[bardsanddog]

Hi we are looking for agencies that allow for two adoptions or pregnancies during the process. We area lready adopting ,and we are lokking into agencies for future adoptions.Thanks

[csw]

Hi,
There are quite a few countries that let you adopt two (or even more) unrelated or related silbings, twins etc.. Kazakhstan allows two, Guatemala allows two at once.. rmember the fee's are essentially doubled also, but for siblings you usually only have to do one dossier. Good luck, Cathy

[lisker2003]

Many agencies do not permit simultaneous adoption of unrelated children, or adoption within a year of the entry of a biological child into the home, for the reason that each child (whether bio or adopted) deserves a year as the only new child in the family, to facilitate adjustment on all sides. The simultaneous adoption of children with no prior relationship to one another can be very hard on the children as well as on the family. It can be difficult enough for a family to adjust to a single internationally adopted child, and vice-versa; adopting two at once, when the children have no preexisting connection to one another, can make it even harder on everyone. We have experience adopting older siblings, and in their case, their preexisting strong bond facilitated the adjustment for them both, but I can't imagine adopting non-sibs at the same time. I would think long and hard about the reason that so many agencies frown on the simultaneous adoption of unrelated children, or on permitting pregnancies during the adoption process. These are not random, arbitrary rules; they are made to protect children and families.

[csw]

Hi Lisker,
What is generally the case in Guatemala, is that when you have a referral for two, they are immediately placed in the same foster home,,so they do have at least 4-12 months to be with each other,,also..I think I would have much rather adopted two when in Peru, than have to go through all of the paperwork etc..again..I had to live in Peru over six months while the paperwork was being processed and I know I could have easily taken care of a second child while over there and would have been "done".. You are right, there are pro's and con's to each side..thanks for sharing...Cathy

[lisker2003]

I know that it's extremely appealing, from the parents' point of view, to adopt two at once, to limit paperwork and travel hassles, and possibly to save a bit of money, but this may not be in the best interests of the child or the family in the long run, unless the children are biologically related, and would be best served by staying together. Putting the children in the same foster home for several months before adoption is certainly a good idea, but I think it's still unfair to expect unrelated children to have a strong connection to one another. Some kids may develop one, but some may not, and if they don't, that will likely complicate the adjustment for everyone. There are very good reasons that so many agencies do not permit the simultaneous adoption of unrelated children. I think adoptive parents need to be willing to put the children's best interests first, even if it means having to pursue separate adoptions over the years. If a family really wants to adopt two or more kids at once, why not request siblings? Siblings generally count as "waiting children", which often means that the adoption fees are substantially reduced.

[csw]

Hi,
I know of tons of agencies who allow 2 unrelated adoptions. We had requested siblings or twins,,up to 3 kids,,,we wanted to adopt 2 older boys,,brothers...age 7 and 9,,and they wanted $32,000 for both..we were trying to figure out how to do the financing..and the next day,,the agency said that someone only wanted the older boy,,so they split them up...
We had also seen a sibling group of 3,,1 newborn girl, and 2 toddlers,,and the fee was $45,000..so..no..there is not always a reduced fee for siblings, older children etc..
I know so many people who adopted 2 at once,,either both as infants, or one as a toddler and one as an infant,,,and absolutely noone is having any problems with any of their kids.
If you had to live in Peru almost 7 months, and spend 30 grand to get your kid out., and take 2 years from start to finish for the paperwork,,..you would not go back too soon! It would have been much better for our son to have a brother or sister close to his age....living in Peru all that time..and not working at a job..I had lots and lots of bonding time!
There is something to be said for the bonding and closeness that siblings who are close in age have..our kids will be 11 years apart,,although they will probably be closer in adulthood and he will be a great big brother, I still regret not adopting 2 while in Peru...I would be interested to know if you have seen any studies documenting that adopting two related or unrelated at once is harmfull...thanks Cathy

[csw]

Hi,
Also, remember,,kids who have been in orphanages for years with the same kids..know them very well,,they are even called "orphanage siblings"...it is not like they are always total strangers! Thanks, Cathy

[lisker2003]

Cathy:

I'd have grave concerns about an agency that was so willing to split up siblings (those older boys you mentioned); think about the lifetime ramifications of that for both children! The agency we used, which does not allow the simultaneous adoption of unrelated children, does have a policy of keeping sibs together if humanly possible. The only case I know of in which they agreed to separate sibs was that of twin boys, one healthy and one severely developmentally delayed; they tried for over a year to find a family for both, but finally decided to place the healthy child alone. With our agency, too, sibs are considered "special needs" and the fees are usually reduced (in our case, the total cost for sibs was little more than it would have cost to adopt a single, non-special-needs child). I have seen studies questioning the practice of "artificial twinning" (placement of unrelated infants of roughly the same age at the same time, and raising them like twins). Older children who've spent years together in the same orphanage might do well if adopted together, even if they are not siblings, but there are also major potential pitfalls. All I'm saying is that there are good reasons that so many reputable agencies do not permit this practice, and that parents should remember that, rather than focusing on what would be most convenient for them.

[Sienna3]

For csw and lisker2003,
Here is a link that discusses ethical concerns for adopting 2 at one time. I am not sure I have seen prospective studies that have findings on the children's adjustment, but many times the ethical concerns of it is why agencies don't allow it.

http://www.perspectivespress.com/ite...estyle=default

[csw]

Hi,
I also had grave concerns about an agency that would split up 2 brothers,,,that is why we did NOT use them,,and they were a so called "Christian' agency. Have you ever adopted before? Cathy

[csw]

Hi,
I still feel that it is beneficial for a child to have a sibling who is of the same ethnicity as them, and is close in age...you will not convince me otherwise,,and,,the agencies I am talking about who place 2 unrelated ARE ethical agencies...the reason I wanted to adopt two in Peru was that I was stuck there for SEVEN months..lived there,,.and..to go back a year later and live there another SEVEN months would not be ideal. Have you ever lived in a "developing" country for that long? It was not a matter of "convience'..are you saying that a mother of bio twins should place one for adoption because noone should raise 2 babies at once? Lets end this thread, because we are never going to agreee, I have had 13 years as LAPA and FACE member,,attended foster parent training, worked as a Pediatric and Neonatal ICU nurse, have had an adopted son for 12 years,
and really regret having 11 years age difference in my kids...you will not convince me that having the kids closer in age would not have been more beneficial. Thanks alot, Cathy

[lisker2003]

Cathy:

I absolutely agree with you that it's beneficial for an internationally adopted child to have a sibling of the same background (that's why we adopted four kids from the same orphanage), and I'm certainly not saying that twins shouldn't be raised together if at all possible. Artificial twins are completely different - that entails taking children who are NOT twins, and who are not exactly the same age (and who may be worlds apart developmentally) but raising them as twins. Yes, I have lived in developing countries for extended periods of time (I was a Peace Corps volunteer in Africa for over two years). All I'm saying is that there are good reasons so many agencies do not permit the simultaneous adoption of unrelated children, and do not allow people to pursue pregnancy and adoption simultaneously. That doesn't mean adoption of unrelated kids can't ever work out, just that it should be approached with great caution, and always with the children's best interests in mind. Your situation in Peru was certainly unusual - most parents don't spend that length of time in the adoptive country.

Susan

[4theboys]

I am reading all of these posts and it seems like (maybe I just didn't see it) a point is being missed. The best interest of the child is not necessarily compromised if that IS the reason for wanting more than one. It is much easier to come to a home with a friend/sibling that you have already bonded to than to leave everyone behind, and be alone, on many different levels, race, language, culture....and tons of other little things, that we take for granted.

I also can not understand someone who is adopting or has already supported adoption in one way or the other to imply that biology makes you "real" siblings. If you have siblings that are split near birth, while sad, they are no more bonded than an orphan that has had a "friend" since birth at an orphanage. That friend could be a much more needed advisary than possibly a sibling born later, but not known to the child.

I would actually encourage more than one child to be adopted if they were excited about that, and it would not interferre with the parents doing their job of parenting, in a transracial situation, where there is so much loss and changes already.

[4theboys]

forgot to say, that I would still, as others have said, enter the decision to adopt more than one at a time carefully, honestly weighing the pros and cons for the child.

[v_kats]

I know I will draw some fire, but I would disagree with the statement that siblings should ALWAYS be adopted together. I helped a family adopt a wonderful 12-year old in Ukraine (which, btw. allows several children, both unrelated and siblings, to be adopted at the same time). This girl has a brother in another orphanage who is 15 years old. She hasn't seen him in 5 years, but all the memories ogf him that she has is him beating her up. It would be her worst nightmare to be adopted together with him and I am not sure a family would ever want to adopt a child who is violent with a younger sister.

So I would make a small not -- siblings that are close and attached to each other should be adopted together as often as possible. If they can't stand each other and lived in different orphanages for a while, then why don't give one of them a chance?

Thanks,
Victoria