[binkybear]

Originally Posted by paigeturner

Binky, in the spirit of full disclosure, I’m an insomniac and this really can go all night.

To get back to the original post, something like breastfeeding is a big deal and should be disclosed by the adoptive parents. Many people don’t even know that induced breastfeeding is possible. It is not outside the realm of possibility that an expectant mother wouldn’t know to ask! I feel the same about expectant parents honestly disclosing known genetic issues and I feel the same about both sets of parents disclosing drug and alcohol usage. A lie of omission is still a lie in my opinion.

I don't see why it would have to, but haven't you seen my 2am posts??

------
In the spirit of the OP, the realm of possibilities are wide open with any parenting concern. I understand, like already stated, that this is a deep connection of motherhood that some simply don't want to share with another woman. Nothing wrong with it, can't deny someone her feelings on the issue. Can only accept what you're ok with and not accept those things that are not in line with your plan.

[melissa_bear003]

I can honestly see where a pap wouldn't disclose it...not from any intention of secrecy, but for some parents, nursing is about food primarily, and it might not something they'd think could be an issue any more than not eating pork, or using cloth over disposables, homeschooling over public schooling, when to start rice cereal, etc.

What's an issue for one isn't for another. What one might view as a parenting decision others view as a lifestyle choice.

So yeah, I *could* see this being overlooked in discussions, by purely innocent means. Until this thread, its not something I really thought of, beyond a teasing comment to my husband that 'if we adopted an infant, I'm still lactating..." which prompted his diaper horror reaction

[paigeturner]

Binky - Now we're on the same paige...I mean page.

Sorry, couldn't resist. It's the lobbyist in me that makes me try for the last word...very irritating!

[melissa_bear003]

Originally Posted by paigeturner

Now we're on the same paige...I mean page.

Sorry, couldn't resist. It's the lobbyist in me that makes me try for the last word...very irritating!

A lobbyist! Cool! I so want your job!

Everyone always said, if I could talk for a living I'd be rich

So, I guess I'll try to break into the publishing world, lol!

[binkybear]

Originally Posted by paigeturner

Binky - Now we're on the same paige...I mean page.

Sorry, couldn't resist. It's the lobbyist in me that makes me try for the last word...very irritating!

Ok, but know that I was never on another paige...oopppss page...in regards to feedings. That one sentence stuck out on another level to me...totally seperate from feeding preferences. Sorry if I misread it all or didn't explain it well.

Sorry...I'm just a born thinking out louder and from what I'm gathering that's irritating in forums!! IRL people LOVE to blah blah blah in open discussion...type it like you're use to talking it and it's a whole 'nother thing man TAG you're it

[paigeturner]

My problem is I plop sentences out there without explaining what I mean. I just expect everyone to get it by osmosis…I’m basically lazy.

Here’s the thing, shortly after I placed my son I returned home, all of the reasons I’d been away a big giant secret perpetuated by my mother. The first couple of weeks at home she literally took me out running and swimming so I could lose the “baby fat” before anyone caught on – but, I digress. A few short weeks after, a friend of the family adopted an infant son. First, it hit way too close to home, so I was having a difficult time anyway. I was really shocked when she started breastfeeding him. I just didn’t know that it was a possibility. And, I was really grossed out by it. As irrational as it is, the thought of foreign bodily fluids being consumed by “my” child bothers me. And I acknowledge that it’s irrational. But, as I stated if I were to place today or if I had the opportunity to find out back then, it would have been a deal breaker for me. And, therefore my child would not be a good match for either my neighbor back then or the OP today.

There’s not a lot that would be a deal breaker if I had it to do over, BTW. Public vs. private schools, vegetarianism vs. meat eaters or cloth vs. disposable…wouldn’t matter. I asked for a family that either already had a child or planned to adopt another in birth order. I asked for a family that had been married at least five years. I asked for a family that lived in a rural area. I asked for all of this but was never given the chance to look at profiles… From the non-identifying information I received a few years ago they honored my wishes. His parents are also square dancers…had I known that it might have been a deal breaker. Joking! Anyway if I had known to ask, I would have asked for a non-breastfeeding family. I guess it doesn’t matter now. If I get the chance to meet him someday it wouldn’t even be something I would ask. Giggling now thinking about how that conversation would go!

[RavenSong]

To those people who have stated that it should be the expectant mom's responsibility to ask the PAP if she plans to do adoptive breastfeeding, I would like to point out the following. I highly suspect that very few expectant mothers are even aware that this is possible. I know that I didn't know about adoptive breastfeeding until I joined these forums a year and a half ago. And I've worked in the medical field for around 30 years now. I even did a rotation in OB/GYN in the mid-1980's, and I never once heard about it. Maybe it just wasn't being done back then. But my point is that I simply had never heard of this practice until last year. I'm willing to bet most people in our society haven't heard of it either.

When I first saw the threads on adoptive breastfeeding here on the forums, the whole idea kind of made me uneasy. Don't get me wrong. I absolutely believe in the benefits of breastfeeding, especially during the early days when the colostrum comes in. But I just get uneasy about the idea of artificially-induced lactation for some reason.

If this had been available back in 1972, the year I relinquished my son, I don't think I would have wanted his mom to do it. The biological connection to my baby was mine, if that makes any sense. I was giving my beautiful baby boy to them, but my experience in biologically nourishing him in the womb was my very own. I know that probably sounds strange.

If I was an expectant mom in this day and age, I would certainly want to know if the potential amom planned on breastfeeding. If I didn't know anything about how it worked or the nutritional value, I would want it explained to me. Knowledge is a wonderful thing. Something that seems "icky" to me might not be so "icky" if I was educated about the benefits and advantages.

I have a sneaking suspicion that part of the "ickiness factor" might lie in some hard-wired biological reaction. I know that historically many women of the upper class used wet nurses for their babies. But still...I wonder if perhaps nature instilled some type of instinct into mothers who have just given birth to not want other women to nurse their babies.

It's so hard in the beginning when an expectant mom becomes a birthmom. Your maternal instinct is still raging, but you try to ignore it. You know that your child has a new mother. But your milk is still coming in several times a day. And every time your breasts start leaking milk, you wonder if your baby is hungry. It's hard...

One last thing I'd like to say is, please, if you are going to BF your child in the hospital, you must tell his bmom. Most states don't even allow relinquishment papers to be signed until after the bmom is discharged from the hospital. Until TPR is signed, she is still the baby's mom. I cannot even imagine how very difficult it would be for a young woman who has just delivered her baby after carrying him for nine months to know that another woman is breastfeeding him just down the hallway. It's hard enough during this precious time period to say both hello and goodbye to her child. She needs this time for the two of them....

[nurse_reedle]

Raven,
I am going to repsond to part of your post now, the parts I have thought out enough to reply to at 3:30 AM.

Induced lactation has been around for...well...a really long time. It was definitely available in 1972 and I first learned about it in my mom's old 'The Womanly Art of Breastfeeding" book when I was about 13 or 14.

I am really kind of grieving as i read through some of the opinions on adoptive breastfeeding. I am not saying that to make anyone feel guilty. I love adopting. I have felt no greater miracle in my life than the adoption of my son. I could care less about having my own birth experience, even though I would possibly do things differently than say a potential e-mom would ( or maybe the same...who knows). Breastfeeding him was AMAZING. He took to it qucikly and loved it, quickly refusing bottles. He had gotten immunities from his birth mother in utero and now he had the added benefit of immunities from me as well...double the immunities. My body that had failed me and my child before (lost pregnancy) was successfully nourishing my child! Our bond is amazing, my ability to respond to his meends quickly when he was little helped build trust and bonding faster (I believe). I have a lot of safety concerns about formula, but not about my breast milk. There are so many things about breastfeeding that I can't even describe that I feel are so special and the thought of not having at least that way to nourish our child...that is devastating to me.

I think alot of the "ickness" factor comes from our culture. So many in our culture think it is private and should be shut in another room. People say it is the best for babies, but I think for a lot of people that is just hat you say...but really formula is just as good. We don't see people leaving their kids with someone and that person breastfeeding them in their absence (normal in some countries) and things of that nature. We don't even see a lot of biological mothers breastfeeding (although that is on the rise thankfully). JMO.

I really respect the mother's need to have a special time just her and her baby to decide finally, to say hello and good bye...to just be. I seriously doubt I will be breastfeeding in the hospital. Not to hide it, but to respect her time with the baby and so she doesn't feel pressured to place simply for reasons like the breastfeeding bonding starting already.

Falling alseep....be back in the daylight.

[Emberbit]

My daughter's mom didn't plan to nurse but she knew I intended to nurse in hospital (which strangely, was a deal breaker for some parents). She asked if I woudl pump and we left it in the air. If I hadn't pumped, baby woudl have been formula fed but...

I did nurse in hospital and I pumped after. Baby drank my milk exclusively, sometimes straight from the tap, for her first 5 months. When I felt I couldn't do it any more and they started introducing formula, it wasn't going well so baby's mom induced lactation. Now she's pumping for the baby (suplemented by frozen leftovers from me).

When I first heard that she had decided to induce lactation instead of switching to formula, I was really really grossed out. Our relationship is open enough that I expressed (timidly) that it bothered me. She told me that she'd rather have me pump but that she couldn't make my decision. I had chosen to stop so she was *making the next-best choice for her baby*.

We talked about my feelings and they did what they had decided. My feelings did not impact their decision - adoption is not co-parenting - btu if I've learned anything these last few months, I've learned not to try to hide my feelings. If they stay bottled up, they 'cause trouble.

That said, if baby's mom had planned to breastfeed or decided to induce lactation at any point before TPR, it would have bothered me and we would have talked about it. Either I would have gotten over it or we would not have been a good match. If I found out post-TPR that she had planned to induce and didn't tell me, it probably would have damaged the relationship; I'm not sure how much.

I don't know your posts so I don't know what level of openness you're hopign for. But baby's parents wanted it VERY open and we knew we couldn't hide our feelings on either side and keep the level of openness we wanted.

[binkybear]

Originally Posted by nurse_reedle

My body that had failed me and my child before (lost pregnancy) was successfully nourishing my child! Our bond is amazing, my ability to respond to his meends quickly when he was little helped build trust and bonding faster (I believe).

I think your intentions and obvious love for your child and future child will shine through no matter how you decide to approach the subject with emom. You are obviously doing this for reasons greater than yourself and that should over ride any grief you're feeling right now about this topic floating out here in fourmland. Hoping your morning is better emotionally
((Hugs))

[CeltiaSkye]

I am planning on breastfeeding after adoption. I have discussed it with the e-mom and she said she didn't care one way or the other. She even offered to pump while we were in the hospital (we're planning on rooming in together after the birth).

As for putting it in the profile or not, I don't know what to tell you. We're doing a private directed adoption and so never had to do the profile thing. I do know now from discussions with her that there's one issue in our life that most profiles tend to leave out because it's a dealbreaker, but in our case it was what sealed the deal.

[Fran27]

I'd definitely talk about it also. Because it can be a deal breaker. If it's so important to you, I'm shocked your agency won't let you put it in the profile though.

[Stormster]

Originally Posted by Fran27

I'd definitely talk about it also. Because it can be a deal breaker. If it's so important to you, I'm shocked your agency won't let you put it in the profile though.

I'm not shocked at all unfortunately.

But I'm thinking: even though I'm not sure how I feel about it, I guess it's still "controversial" in most circles which is why it should be divulged.

But then home schooling is also controversial so should that always be offered if not asked? What about vegetarianism, co-sleeping, or any other alternative lifestyle stuff?

Like to me, as someone who was raised in a Jewish home I never even CONSIDERED not circumcising a child so as a birth mother I would never mention it. Yet to some members here it is the circumcision that is "barbaric" (yeah that was kind of offensive but I'll roll with it)

It's so relative and hard to know what is right and wrong.

Judaism for instance ....in another thread everyone agreed religion is so important to be clear about in advance but then....to what degree and what if you want to convert to a new religion at some point?

It's just a really compelling topic because at what point are the aparents free to make choices along the way and yet feel they kept their promises.

I don't know if I'm rambling, kind of just "thinking out loud"

[JustPeachy]

I didn't have the option of knowing so much back when I placed, so if my son's mom was going to bf, I probably wouldn't have known about it. I had no idea at that time that it would even be a possibility. However, after reading some of the posts here on amoms inducing lactation, I have to say, if it was an option at the time, I would not have felt comfortable with it. It's hard to explain why. Some of the other bmoms touched on it, but for me it's so hard to put into words. I wish I would have breastfed my son, even for just a day. My doctor actually tried to get me to do so, but I had it set in my mind that if I was placing, I couldn't do it PERIOD. She was pressuring me to bf because she wanted me to keep my baby, and I really didn't even think or know I could bf for just a few days and still place my child for adoption. I was young, naive, and uninformed, but also, at that time, most mothers still were not breastfeeding, so I guess I didn't want to start it to begin with. In retrospect, I wish I would have done it. Maybe if I got to know my son's mom, and we were planning an open adoption and we could talk it over and I really got to get a comfort level with it, I could be swayed to change my mind, but the way I feel right now, I just don't know if I could be comfortable with the situation.

I am not trying to be antagonisitc (I hope my question doesn't come off this way), but I would like to ask the amoms if they were unable to breastfeed for whatever reason, if they would feel comfortable letting the birthmother breastfeed their child. What about another woman altogether? A wetnurse or friend or other relative? Or another amom who had induced lactation?

[Stormster]

interesting question.

I would not have breastfed and probably would have died of jealousy if ANYONE else had too. But I do wish he could have had breast milk. He really could have used the nutrition and immunity.

Lame answer, I know.