[KarenInCa]

Thanks for the article Sbaglio.
It will be interesting to see how this all pans out now.
According to Rowe, it wasn't even MJs sperm. So, not only was she a surrogate, but she is the birth mother, and he's not the birth father. Rowe has never been, nor is she now, interested in the children. The third child has a different surrogate, who so far has not identified herself, so she is also out of the picture. The nanny seems to be bonded with the children, but MJs mother is the one that will most likely get custody....who knows if she visits the children on a regular basis, or is bonded with them, you never really hear much about Gma.
It seems these children are actually his adopted children rather than bio children, and obviously there's no difference when it comes to legalities and next of kin.
The best case scenario in this would be that the nanny goes to live with MJs mother after she assumes custody, so that these children can continue to have a nurturer and parental figure in the nanny.

[dpen6]

Originally Posted by sbaglio

Oh no, Saya - those photos may be greasy, but they'll be locked up for eternity!

Here's a story from a very reputable periodical:

Mother of Michael Jackon's children Debbie Rowe confesses he was not their father | News | News Of The World

Dear God, Those poor children...that interviiew in my mindhas every badthing I have ever imagined about surrogacy andthe exploitation of chidren. It feels like to me that these kids were concieved as just play things for MJ and a money source for t mother....to top it off they have no idea about what and who their biolgy is...its is just sick,sick sick...Please pray that these kids so easily concieved and brought into the worlkd for the total needs of the adults have someone in their lifes that can understand them and their totally unique issues.

Also, thank goodness debbierowe didn't want more children......after her "insides being torn up and being barren" does't make being a surrogate quite as easy as some may think it is. But hey, she got the money so she's all set to live with her animals...phew! Thats makes me feel better(sarcasm intended)

[jules17]

Originally Posted by Amandak249

Please let's not debate semantics.

Let's not.



I hear you, I really do. I just get so sick of "Are they yours?" that it's tough to see written in an adoption forum. It was the wording that they "weren't his" that got me.

I'm way more troubled by how much he changed himself through the years. Yikes.

[Fran27]

Yeah it's a bit sick... but I guess it's not that different from surrogates in the end... except she got way more money for it. But yeah, nobody would ask a surrogate to take the child back if their parent died, so I guess the whole thing is pretty weird.

Sorry for asking about semantics, but aren't surrogates birth moms also usually? And gestational carriers are the ones who didn't use their own eggs?

[Amandak249]

Jules- I totally hear you. I get asked all the time how I feel about my "real parents." It's frustrating when the general public doesn't always consider the families we love to be "truly" our own.

I should have said "not his BIOLOGICALLY"

Yeah- I'm not sure how I feel about Michael Jackson. I wonder if someone will crawl out of the woodwork soon and give the world some more insight into those allegations. Oy, what a mess.

[mommy3]

Interesting article with an interview of Mark Lester, who played Oliver in "Oliver!" as a child. The more I learn about celebrities, the more I know we may never know it all. I remain so sad, separate from surrogacy, everything. susan

Michael Jackson asked if I wanted to be Blanket's godfather: Friend Mark Lester gives a touching insight into the tortured singer | Mail Online

[SupaModel]

FYI - I just read that the MJ Child Molestation accuser came out and admitted he lied!


After the sudden death of Michael Jackson Evan Chandler tells the truth. Evan- ”Now for the first time i can’t bare to lie anymore. Michael Jackson didn’t do anything to me, all of this was my father lies to escape from being poor.”

In 1993, Chandler told a psychiatrist and police that he and Jackson had engaged in sexual acts that included oral sex, the boy gave detailed description of Jackson’s genitals. The case was settled out of court for a reported $22 million, but the strain led Jackson to begin taking painkillers. Eventually he became addicted.

Now maybe for the remorse of his death Chandler decides to tell us the truth. ” I never meant to lie and destroy Michael Jackson but my father made me to tell only lies. Now i can’t tell Michael how much i’m sorry and if he will forgive me ”.Evan Chandler was tape-recorded saying amongst other things, “If I go through with this, I win big-time. There’s no way I lose. I will get everything I want and they will be destroyed forever…

Under the influence of a controversial father (Jordan Chandler) told his son to tell that Jackson had touched his penis.Jordan Chandler then told a psychiatrist and later police that he and Jackson had engaged in acts of kissing, masturbation and oral sex, as well as giving a detailed description of what he alleged were the singer’s genitals.

” Now for the first time i can’t bare to lie anymore. Michael Jackson didn’t do anything to me, all was my father lies to escape from being poor.”


If this is true thaey make me sick!!

[Happywife]

Oh my gosh, Supa! I am LIVID about that! Jackson's family should sue that boy's (man's?) father. What they did to Michael Jackson was the lowest of the low. That is just SICK! I can't even begin to imagine coaching a child to testify about those things. . sick, sick, sick!!!

[sbaglio]

Supa, where did you find this article??? I had heard this previously, but then I also heard about the more recent case, where MJ went to trial. Apparently there was no financial incentive, and the boy took the stand. The case was thrown, I recall, by the discredited performance of the mother on the stand. But even though he was acquitted, two jurors came out months later and said that they actually believed the charges. I wonder who is and who isn't motivated by money in all this...

On a comforting note, seems MJ's mother petitioned the court for guardianship of the children today. What a nightmare for them, especially with all this stuff coming out about how they were conceived.

[Kat-L]

Originally Posted by sbaglio

I tend to agree. But we all know that biracial kids come in all shades, so who's to say?

Here they are (Blanket is missing):

Here are some pictures of all three kids. These are easier to see.

Blanket with his nanny, Grace. Paris in the car. Michael at age 6. He obviously bleached the older boy's hair. However, you can see from his eyebrows that he naturally had light hair.

If they are his bio-kids, you would think that at least ONE of them would have some of their dad's features. Michael Jackson had a dark skin tone and strong features (before all his surgeries).

Anyway, I'm glad they are with their grandmother.

[KarenInCa]

Supa- That accounts for ONE of the accusers. Im not trying to belabor the subject, but there were more than one. I believe the first one that accused him was a maid's son, also paid off, and he testified at this one's hearing...The maid's son was 24 yrs old at the time of testifying for Evan Chandler, and had no personal reason to testify, other than to still say it was true for him.
Im not sure, but I think there were more as well?

Happywife- If this accuser is now telling the truth, then I agree, it's sick. But isn't also sick, and a bit weird that a grown man would sleep in the same bed as children that he was only acquainted with, a 20, 30, or 40 year old man sleeping with boys??? If he did or did not do anything, after the first time he was accused, he probably should have stopped sleeping with little boys. ALL OF IT creeps me out. I don't think any of the adults were right in the head...the parents of any of the children that had sleepovers with MJ, or MJ himself.

[CRAZY_WOMAN]

Originally Posted by KarenInCa

Supa- That accounts for ONE of the accusers. Im not trying to belabor the subject, but there were more than one. I believe the first one that accused him was a maid's son, also paid off, and he testified at this one's hearing...The maid's son was 24 yrs old at the time of testifying for Evan Chandler, and had no personal reason to testify, other than to still say it was true for him.
Im not sure, but I think there were more as well?

Maybe he was afraid that if he told the truth,That his dad would go to jail.I did think he could have been brainwashed to believe he was molested if he wasn't,But that's before I read that.Also the media known for making a story bigger than it really should be.Also after the trial someone else accused him of molesting him in a vehicle,I don't remember if it was 3 days or 2 weeks while going on a trip.But it was proven wrong,because he was caught lying because of the time line being impossible.But the media didn't make a big deal about that being a lie.If Micheal wasn't a child molester I hope It comes to light.

[KarenInCa]

Crazy_Woman-
I think you're mistaking that I'm saying these things about Evan Chandler and/or after him.
I was speaking of an accuser from much earlier (14 years earlier), Jason Francia. He never went to trial, but testified against MJ in Evan Chandler's case. After seeing the article from Supa, I do recall that the jury did not believe MJ had molested Chandler, but in an article at the time, some jurors spoke up after the fact, and stated that they believed he did molest others prior to him, who had testified in that case.
They, however, could not convict him on those grounds, because the trial was over whether or not he had molested Chandler, not any other children, so MJ was acquitted.

edited to add:
It was fairly easy to find at least one of the articles with the jurors talking after he was acquitted:

MSNBC August 2005

"In June, Hultman told the AP about the verdict: “That’s not to say he’s an innocent man. He’s just not guilty of the crimes he’s been charged with.”
During an appearance on ABC’s “Good Morning America” with five other jurors in June, Cook was one of three who raised their hands when asked if they thought Jackson may have molested other children but not the 13-year-old boy." (meaning Chandler)

[sbaglio]

Okay, I should have known better than to post a link from The News Of The World.

Apparently the whole story was fabricated - surprise, surprise. Debbie Rowe's attorney denied that she said any of that stuff, nor did she give an interview to that useless excuse for a newspaper.

Sorry, folks! I'm only quoting the NYT from now on!

[CRAZY_WOMAN]

Originally Posted by KarenInCa

Crazy_Woman-
I think you're mistaking that I'm saying these things about Evan Chandler and/or after him.
I was speaking of an accuser from much earlier (14 years earlier), Jason Francia. He never went to trial, but testified against MJ in Evan Chandler's case. After seeing the article from Supa, I do recall that the jury did not believe MJ had molested Chandler, but in an article at the time, some jurors spoke up after the fact, and stated that they believed he did molest others prior to him, who had testified in that case.
They, however, could not convict him on those grounds, because the trial was over whether or not he had molested Chandler, not any other children, so MJ was acquitted.

edited to add:
It was fairly easy to find at least one of the articles with the jurors talking after he was acquitted:

MSNBC August 2005

"In June, Hultman told the AP about the verdict: “That’s not to say he’s an innocent man. He’s just not guilty of the crimes he’s been charged with.”
During an appearance on ABC’s “Good Morning America” with five other jurors in June, Cook was one of three who raised their hands when asked if they thought Jackson may have molested other children but not the 13-year-old boy." (meaning Chandler)

He still could have been brain washed to believed he was molested because his parents wanted money just like everyone else or Micheal Jackson could have done it.But just the belief that one father would try to frame him for money,Can mean someone could brain washed a 7 to 10 year that he was molested for money too.