[mom2GRLC]

[quote=Denise Michaels Mom]My love would have been just as good, no...it would have been better......"

How can you assume your love for your child would have been BETTER. Than the love the adoptive mother has for her child?

"because I was his mother and the love between a mother and child is like no other."


Again, How can you assume that an adoptive mother is not his MOTHER and that the bond they have together is less than the bond your son would have had with you?

"An a-mom can love her adopted child but it's not the same. "

I agree, in some ways it is different but that doesn't make one LOVE their child any less.

"There is a bond between mother and child that begins in the womb and it's so strong that nothing can break it, nothing, not distance, time, not even death."

The LOVE an adoptive mother feels for her child is the same.....many times that love has compounded over years and years of longing for a child. We may not have been able to bond with them in our womb but we certianly bonded with our child ...or the thought of our child in our heart .....much longer than 9 months. And the bond that we build with our adopted child can never be broken, it's forever. *Admin Note* - Just as we ask of others, please remember to speak of your situation. Some amoms do not bond with their child or love them.

"The bond between a mother and child is a physiological and biological process that starts at conception and is fully formed by the time the child is born. "

I disagree, there are many woman who do not feel bonded with their child even at birth. Love and Bonding truly takes place as you care for the child and tend to their daily needs. It's then that love and bonds are TRULY formed and solidified. That's not to say a woman can't love ehr child while in the womb and at it's birth...I'm just saying that a lvoe and bond doesn't always work as you describe.


"The bond a child makes with an a-mom is different, it happens outside the womb, it isn't guttural or instinctive, the child isn't part of the a-moms flesh....it's just not the same. "

Again....yes the way our family is started is different. But that doesn't mean we don't have a physical type bond with our child. We do have an instinctive motherly bond with our child that goes way beyond wether that child was born of our flesh. Many of us have also chosen to breastfeed our infants (which is sharing a physical type connection as well....though I'm sure your completley opposed to that idea).

You may find it hard to believe but many(not all) people in open adoption find that the child quickly bonds to the adoptive mother. The child recognizes her voice, her smell, her tender touch.....over that of the birthmother. She recognizes HER as Mother. because she is the one who she is bonded with...who knows takes care of all her needs and who she recognizes as mother.

I agree your LOVE for your child is different than the LOVE his adoptive mother had for him. But ONE is not ABOVE the OTHER. One can not replace the other. I find your beliefs VERY Hurtful. That you would assume that you could love your child MORE. Or that your Love is BETTER than that of his adoptive mothers.

What is that saying to ADOPTEE's? That just because they were not born to their adoptive parents and are not of their flesh...that they are LESScapapble of being Truly LOVED. Or that the adoptive parents would love their Biological chidlren MORE than them? That is just rediculous.

A child can know and feel the LOVE of both his mothers without havign to choose one above the other. BOTH mothers are equally important to him and one couldn't take the others place in his life.

[kdecrow]

I took a peek at my thread I posted last week to see if I had any more sweet notes. I feel like I stepped into a battlefield.

Well, It's been a week today that I found out my son's deceased. I'm doing pretty well and I want to thank everyone that has prayed for me or wished me well.

I just gotta hang tough and I love you guys...

Kim

[myheart]

Originally Posted by [B

I[/b] just think the bond, the relationship between mother and child is unique, I don't think it can't be duplicated or replaced, so I believe it should be perserved at all costs (unless the mother is truly unfit, for example, drugs, etc). I believe adoption should be the last resort.

I strongly disagree with your statement.....
My son did not grow in my womb and our bond is like no other. I am in a fully open adoption, and I have an extremely close relationship with my sons b-mom. Guess who my son is bonded to? ..........Me.
I get sick and tired of people saying that my son is only bonded to his b-mom or that he is more bonded to his b-mom just because he grew in her womb......my personal stats prove otherwise. We as humans are more complex than that. We connect more with the spirit of love than we do with blood bonds.
I am bonded closer to my son and my husband than I am with my own mother and I grew in her womb.

Denise you obviously have heartache.....and I am truly sorry for your pain!... But, you are on one side of the fence and you have yet to see whats on the other side. Please, remember that all side of the triad have had there share of loss.... Some are greater than others .

[mom2GRLC]

KDECROW-

Sorry I originally came on here to give you ((HUGS)) and to let you know that I do believe you will see your son again and your reunion will be better than you ever imagined. It only takes faith and Hope!!!

I also would encourage you to do your own search somehow or using a professional. To see if you can track down the adoptive parents or maybe search death records to look for more answers.

If I were the adoptive mother I would probably have this deep pit in my heart wanting to reach out to you to tell you what happend and to share with you pictures of his life and anything I had so you could see what he looked like and what a good life he had. She probably feels just as diconnected as you....not knowing how to contact you.

I hope you find the peace in your life that will help you move foreward with hope. if you don't recieve the answers your looking for in this mortal life I'm sure you will find MUCH MORE than that in the eternities to come.

[lonni]

Originally Posted by kdecrow

I took a peek at my thread I posted last week to see if I had any more sweet notes. I feel like I stepped into a battlefield.

Well, It's been a week today that I found out my son's deceased. I'm doing pretty well and I want to thank everyone that has prayed for me or wished me well.

I just gotta hang tough and I love you guys...

Kim

Unbelievable at a time like this. Here is an extra hug for you. sheesh.

[myheart]

Originally Posted by lonni

Unbelievable at a time like this. Here is an extra hug for you. sheesh.

Lonni,
Your right!

Kim, I am so sorry for getting sidetract. I initially came here to read and give you my sympathy...instead I allowed the negative thread to detract me from my initial duty.............
Kim, I mean this from the bottom of my heart, I am truly sorry for your loss.
May the Lord bless you and give you Peace during this difficult time in your life. I truly hope that you will find the answers you need and deserve.

[lonni]

Denise M I am sorry to see you leave.I am sorry about your son too. I hope you can find some kind,understanding support to help you heal some. I just can not imagine the pain of giving birth to a child and never seeing them alive again. No one expects to have the child adopted and then find them no longer alive.

[lonni]

You are a sweety, MYheart :~))

[bajj]

Kim, I just wanted you to know you've been in my prayers lately.

Huge hugs.

Ani

[Scarlet Moon 13]

Originally Posted by JPDakota

You know, Crick doesn't need my support, but she gets it anyway. How can you possibly read what you wrote and fail to see how generalistic and disrespectful it is? May I suggest that, in order to avoid this sort of thing, you quote studies appropriately so others can reference them, avoid "yelling" in print, and accept other people's views as their own. You don't have to agree, certainly, but your point has long since been obfuscated by your tone and presentation.

Was this directed at me? Because I only tell what I know, have seen, or experinced.. This from triad support group, birthmom support group, adoption therapy, and the number of bmoms I personal have met and talked to.

[katlyn]

I know this thread got a little side tracked, and I have already posted here once before, but I can't seem to get you out of my mind, my thoughts and prayers are with you still, and I hope that you get answers and are able to put some "closure" on your son's passing. I know that for me, this was my greatest fear...again, you're in my prayers.

[JPDakota]

Scarlet Moon 13,
I am so sorry my post got placed beneath yours. We must have written them at the same time. No, I was responding to Denise railing at Crick. Again, I'm sorry that happened, and had no intent to criticize you.

Kim,
I'm truly sorry for your loss. There are a number of search engines on the internet that will find death records and death certificates. It is possible you could find your son's records there. It might answer some of your questions. Best of luck.

[Scarlet Moon 13]

Originally Posted by JPDakota

Scarlet Moon 13,
I am so sorry my post got placed beneath yours. We must have written them at the same time. No, I was responding to Denise railing at Crick. Again, I'm sorry that happened, and had no intent to criticize you.

Kim,
I'm truly sorry for your loss. There are a number of search engines on the internet that will find death records and death certificates. It is possible you could find your son's records there. It might answer some of your questions. Best of luck.

I don't see the "thank you" I sent so I will say it again

Thank you..



I was trying to be PC about the "bonding" issue.. all mother's can bond with a baby.. though sometimes, some babies do have issues with it.. and some babies have a hard time and others do not.

Yes, a baby does know everything about it's mother in the womb. It knows the smell, sounds of the mothers body and her voice, and voices of others close by. It knows the sway and rhythm of her walk and movement of her body. Some scientists beleive that an infant in the womb can also tell when a mother loves it and wants it and a mother who doesn't want or hates her baby. So a pregnant woman who does drugs or other hurtful things can affect the baby and child for a life time.

Just as a birthmother who wants to keep and love her child may some how convey that to the infant in the womb. We read that some pregnant "PBMs" women disassociate from the infant while pregnant in hopes that it will not hurt as much at relinquisment. But that very thing could have a cause and effect on the baby.

Maybe the reason some amoms have it easier then others might be a similarity in movement and sound. But that doesn't mean an adoptive mother doesn't bond well enough that the baby doesn't attach to her.

I think raising my step granddau for 4 years, she came at age 3.. really helped me understand that I do love her and her sister as much as my bio granddau. She loves me too, I am the only grandmother the now 8 year old knows. I helped deliver her, they lived with us for two years, then after 1 year in their own apartment, mom's (unknown to us) drug use got worse, the youngest came to us.

I had never had a child who needed so much love or help. A child who had so many issues, missing mommy, residual effects of being in a drug using environment.. she would beat her head against the wall when upset, or dig at her eyes, scatch at her arms. She pulled out her hair, she had bald spots on her head. She would not responed when called by name. You had to say "H" needs to come to grandma, or "H" needs to do this. It took a year for this child to respond to a simple question like: "How are you", and for her to say, "I am fine."

The child slept with me, I let my hair grow longer so that at night I could take her hand from her own hair and place my hair in her fingers. It was the only way I could get her to stop pulling her hair out.

There were nights she had such horrific nightmares that when we could finally get her awake and calm, she would sleep on top of me all night with both hands wrapped in my hair. I didn't sleep much those nights.

it took those 4 years for her mom to get her life together, mom age 36, is now in college and doing better then we ever hoped.

I need to say that having been forced to give up my frist child did effect the way I was unable to give fully to my step children for years. I felt disloyal to my bson for even thinking of loving any other child other then my bio children. It wasn't until I was searching in 1997and "H" was born shortly after my reunion in 1998. That I realized I had been holding back from my step children, two of whom came to live with us at 12 and 15.

ah, sorry this was so long..

Teri

[patti Daniels]

My prayers are with you. I am so sorry.

[kdecrow]

As the Catholic folks here know, we just had "All Souls Day." Our priest told us we could put pictures of our loved ones that have passed on a table in the hallway.

As I put my picture of my deceased birth son on the table, an elderly couple came up to me and said " That's a beautiful picture of M. We'd like to introduce ourselves. We were his godparents."

Wow. That's all I can say. Wow.

I think there's a gift in this somewhere.

Kim