I didn't take them on a vacation for about 6 months. They really needed the stability of their own beds. They were 5.6yo and 6.9yo at adoption.

My 3rd adopted child is just the opposite. He likes his bed, but so long as his pillow travels with him and bedtime is at the same time every night, life is glorious. We got home from Ukraine on 12/5/02 and headed to my parent's for Christmas vacation on 12/12/02. 3 weeks of driving cross-country in a van with myself and 4 kids and staying at 3 different relatives' houses didn't make a dent in his life....other than to find new family to tell him how awesome he is. He was 6.6yo at adoption. Now, the other 2 kids, home about 15months then, had several meltdowns and were over-stimulated to the max.

With my newest daughter, we arrived home at Thanksgiving last year and traveled to Florida for a 2-week Christmas vacation less than 1 month later. Again, so long as morning and night routines were followed, no problem. She was 7.4yo at adoption.

Some changes did have to be made to my normal "drive to vacation" routine. More potty stops, some "wiggle" stops, no more driving straight through on a 1000 mile trip. But you know, I have seen more of the in-between country in the last 3 years than I saw in the previous 20 years, so not a bad thing.

We go camping often in the summer. The kids love it...no TV, no video games, no phones...just outside fun and music. It allows you time to "smell the roses" with your kids that you may not always have during the normal workweek. You would be amazed how wonderful and beneficial to bonding an afternoon nap in the sunshine can be.

So, make your decision after you have met your children. If they can handle it, go. If not, don't.

[paperchasingmom]

I would agree with Hannah with the fact that an afternoon of sunshine and the outdoors for a quiet nap with just you guys would be wonderful, unfortunately, your scenario is camping with 20 OTHER FAMILIES so I don't see a whole lot of peace and quiet there for the children should you and they need it......different than if you were camping by yourselves, you know.....

I was thinking though Mamakin, your last post mentioned a daughter already at home--is it possible to let her go camping even if you don't think the other children can right now--since it's your brother I believe you said you go camping with along with other families--this would be wonderful for your daughter to get special one on one time with other family members-especially because she might be a little jealous in the beginning of having to share you with other children now. Plus it would also let you bond with your two little ones quietly at home for a while while she's away camping. Is that a possibility? I would hate for her to miss out on something fun if she doesn't have to. I don't know how old she is, but what do you think?

Blessings,

Melody

[Mamakin]

Hi Melody, my daughter is 4 yrs old and I'm not sure if she would go without us. I haven't even thought of it, but it might be a good idea. As far as the going with 20 other families. Yes, we do go with a lot of people, but what's great about it is that we are usually going in different directions and if we want quiet time, we usually just stay on our site and no one bothers with us other than the occasional visit of that one person passing by every now and again. Or we just go down to the lake or take a stroll through the woods along the paths. I love that idea of an afternoon nap that hjdeth said. We do that a lot because after the kiddos go to bed, we usually stay up and play cards or just sit and talk, then we're up at the crack of dawn. So an afternoon nap is usually in order sometimes and it's really nice to do that. Unfortunately my daughter doesn't nap anymore. I guess if we go maybe that'll be a nice extra bonding time. Thanks everyone for your replies and your help, I really appreciate it. I'm just going to wait and see what happens.

Thanks again~~