[earthmama17]

I'm really confused now...

My understanding was that when I brought my baby home, I would take her to her pediatrician for a thorough checkup. Well, I found out that he doesn't do titers, so I was going to get her in to an international adoption clinic in Oakland.

When I called the clinic, the doctor herself answered (secretary out today), and she told me that titers is not accurate in such young babies.They still have the presence of the birthmom's antibody in their system and it isn't reliabe to do the titers until about 1 y.o. to see if she is producing antibodies on her own. This very well-respected pediatrician recommended re-vaccinating.

I've heard such conflicting opinions on this. I also thought Dr. Montiel's vaccines are supposed to be good. So-I'm not sure whether to re-vaccinate or wait about 6 months and do the titers.

[Amykk]

It seems like the pediatricians are all over the board on this issue - ours sees a lot of internationally adopted kids and has adopted internationally herself - she accepted the shot record from Dr. Montiel and did not even require titers.
I don't know what to tell you - I kind of would have felt more comfortable having titers drawn, but I just went with what she told me.

[soon2bemom]

babies carry their mothers antibodies until 6 months of age, if they were breast fed they will carry their mothers antibodies until longer. However the likelihood that a Guatemalan woman will be carrying circulating antibodies to Tetanus etc in significant amounts is unlikely, both because most mothers were probably never immunized, and also because of the "anamnestic response" (this is long and detailed but if you want you can PM me and i will try to translate this.)

I have mentioned this to several other people about titers and immunizations so forgive me if this is similar to prior posts.

If a child has documented immunizations from Doctor Montiel at the 2 month and 4 month visits (or just the 2 month visit) I would simply go ahead and give the next immunizations on schedule and continue on the schedule normally. There is no significant risk that the child will be inadequately immunized, because the immunization schedule has more than sufficient redundancy to cover any problems.

If the child has already had the 2 month, 4 month, and 6 month immunizations while abroad, (that is to say the child is older than 7 months old) then titers are indicated because there are not enough repetitions left to guarantee immunity....in this case the mothers antibodies should already be out of the babies system and the titers will be valid.

[widgit]

interesting...

Our IA clinic recommends titers, but will retest anything that seems suspect after 6 months.

Many of the vaccinations are done in a series. What if you were to discuss a compromise with your doctor--pick up where the vaccinations left off in Guatemala and then do titers in 6 months?

One of our children got a vaccine too soon after the previous dose. This one came up as "low protective". All the other titers came back "protective".

Good luck,

[csw]

Hi
Sounds like what soon2bemom is saying is because she is 6 months old or less..just pick up where the vaccine schedule would be for her age..do not revaccinate or get titers..our daughter did not come home till 9 months old..we did titers mainly because she had 3 physicians in Guatemala, the last one being Dr. Montiel for several months..but we wanted to make sure the first 2 MD's ones were ok..if she had had Dr. Montiel from the start I would not have been worried..

[deneen]

OK - I started this conversation last night ... and now I am more comfused than ever. There seems to be some respect for immunization records if they came from Dr. Montiel. Well - our baby had Dr. Edwin Lima Godoy. Anyone know anything about him? Our baby is documented to have her 2 & 4 month shots. So I was thinking to just go ahead with her normal 6 month shots here. With no titers ... based on other experiences of babies with same Dr.

I simply want to do what is best for my daughter. We can run titers - our Dr. is not opposed, it is just not her recommendation as the titer results may take up to 3 weeks. And the Dr. is well aware that the baby was raised in a foster care environment vs. orphanage.

I can't vacillate much longer on this

Deneen

[jenniferw223]

Our Ped is just vaccinating from where the Ped in Guatemala left off. She was fine with the immunization record I gave her. I had never even heard of titers until I read the board. I am going to trust the Ped. She is from Domincan Republic and is familiar with internationally adopted babies.

[soon2bemom]

Deneen I have already mentioned on previous posts that going ahead with the 6 month immunizations on schedule is fine.(as above)

If your Doctor refuses to do this then doing the titers (to convince your doctor) is an alternative. Your child is already 6 months old and the titers are valid.

[moelladeville]

My physician at Children's Hospital of Philadelphia's International Adoption Clinic told me the same thing. I've done some reading, and I think it's sound counsel. I waited until my son's first birthday to do titers.

Revaccination was not an option for me -- I work for a company that makes many of the vaccines we give our children, and as a result, I have a pretty good understanding of the risks. You may choose to revaccinate, but look into the risks, and go into it eyes wide open.

Good luck,
Marjorie

[laura-jean]

acting all freaked out cause our baby was from a third world country. She wouldn't do tithers and didn't even know what I was talking about.... She wanted to do ALL of her shots over... and said that my baby could have been eating out of lead bowls..... hmmm....

Needless to say that I switched Pedis pretty quickly. She scared me half to death. Was all panicked and wanted to call some big hospitals etc.

I chose to pick up where the records said we left off. I must say though, my daughter rarely gets sick and was incredibly ill BOTH times she got more shots. Screaming, crying, high fever, rash, even w/ motrin and tylenol every 8 and 4 hrs. Of course they said it was just a coincidence and a virus not the shots.....

Boy was I mad.... Mad isn't even close!!! I am not sold on vaccines personally but wanted to try and go along with the recommended program.

Next time she goes for shots I will spread them out and not allow them to give her more than one at a time. Also my SIL told me that Naturopaths can prescribe something you give the baby in conjunction with the shot to reduce the side effects.

It's a tough decision....

I am sure you will benefit form the good advice that you have already been given.

Laura Jean

[soon2bemom]

Currently the immunization that usually gives the high fevers and rashes is prevnar, the pneumococcal vaccine, the others usually have only mild side effects. Many years ago it was the pertussis immunization that caused high fevers, but not anymore. Just thought you might want to know.

[coachmom]

I would just pick up where your doctor left off with immunizations.. Our doctor is not an adoption Specialist but has had other children as patients that are adopted from third world countries. She has never seen any problems with vaccines... just take the vaccination record with you and any medicals you have received . If your doctor really pushes for re-vaccinating, i would switch docs...JMHO
Doretta

[csw]

The Prevnar is notorious for causing side effects..it is documented that it causes more se than any other vaccine..Ana had a 105 fever after the Prevnar and Fluzone were given together..she had a fever workup and it was negative, the doc didn't believe it was the vaccnes..then 3 days later she had a 104.9 temp, vomiting and chills..acute kidney infection..caused from her being straight cathed for urine..had to be admitted to the ER..bolused with IVF (after 8 attempts to get an IV) given IV antibiotics..sent home on oral amoxicillin..7 days later a horrendous rash from head to toe..put on steroids and benadryl..switched antibiotics..then she got another Fluzone and that night she was restless and the next day wouldn't respond to her name , lost 11 of the 15 words she was saying, became hyperactive and wasn't able to focus..turns out she got 3 flu shots over an 8 week period and no. 2 was an adult dose..she was also on antibx the entire 8 week period..which prevents mercury from being excreted (proven)..poor kid..she still isn't right..she was 12 months ahead with receptive and expressive language and went to 12 months behind with expressive and right at age level with receptive..her developmental quotient went from 130 down to 114..
With aggressive ST, sign language, ton's of meds and homeopathic treatments she is now 5-6 months delayed on speech, so the gap is closing..starting from the day after the 3rd dose at 17 months old..she stopped taking afternoon naps and is up till MN..

My advice is to never vaccinate a child who is ill (seems like the doc should have known this), who is on antibiotics, steroids etc..and have the medicine tech double check the dose with the doc or RN..you can split up vaccines, and according to Ana's specialist he says never give more than 2 in one day..I personally wouldn't do more than 1..for example..it has been proven that aluminum and mercury work synergistically together and cause more brain damage than when alone..so..the Prevnar has a pretty significant level of aluminum in it.though still under what the EPA considers toxic...the Fluzone had a significant amount of ethylmercury in it..(12x higher than EPA safe limits for her weight..and the adult dose she got was 25X higher than the safe limit) given together it was probably way worse for Ana..

Most doc's (understandably) push the vaccines..and some will refuse to have a patient who is not vaccinated..Most..however..will agree to let you space them out, insist on single dose vials, preservative free etc..this is YOUR child....

[my3guats]

Personally I would either run titers at some point or revaccinate. Children adopted from Guatemala have to have records showing they have been properly vaccinated so children are going to come home with the proper records whether they are correct or not. I know for a fact that some children have records showing the vaccines were administered but it was not done. Our son's records show he got his shots when he was 2,4 and 6 mths old. He wasn't relinquished until he was 2 1/2. His birthdate was wrong on all his records so the vaccination records show he was vaccinated before he was even born! So personally I would not necessarily trust the records. But that is just my input. I am a big believer in making sure all kids are properly vaccinated. I know that many feel vaccines are not safe but to me the diseases are a lot more unsafe...but again that is just my opinion.

[tookie12]

Originally Posted by deneen

There seems to be some respect for immunization records if they came from Dr. Montiel. Well - our baby had Dr. Edwin Lima Godoy. Anyone know anything about him? Our baby is documented to have her 2 & 4 month shots. So I was thinking to just go ahead with her normal 6 month shots here. With no titers ... based on other experiences of babies with same Dr.

Personally, as respected as Montiel may be, i would have titers done PERIOD for a toddler and continue on schedule for an infant....then have titers done at 24 months.