[SKL]

Originally Posted by Mariais5

Palin/SKL 2012!

Who leaked it to the press??!

LOL!

[Mindybeth6]

Ok I just wanted to go back and verfiy as it seems I ruffled some feathers that I was not SAYING that they pulled strings or paid money to get her home quickly, I just said it was possible. That said, I DO think they saved this child's life..like LITERALLY... and I fully support the McCains 100%. I wasn't saying it to be rude or anything like that. So I apologize if it sounded that way. I didn't relaize at the time I wrote my first post that she came to the US for medical reasons...that's why I said I knew there is always more to a story...and there was! I adore Cindy McCain. She is a wonderful woman.

[Pipercub]

By the way, McCain actually also has two other adopted children (in addition to Bridget and his four biological kids). The two oldest kids - Doug and Andy he adopted when he was married to their mother Carol Shepp (they were "hers" before they got married - and she is also mother of daughter Sidney McCain).

[Michelle Smiles]

Unfortunately his possible supportive stance on adoption isn't enough to counter balance all of the other issues I disagree with him on. But thanks for the info - always interesting to see how adoption touches others!

[Waiting4Celeste]

OK, I just had a chance to read the article and I don't see any problem with any of it.

They were quoting the daughter - and who better to explain how SHE feels than to explain it herself.

If I was her and grew up knowing that I was dying in an orphanage on the other side of the world and my mother found me, met my medical needs and gave me a chance at life, you betcha I'd be grateful and I'd want to share it with everyone.

Not every child has the chance to tell such a story.

Too many children in our country and abroad, have terrible, terrible stories to deal with. Let's let a girl share her gratefulness that she was given a chance, because a woman saw her and fell in love with her and let's celebrate that. I would imagine, at their age, the two daughters are probably involved in what information is given to the media. I would hope that their parents "cleared it" with them before putting their story out there for everyone to hear.

From what I have read, the McCains weren't addressing the situation because they didn't want Bridget to feel different, yet when John McCain was accused of having an affair he had to explain how she became part of their family. He could have come out with the whole, "Look at me! We have saved helpless orphans - don't I deserve to be president" mantra - but he didn't. Although I am happy to know he IS an adoptive parent, I appreciate the fact that he didn't flaunt it to try to pull in more votes.

OK, back to the whole "gratefulness" discussion...
Personally, I WANT my children to feel grateful for what they have - doesn't EVERY parent want that?

I don't want my kids to look at me with their big doe eyes and say, "Mommy, Daddy, THANK YOU for rescuing me from that awful situation and bringing me to the glorious U S of A where life is perfect and opportunites are abundant."

No, I don't want them to think that without me, their life would be miserable, BUT I do want them to realize that this isn't the way of life for most of the other children around our world.

Our kids wake up in a warm, cozy home each morning with more choices for breakfast than they really need.

They don't ever think about where their next meal will come from, or if they will be safe walking home at night.

They won't ever struggle with treatable diseases because we have health insurance that pays for their vaccinations and regular health check ups.

The reality is, our kids have it pretty good.

For all of that, they should be grateful and not take those things for granted. I don't feel that those opportunites happened because I wanted to go rescue a child. No, we adopted our children for selfish reasons - we wanted children and couldn't do it the "natural" way.

[dpen6]

Originally Posted by GDSinPA

Sorry about the bad link.

Prepared Remarks by Wes Gullett : RNCAPFeed : The Rocky Mountain News

I think you'll see what I mean when you read the text above.

Actually, it's not just the wording that's a problem. It's encouraging your kids to be grateful that you saved them that's a problem. It's likening them to charity that's a problem. Think about how that feels to an adoptee?

The reality that a child may have or would have had a better life (or even no life) in their home country is beside the point. The problem comes in how you present their becoming a part of your family and whether you raise them to believe that you're their savior rather than their parent. In other words, if you want to save a child, there are plenty of ways to do so, but that should be separate and distinct from parenting them. Saving is not a healthy thing to have over your children, IMO.

It's OK to talk about how adoption has impacted your life, perhaps even to advocate for adoption (ethically of course), but to have your life story presented to the world in the context of your parents saving you is not acceptable. A child should not be encouraged to believe they should be grateful for being adopted, which is the actual end result of this for Wes Gullet's daughter (which you'll see in the text of his speech.

Does that make better sense?

Blessings,
-Greg

Grag, from an adoptee viewpoint...you got it.....

[dpen6]

Originally Posted by Waiting4Celeste

OK, I just had a chance to read the article and I don't see any problem with any of it.

They were quoting the daughter - and who better to explain how SHE feels than to explain it herself.

If I was her and grew up knowing that I was dying in an orphanage on the other side of the world and my mother found me, met my medical needs and gave me a chance at life, you betcha I'd be grateful and I'd want to share it with everyone.

Not every child has the chance to tell such a story.

Too many children in our country and abroad, have terrible, terrible stories to deal with. Let's let a girl share her gratefulness that she was given a chance, because a woman saw her and fell in love with her and let's celebrate that. I would imagine, at their age, the two daughters are probably involved in what information is given to the media. I would hope that their parents "cleared it" with them before putting their story out there for everyone to hear.

From what I have read, the McCains weren't addressing the situation because they didn't want Bridget to feel different, yet when John McCain was accused of having an affair he had to explain how she became part of their family. He could have come out with the whole, "Look at me! We have saved helpless orphans - don't I deserve to be president" mantra - but he didn't. Although I am happy to know he IS an adoptive parent, I appreciate the fact that he didn't flaunt it to try to pull in more votes.

OK, back to the whole "gratefulness" discussion...
Personally, I WANT my children to feel grateful for what they have - doesn't EVERY parent want that?

I don't want my kids to look at me with their big doe eyes and say, "Mommy, Daddy, THANK YOU for rescuing me from that awful situation and bringing me to the glorious U S of A where life is perfect and opportunites are abundant."

No, I don't want them to think that without me, their life would be miserable, BUT I do want them to realize that this isn't the way of life for most of the other children around our world.

Our kids wake up in a warm, cozy home each morning with more choices for breakfast than they really need.

They don't ever think about where their next meal will come from, or if they will be safe walking home at night.

They won't ever struggle with treatable diseases because we have health insurance that pays for their vaccinations and regular health check ups.

The reality is, our kids have it pretty good.

For all of that, they should be grateful and not take those things for granted. I don't feel that those opportunites happened because I wanted to go rescue a child. No, we adopted our children for selfish reasons - we wanted children and couldn't do it the "natural" way.

If any adoptee "needs" to feel grateful they will figure it out for themselves. To be brought up and totally told you "should" feel grateful because ofyou have food and shelter and you almost didn't is in a very subtle way telling that person that you really were less desrving then non adopted peole and don't ever forget whence you came....thats how it could be taken. It makes theshouldars droop a little more.

NOW...you have a very american kid that is starting to be not grateful like all kids do...then its time to tell them they should be grateful for what they have, ALL children need to learn about graitude..its the name of the game...BUT not BECAUSE they are adopted. Like I said, most of us adoptees DO figure that out for ourselves and I was NEVER told to be grateful because I was adopted by my parents. I would get a kick in the pants if I was not grateful for todays blessings. Strangers use to tell me how "lucky" I was and I hated it. It made me feel much smaller as a little one.

No matte what the situaion, at first glance adoption for a child is not something to be grateful .....its intially a great loss of biology that is big. Even if my bio's were attitlla the hun and spouse!(Which they were not)

[amyfk]

Thank you all adoptnky, mindybeth and skl. I had to think that there was more to the story than Ms. McCain went to Bangladesh and basically took two kids out of the orphanage without question. I guess nobody has time for/wants the details at the convention. I often think into things.
Thanks again,
Amy K, NJ

[JoshGuat]

oh wow, how great is that?? I did not know that about the McCain's. Thanks for posting! That warmed my heart!!

[JillnChris]

Originally Posted by dpen6

If any adoptee "needs" to feel grateful they will figure it out for themselves. To be brought up and totally told you "should" feel grateful because ofyou have food and shelter and you almost didn't is in a very subtle way telling that person that you really were less desrving then non adopted peole and don't ever forget whence you came....thats how it could be taken. It makes theshouldars droop a little more.

NOW...you have a very american kid that is starting to be not grateful like all kids do...then its time to tell them they should be grateful for what they have, ALL children need to learn about graitude..its the name of the game...BUT not BECAUSE they are adopted. Like I said, most of us adoptees DO figure that out for ourselves and I was NEVER told to be grateful because I was adopted by my parents. I would get a kick in the pants if I was not grateful for todays blessings. Strangers use to tell me how "lucky" I was and I hated it. It made me feel much smaller as a little one.

No matte what the situaion, at first glance adoption for a child is not something to be grateful .....its intially a great loss of biology that is big. Even if my bio's were attitlla the hun and spouse!(Which they were not)

Perfectly said! And who better to say it than an adoptee?

[GDSinPA]

Cindy - I can't really argue with much of what you said. I do think that people that are privileged need to recognize that. I'm sure we are all thankful to be American's - period.

To that end - I totally agree with this...

Originally Posted by Waiting4Celeste

I don't want my kids to look at me with their big doe eyes and say, "Mommy, Daddy, THANK YOU for rescuing me from that awful situation and bringing me to the glorious U S of A where life is perfect and opportunites are abundant."

The problem is that this is exactly what happened the other night with the McCain family friend's speech. Remember - this was NOT an article about them - it was a speech given by the one girl's father. It was all about Cindy McCain's effort to rescue these two children, with one of them on stage. And he closes by quoting her expressing how lucky she is for being adopted. I'm not saying she doesn't truly believe this.

I'm honestly not trying to be critical of McCain here - in fact, in the last couple of weeks, I went from luke warm to fully supporting the guy as president. Yah, some lady from Alaska had a lot to do with it, but so did some things I learned about the other guy.

Mindy - I don't post much here - but I always like what you have to say. I did not read anything into your other statement. Actually, I believe what happened was the babies came here with Cindy on a medical visa, then since there were no parents or guardians in Bangladesh, they were free to be adopted. I'm sure they still had to process the necessary paperwork at that time.

Blessings,
-Greg

[Waiting4Celeste]

Originally Posted by dpen6

If any adoptee "needs" to feel grateful they will figure it out for themselves. To be brought up and totally told you "should" feel grateful because ofyou have food and shelter and you almost didn't is in a very subtle way telling that person that you really were less desrving then non adopted peole and don't ever forget whence you came....thats how it could be taken. It makes theshouldars droop a little more.

NOW...you have a very american kid that is starting to be not grateful like all kids do...then its time to tell them they should be grateful for what they have, ALL children need to learn about graitude..its the name of the game...BUT not BECAUSE they are adopted. Like I said, most of us adoptees DO figure that out for ourselves and I was NEVER told to be grateful because I was adopted by my parents. I would get a kick in the pants if I was not grateful for todays blessings. Strangers use to tell me how "lucky" I was and I hated it. It made me feel much smaller as a little one.

No matte what the situaion, at first glance adoption for a child is not something to be grateful .....its intially a great loss of biology that is big. Even if my bio's were attitlla the hun and spouse!(Which they were not)

I was not saying that I tell my kids that they should be grateful because they are adopted... that was the complete OPPOSITE of my point. We don't raise our kids as "the adopted kids" we just raise them for who they are. I don't attach the gratefulness to the fact that they were adopted. I just want them to grow up aware that there are so many people on this earth who struggle every day just to live. I want them to be compassionate children who grow into compassionate adults. The selfishness of our younger generations seriously concerns me. I want to do what ever I can to make sure that our kids grow up with an awareness that life exists outside of our own home.

Jacob (age 6 1/2) and I have discussed how there are children in other parts of the world who struggle and don't get to go to school like he gets to. We have talked about some of the children in Guatemala who might not have enough food each day. But I DON'T say, "Boy, Jacob you are so lucky we adopted you or else you might have starved! You need to be thankful to US." because I don't believe that! He needs to be thankful to God who provides everything. After all, we are ALL adopted into God's family.

We will all raise our kids differently and I especially appreciate hearing from an adoptee about this issue, but since you don't know how I raise my kids I know it must be difficult to truly see how we deal with this situation just from reading my posts (which have ventured WAYYY away from my original post!)

I am sure that there are families out there who make the mistake of making their children feel that they need to be grateful to them, but I know in my heart that we are NOT one of those families.

I am the grateful one, truly. I can't imagine our life without these two little blessings. I don't EVER want them to think that they owe us anything... and I will choose my words carefully when talking about having a grateful heart.

[drjeanne]

Cindy, you sound like an awesome Mom and person! I hope you're not offended by this thread in any way! I'm sure it's no reflection on your mothering especially since we don't really know you....we only know what you write.

I like Cindy McCain too. I didn't know about her humanitarian efforts or the McCain's adoption before the convention so, I've sure learned a few things about our candidate this past week. How wonderful that she has so much and is willing and able to share her goodness and fortune!

We have a beautiful and wonderful daughter! I'm so proud of her! People often say to me that dreaded statement..."She's so lucky you found her". I hate that. I hate to hear it and I hate that she's going to hear it! I make sure to always say oh no, it's us who are the lucky ones! God has certainly blessed our lives with our gift of our daughter! It's a shame people who are not adoptees don't understand how these innocent statements can make an adopted child feel. I wish we could get the message out!

Sorry for the rambling.....just another Friday night around here....

Have a great weekend everyone!
Jeanne

[angel_bayou]

Amy, I got the same feel about them taking her home with not much involved!! I was wondering myself. I thought hs campagin went ok but I would have liked to see more meat with those potatoes!! He never really went into much detail of how he would change only promises!! I also was easily lost by the fact he kept talking about the war and how he was a POW. I know this was sad and it happens to many, many people but I wish it wasen't so focused on. I missed Palin's speech though

[dpen6]

Originally Posted by Waiting4Celeste

I was not saying that I tell my kids that they should be grateful because they are adopted... that was the complete OPPOSITE of my point. We don't raise our kids as "the adopted kids" we just raise them for who they are. I don't attach the gratefulness to the fact that they were adopted. I just want them to grow up aware that there are so many people on this earth who struggle every day just to live. I want them to be compassionate children who grow into compassionate adults. The selfishness of our younger generations seriously concerns me. I want to do what ever I can to make sure that our kids grow up with an awareness that life exists outside of our own home.

Jacob (age 6 1/2) and I have discussed how there are children in other parts of the world who struggle and don't get to go to school like he gets to. We have talked about some of the children in Guatemala who might not have enough food each day. But I DON'T say, "Boy, Jacob you are so lucky we adopted you or else you might have starved! You need to be thankful to US." because I don't believe that! He needs to be thankful to God who provides everything. After all, we are ALL adopted into God's family.

We will all raise our kids differently and I especially appreciate hearing from an adoptee about this issue, but since you don't know how I raise my kids I know it must be difficult to truly see how we deal with this situation just from reading my posts (which have ventured WAYYY away from my original post!)

I am sure that there are families out there who make the mistake of making their children feel that they need to be grateful to them, but I know in my heart that we are NOT one of those families.

I am the grateful one, truly. I can't imagine our life without these two little blessings. I don't EVER want them to think that they owe us anything... and I will choose my words carefully when talking about having a grateful heart.

I am sure you are a great mother!

I tend to get a little sensitve about the "grateful" aspect as I AM grateful that I had the family I did but hate it when anyone(not you and not most of the adoptive parents here) metions how we "should" be graeteful. BTW.. when they get older they WILL owe you gratitude for great parenting..as all children do. So don't say they won't owe you anything.because they will.