[oceanica]

Doctors settle case for denying lesbian treatment : 24 Hour Breaking News : The Buffalo News

This article surprised me.
I didn't think this was going on nowadays.
I am against what happened... I think the doctors are wrong.
Then again.... they had to settle YET they DID refer her out to another physician who apparently helped her.
If it were an abortion and I were an OB, would I be sued for not doing it? I am against abortion. I could never perform one. I don't think I should be put in a position to HAVE to do something for a patient because I can do it and the patient wants it.
In medical school we were told we did not have to watch an abortion if we had objections, and if we chose not to perform that procedure we would have to be able to find the appropriate place to refer a patient to and then there would be no problem. Now I wonder.

NOTE: I am NOT trying to compare the different situations and certainly not trying to start an abortion debate because of course we all have differing opinions on that!

[Quesita]

Very interesting. Honestly, if the doctor didn't want to do it, but referred her out to a doctor who could and would (and now she has 3 kids!) I don't really see what the lawsuit was. Unless she was treated badly before the referral.

I have mixed feelings. Do lesbians have the same right as married women or single women or mothers of 11 children to seek fertility treatments? Absolutely. Should every doctor be required to perform the procedures on everyone, regardless of their personal beliefs? I'm nost sure. If a doctor thinks that the woman with 11 kids has a good chance or having mulitple births and thinks (in his or her personal opinion) that she really might not be able to handle it, should the doctor be able to decline to perform the procedure but refer the woman out? I think so.

Honestly, I don't think the government should force individuals to use their specialized skills to do something that is against their personal beliefs, so long as they do not prevent someone from getting those services elsewhere.

Why would a lesbian want a homophobic doctor poking around inside of her anyway? I don't think I would want a homophobic doctor poking around inside of me! Take your business elsewhere.

[crick]

I think if you are a doctor, then your personal feelings have to go out the door in many ways.

If you have personal issues on performing abortions, then you don't do that period. You deny EVERYONE that practice. That I can understand. You do that because you are morally against the PRACTICE - not the PERSON.

This is a case of them denying services they already provide based on their personal feelings regarding an individual. You cannot discriminate against someone for being gay and there are laws to protect people against that. It could be a black woman or a woman with one limb or a woman who was unmarried or had spiky hair...doesn't matter.

I don't see it any different than a restaurant refusing to serve someone and saying "oh, but you can go eat THERE. They'll serve you." Just because someone else is available it doesn't negate the discriminating act.

Besides...isn't the first line of a doctor's motto "First do no harm?" That's harmful in my eyes...

[OakShannon]

Originally Posted by crick

I think if you are a doctor, then your personal feelings have to go out the door in many ways.

If you have personal issues on performing abortions, then you don't do that period. You deny EVERYONE that practice. That I can understand. You do that because you are morally against the PRACTICE - not the PERSON.

This is a case of them denying services they already provide based on their personal feelings regarding an individual. You cannot discriminate against someone for being gay and there are laws to protect people against that. It could be a black woman or a woman with one limb or a woman who was unmarried or had spiky hair...doesn't matter.

I don't see it any different than a restaurant refusing to serve someone and saying "oh, but you can go eat THERE. They'll serve you." Just because someone else is available it doesn't negate the discriminating act.

Besides...isn't the first line of a doctor's motto "First do no harm?" That's harmful in my eyes...

Very well put, Crick. Thank you. I feel no need to add anything else.

[soupnazi]

Exactly what crick said!

[MamaS]

Originally Posted by crick

I think if you are a doctor, then your personal feelings have to go out the door in many ways.

If you have personal issues on performing abortions, then you don't do that period. You deny EVERYONE that practice. That I can understand. You do that because you are morally against the PRACTICE - not the PERSON.

Ditto to what Crick said.

[nurse_reedle]

Yeah, First do no harm. I don't see how that is *harmful* and for someone that believes that being homosexual is a sin, then they are going to feel as though putting babies in that home is harmful, so harmful in this can be relative. I don't believe for a second that the doctor had an issue with the PERSON but with the LIFE CHOICES. I don't think he should be forced to help someone have babies if he isn't ok with them having them....unless social workers should give babies to *anyone* regardless of what they do, unless adoption agencies are going to require the same. If someone thinks that a certain person should not have a child, they should be able to step out of being the ones to assist them in attaining that. He did direct her somewhere else, so it isn't like he left her high and dry. He just wasn't comfortable particpating in it more than giving her a referral. People should still have personal rights in psite of their choice of career.

[loveajax]

Actually, no matter what the profession (I guess with the exception of some "religious" professions), you are still required to follow the federal and state anti-discrimination laws. You don't "have" to provide infertility services, but once you do, you cannot discriminate. The same holds true for adoption agencies, btw (a local one stopped providing services rather than comply with our state's antidiscrimination laws). (Sorta just repeating you here, Crick!).

[crick]

Thank you Love...I knew you'd get that legal back up in there!

Nurse - if you don't believe that discrimination is harmful, then maybe sometime we'll meet and I'll be more than happy to share my life experiences with you and show you how they have harmed me. All for being deaf.

[Longing2bMom]

I can relate to this case on a personal level because prior to deciding to adopt, I was turned down by one doctor for AI treatments because I am single. I was disappointed when I was turned away, but I didn't then and still don't blame the doctor for following his conscious. He wasn't just performing a medical procedure, he was helping to create a life and I think he did have the absolute right to decide under what conditions he would participate. I think I will make a great mother even without a husband (and I plan to prove that when I adopt), but I don't think I have the right to force any doctor to help me to become the mother I want to be.

[jules17]

Originally Posted by nurse_reedle

I don't believe for a second that the doctor had an issue with the PERSON but with the LIFE CHOICES.

Are you saying that being homosexual is a life choice?

Health professionals, like my husband, do have a choice about what they are comfortable doing. For instance, my husband had to decide if he would dispense the morning after pill. But his decision is for every patient, not a pick and choose decision. That is unethical. (just reiterating crick and love, really)

[DannieAS]

My take is a little different.

I think Crick and Love had the best point, BUT since the Dr. referred the patient and they had the procedure done anyways, this should have been a complaint and handled the way most discrimination/sexual harrassment issues are dealt....in the job. Sometimes a reprimand and write-up in your permanent file will do the trick, and if not it's a basis to be let go. If you're not going to treat all patients equally in an area of medicince, then specialize in another.

I'm just done with people suing. I live in a sue happy state from anything to hot coffee to looking a someone wrong to parents in the school district (even if their child is receiving the best services)...so I just don't like when people sue anymore...especially when they probably got better care somewhere else. IDK, not a legal opinion, just my opinion.

[aclee]

Just curious, where does obesity fall in this? My RE told me that over a certain BMI, he won't treat. I personally felt like it was because that would "throw" their numbers...is that a form of discrimination too?

[Stormster]

Sorry, my sexuality is as much a part of me as the brown eyes I was born with. Even if I was perceived as abusing my child because something I was doing wasn't "mainstream" it would STILL be a physicians ethical duty to treat me despite his or her personal opinion.

[Sleeplvr]

Originally Posted by aclee

Just curious, where does obesity fall in this? My RE told me that over a certain BMI, he won't treat. I personally felt like it was because that would "throw" their numbers...is that a form of discrimination too?

I think it might be legal because you are considered not physically sound for treatment. Standard ART is based on height and weight and if you are outside the standard parameters it will fail. I was obese at the time of treatment and the doctor required me to lose weight because he wasn't going to change the standard protocol. They start with the standard doses and then change with subsequent cycles. The patient ends up wasting a lot of money and time just because of obesity. My doctor sent me to a personal trainer to get the weight off. I ended up changing doctors and the new doctor said that some of the instructions the original doctor gave me for injections were wrong because they didn't take into account my weight or body type/weight distribution. If you carry your weight in your hips the procedure for shots should change.

I know for a fact that my original doctor doctor got rid of patients who he thought wouldn't be succesful in a certain number of cycles. Infertillity clinics are all about the numbers. Their reputation is tied to the number of live births they produce. I was on Infertility forums back during my time and I saw a lot of people clinic hopping. They would hit the end of the road at one clinic and roll on to another.

I think there is a gray area in infertility treatment. If the doctor thinks you are not a candidate based on a physical condition he can deny treatment.