[Springtime]

Hi everyone!
Well our story is like this..we started the process for Korea. Thought about Vietnam because Korea is moving so slowly. Rejected Guatemala out of hand because of the cost, until we realized that a 3 week trip to Vietnam for my husband and I and childcare for 3 weeks would up the costs for Vietnam to the level of Guatemala..
So here we are. But I am so overwhelmed with all this. What is the whole Hague thing? What is PGN?
I'm sure nobody wants to type everything out but I would appreciate a little direction..maybe if someone has a website to link me to that explains it clearly from the beginning? I would really appreciate it.

[krambk]

http://travel.state.gov/family/adopt...untry_389.html

www.guatadopt.com

These are two good places to start to get accurate information

hope this helps
brandee

[dspakowsky]

The Hague is a treaty for Inter-country Adoptions. It seeks to have a centralized processing center to handle adoptions for each country. But, Guatemala does not have this, as all their adoptions are handled privately, with PGN approving the cases. So, the US is saying they need to get their act in order, or they won't allow adoptions to the US. Guatemala has said in the past (2002) that it's against their Constitution to abide by those terms. So, as it is now, adoptions will be shutting down between the US and Guatemala.

A great web site is Guatadopt.com It has a lot of information pertaining to Guatemalan adoptions. This site explains the process and terminology.

PGN is the office that approves the adoption. It's like our Attorney General's office. Their new Director is being very difficult. Cases used to get through this stage in 3-6 weeks. Now it's taking 6-16+ weeks, with little or no reason. However, I'm confident that if everything is in order, PGN will approve your case. So the babies will come home - maybe toddlers by then

[Springtime]

Originally Posted by dspakowsky

So, as it is now, adoptions will be shutting down between the US and Guatemala.

As in, we shouldn't start the process to adopt from Guatemala?

[Springtime]

Also Daphne, thank you very much for your response..it helps a lot!


Sorry I didn't write more before, was holding a baby.

[Springtime]

1 more question, any idea when US might implement this? We are just about to start our homestudy, having completed our formal application..

[jeannecr]

Most agencies think there is still some time. The U.S. hopes to implement the Hague treaty in 2007, but there is no firm date. First, the U.S. government has to register and certify all the adoption agencies in the nation who will be doing international adoptions. Since this is just starting, it's hard to imagine they'll have it done within 6 months.

Talk to your placement agency for more details.

[Springtime]

Thank you Jean! I will call them tomorrow.

Gabriel is soooo cute.

[sak9645]

Hague Convention #33 is an international treaty that is designed to regulate intercountry adoption, so that the rights of children, their birth families, and their adoptive parents are protected. At this point, 69 countries are party to the Convention.

When a country ratifies the Hague Convention, it agrees to follow certain rules in dealing with adoptions coming from or going to all other countries that have ratified.

The U.S. was one of the countries that participated in developing Hague Convention #33, and signed it back in 1994, signifying intention to ratify. However, it took until 2000 for the U.S. to pass the legislation -- the Intercountry Adoption Act -- that would allow it to ratify the treaty.

And the U.S. STILL hasn't ratified, because it has taken the U.S. State Department longer than expected to develop the implementing regulations, develop a process for accrediting adoption agencies wishing to work with Hague countries, actually accredit agencies, etc.

At this point, the State Department is saying that ratification is likely to happen in 2007. However, many knowledgeable people are of the opinion that, given progress to date, the U.S. may not ratify until 2008 or later.

For now, the U.S. doesn't have to do anything special when it works with Hague OR non-Hague countries. However, there are Hague countries -- particularly in Latin America -- that will not place children with Americans because the U.S. has not yet ratified.

When the Hague is ratified, the U.S. can continue to follow traditional practices in dealing with non-Hague countries. However, it will need to follow specific rules in the case of any adoption from a Hague country.

And here's where things get sticky with regard to Guatemala.

A while back, Guatemala decided to ratify the Hague Convention. This ratification was duly noted in the records of the Hague. However, the Guatemalan government then decided that the ratification was illegal, and tried to rescind it.

Guatemala currently considers itself to be a non-Hague country, and it does not follow Hague rules. Unfortunately, the framers of the treaty say that Guatemala is STILL a Hague country; it just is a non-compliant one.

The Hague organization has told all Hague-ratifying countries that they must treat Guatemala as a Hague member. In other words, they must either demand that adoptions from Guatemala follow Hague rules, or else refrain from participating in Guatemalan adoption.

The U.S. State Department has indicated that, when the U.S. finally ratifies the Hague, it will accept the Hague's request. Either Guatemala will need to begin conforming its processes to the Hague Convention, or the U.S. will no longer be able to accept children from that country.

Guatemala probably doesn't have the capability, at this moment, of conforming its processes to the Hague system, even if it wanted to do so. As a result, if the U.S. ratifies as early as the State Department says, it is possible that the U.S. would have to close to Guatemalan adoption.

HOWEVER, it is not 100% certain that this will happen. No one wants to see Guatemalan children relegated to life in hogars and impermanent foster care. It is possible (though by no means certain) that, especially if U.S. ratification of the Hague takes longer than the State Department expects, the Hague, Guatemala, and the U.S. can figure out at least an interim solution to the problem.

But, whether or not some sort of resolution is possible, there WILL be a good deal of uncertainty for a while.

Sharon

[dspakowsky]

I'd start now and I bet you'll be fine. It takes a while to get your dossier and I-171H together, so starting soon is key. Many agencies seem to think that things will slow down or stop in mid to late 2007 - although no one reallys kows.

Right now, many adoptions are taking 6-10 months from referral to take home. In the past, some adoptions were as quick as 4 months. Our first adotpion was less than 4 months from referral to Embassy (getting the Visa), and that was just 7 months ago! So things are always changing.

If you feel led to Guatemala, go for it.

[DPline]

Here is a link to the part at Guatadopt.com that descibes the process very well.

http://www.guatadopt.com/WebFileBrowser/frameset.html Click on "The Process."

[Springtime]

Sharon (thank you for writing all of that out! It was very helpful), Daphne, and Debbie,
Thank you so much for your help.

I am always amazed at how helpful people are to those they have never even met. Thank you very much.