[loveajax]

I don't know the answers, Elle, but I applaud you for being honest and asking some tough questions.

I had a post recently where I said my parents are "archie bunkerish" (though they don't use racist language per se, it's more of just these weird "assumptions"). In any event, I have seen them really learn and grow since we adopted DD. I know it sounds corny, but I think children have a special way of "teaching" people about acceptance. That's not to say I haven't had to "educate" my parents on stuff and if I thought they were saying harmful things/doing harmful things, I honestly would just "cut them out." It's also not to say that if you think it is going to be a tough road, I don't "blame" you for not going down it. (I think the difference between your situation and mine is that my parents are more "ignorant" and it sounds like your FIL has formed some pretty racist opinions based on his own experiences, so that seems almost harder).

Think it through, talk it out, etc. Good luck!

[nikkianni]

Fran: I can't speak for anyone else, but I certainly wasn't implying that only being open to CC situations is wrong for any reason. This, like nearly everything else in adoption, is a very personal decision.
The OP was asking for our thoughts on this particular situation in relation to adopting an AA or BR child. Everyone provided those thoughts.
I also don't see where anyone was advising that any child be sheltered. However, there is a certain amount of acceptance and unconditional love a person should be able to expect when among family.
What many posters seemed to be saying is that if the OP's family could or would not provide that support for the child in this instance-or could even be mean or insulting- then the only thing to do in order to protect that child might be to walk away from the relative in question.
That IMO is not sheltering. That is protecting your baby. I certainly wouldn't subject my child to someone who went on and on about how adopted kids aren't "real" family, etc. I don't care if that person is a guy at the grocery store or my Mother. This in my personal view is the same type of thing.

[aclee]

Originally Posted by Fran27

I think it's much harder personally to realize that it would be bad for the child, than doing it anyway because it's easier...

Doing it anyway because it's easier? Did I miss understand or are you making a broad assumption that some people that adopt transracial do it because somehow it's EASIER??? Seriously?

I find that highly offensive. If you want a CC child that's fine, but don't put yourself up on some type of pedistal like others took the easy way out by making the very serious choice to adopt a non CC child. Are adoption classes and education about a transracial adoption easier? We have to rpove ourselves at every turn through the process...something that a CC couple adopting a CC child doesn't have to do. We still have to prove ourselves. There is nothing easy about that. I'm ok with that. I TOOK THAT ON...not because it was easier, but because I knew I could handle it. Not everyone can, I realize that. I don't like it, but I realize it. If the OP decided to adopt a BR child, how would that be easier for her?

[Cjmeck]

Originally Posted by aclee

Doing it anyway because it's easier? Did I miss understand or are you making a broad assumption that some people that adopt transracial do it because somehow it's EASIER??? Seriously?

I find that highly offensive. If you want a CC child that's fine, but don't put yourself up on some type of pedistal like others took the easy way out by making the very serious choice to adopt a non CC child. Are adoption classes and education about a transracial adoption easier? We have to rpove ourselves at every turn through the process...something that a CC couple adopting a CC child doesn't have to do. We still have to prove ourselves. There is nothing easy about that. I'm ok with that. I TOOK THAT ON...not because it was easier, but because I knew I could handle it. Not everyone can, I realize that. I don't like it, but I realize it. If the OP decided to adopt a BR child, how would that be easier for her?

Okay...yep, you summed up what I was thinking. Yes, the wait-time was potentially "easier" but that has been the only easy thing I've encountered by choosing to adopt a BR child. For anyone considering adopting outside of their race, I recommend doing some reading on the Transracial parenting section here to see what some of us deal with.
I also wanted to say to the OP that its FINE to say you will only adopt a CC child. It does not make you a racist. Dh and I had some very serious, soul-searching discussions when deciding about what race to be open to. It is very hard b/c you almost feel like you are excluding children based on their race; and that was difficult for me. But what we realized is that we were INCLUDING which chidren would fit in best with our family, our community, our lives. And based on that, we did adopt a BR child. I do think some people may choose to adopt a non-white child b/c it can be quicker (and potentially a huge mistake if that is their only reasoning...); and I'm betting that is what Fran meant. I hope so anyway.

[loveajax]

I can't speak for Fran but I thought she meant that it's better to do the work up front (before adoption) than just dive in because it's "easier" to avoid confronting family members, etc. (?).

PS: I just dived in (by the way!) and God knows I probably didn't think it thru enough. But it's worked out well nonetheless!

[SupaModel]

Originally Posted by Fran27

Is it just wrong to ask for a CC child? Sometimes it's the impression I get on these forums... .

Well I know from experience (on here) it's wrong to ask for a BR child and not full AA!!

Can you believe I had the nerve to want a child that looked like DH and myself?!?

haha... people really need to get over themselves

[BethanyB]

What we have to think about in situations like this is that the child comes first. Yes, you want to adopt a child and add on to your family and that is important. But we have to remember that not only is the child not asking to be adopted, they also don't get the choice of what family they are adopted into.

We, as adults and future parents need to make the best choice FOR our future children. No one here wants to burst this person's bubble. No one here wants a family to be destroyed. BUT the child is who we need to think about.

I personally think it would be wrong to adopt a biracial child into your family. I personally don't even like when people request biracial over "full" AA. African Americans are not really "full" due to slavery in this country but that is another debate altogether. My two "full" AA kids who are bio siblings have the SAME features yet one is very brown and one is very light. -It's a crap shoot. So if you would not adopt an AA child, I would not risk adopting a biracial child cause what happens when they look black?

Your family uses one of the most horrible words in the english language. Your father was a teacher in an urban school district. Those children need good teachers who care about them and this is how your father felt about the very same kids he was supposed to love and teach?

I'm not trying to be mean but as a teacher and a mother to black children, I would never allow him to be around my children nor teach where I teach. So why would you allow that to be around a child? A child who has no choice in the situation?

You sound like a good person who wants to do the right thing. I think you already know that you don't want to cut contact with your family. But if you proceeded with the adoption of a child of color, and you did NOT cut contact, that would be the worst possible outcome for your child. And that is not fair.

There is nothing wrong with adopting another CC child. Although I agree with the others who say that it's still important to speak to your family about them not speaking like that. I would have cut contact with my family BEFORE adopting my children if they used the N word. For those of you who think that is cold, maybe her family should do the right thing and STOP using that language so they don't lose HER as a family member.

[Fran27]

Originally Posted by aclee

Doing it anyway because it's easier? Did I miss understand or are you making a broad assumption that some people that adopt transracial do it because somehow it's EASIER??? Seriously?

I find that highly offensive. If you want a CC child that's fine, but don't put yourself up on some type of pedistal like others took the easy way out by making the very serious choice to adopt a non CC child. Are adoption classes and education about a transracial adoption easier? We have to rpove ourselves at every turn through the process...something that a CC couple adopting a CC child doesn't have to do. We still have to prove ourselves. There is nothing easy about that. I'm ok with that. I TOOK THAT ON...not because it was easier, but because I knew I could handle it. Not everyone can, I realize that. I don't like it, but I realize it. If the OP decided to adopt a BR child, how would that be easier for her?

I don't know how all agencies work... but I've seen plenty with which it is indeed easier, faster and cheaper, to adopt an AA child... and they don't give you all those educational classes you're mentioning.

I remember arguing on another forum about that new proposal that wanted to get people to take classes before adopting transracially... I thought it was not a bad idea, and I got labelled as racist, with 10 people saying that they would just raise an AA child as they would a CC child. That color didn't matter. After 3 years on that forum, I left after that... I tried to explain that there are lots of challenges, but they didn't get it...

My point is that most people out there don't have a clue about transracial adoption. And it's the same people who go to an agency and decide to adopt children of another race, because they want a baby asap, and it's faster and cheaper this way... and they truly don't care about skin color... They're good people, they just don't necessarily realize that it can be hard.

Hence my comment... I know the people who take the time to post here definitely took the time to educate themselves beforehand. I'm just not sure it's the norm.

Supamodel, I remember that thread. I think the point was that with biracial children, you never know what color they will be, so having some expectations about their look is just risky.

[SupaModel]

Originally Posted by Fran27

I don't know how all agencies work... but I've seen plenty with which it is indeed easier, faster and cheaper, to adopt an AA child... and they don't give you all those educational classes you're mentioning.

I remember arguing on another forum about that new proposal that wanted to get people to take classes before adopting transracially... I thought it was not a bad idea, and I got labelled as racist, with 10 people saying that they would just raise an AA child as they would a CC child. After 3 years on that forum, I left after that...

My point is that most people out there don't have a clue about transracial adoption. And it's the same people who go to an agency and decide to adopt children of another race, because they want a baby asap, and it's faster and cheaper this way... and they truly don't care about skin color... They're good people, they just don't necessarily realize that it can be hard.

Hence my comment... I know the people who take the time to post here definitely took the time to educate themselves beforehand. I'm just not sure it's the norm.

Supamodel, I remember that thread. I think the point was that with biracial children, you never know what color they will be, so having some expectations about their look is just risky.

Sorry but I have to agree with Fran. When it's faster, cheaper, most people see it as an easier option. I know AA/BR situations were 1/2 the price of CC's situations.

Does that suck? Heck yeah!!! Am I glad it worked out in my favor? DEFINITELY!!

aclee- I understand what you are saying. I just don't believe everyone has your genuine intentions.

[binkybear]

To the OP: I'm looking at the one sentence where you state you really want to be open to a biracial adoption. I guess starting at square one I would ask myself "why". (just starting at square one, as with any question you ask yourself). You have to examine your own family life for those answers.

You've already have the background with your immediate and extended family. You're asking the forum questions you have to ask yourself and your family. All of those questions about changing, adjusting, etc should be presented to them point blank. If your not totally ok with severing your family from your lives, your daughters life, etc then you need to ask them. I've said this before out here, communication is the only way to find out.

I know I'm going to see posts saying it's your private deicision to make. That's right, BUT they're the focus of this post here so you're obviously looking for answers....answers you're only going to get from them. You're not asking them for approval, you're not asking them to make or assist in making "your" decision, not at all. You're being proactive in seeing what your future family life will be with or without them.

I understand what Fran was trying to say in her post or two. We attended one specific informational meeting where an agency was willing to make all kinds of acceptions to their otherwise rock solid policies....all based on race alone. They had a significant need for APs for AA and biracial infants. They were willing to break policy and accept gender requests, fees were lowered, all while boasting super fast turn times. When presented with those kind of options, well, this may (or may not) make some aspects of transracial adoption "easier" for those not fully heart and soul commited to raising a child of another race. It didn't personally impress us, the whole meeting left us cringing but that's another story.

edited for my terrible spelling!!

[nikkianni]

Supa: DH called that the "discount rack attitude" and it so disgusted him that we stopped all adoption talk for about three months.
Our agency charges the same rate regardless of what color the child happens to be. It's one of the reasons we chose the agency.

[Vogi2002]

Originally Posted by Fran27

I remember people saying that maybe they should not have married transracially then. It's different though. You don't choose who you fall in love with. You can choose the race of the child you will adopt. And I doubt anyone here would love a CC child any less than an AA child.

JIMO as always.

Yeah but you can choose to NOT DATE any black men AT ALL only because they are black and because your family wouldn't approve. Wouldn't stop me...and if they had a problem I would tell them to deal or not be around us....this is the same thing as my adoption.

I'm not saying it's wrong to only choose CC if you are CC, or AA if you are AA...I don't agree with being open to every other race than AA though, just my personal opinion.

[Yash]

Fran,

I will post here and say that I do think it's a form of racism when people only want to adopt a child of their race. And I find it abhorrent when Christians say this. When Christians say this, this line from a song runs through my head. "Tell how can I love Jesus when I've never seen His face, yet I see you crying and I turn and walk away."

People strongly disagree with me about it and have told me I was wrong, but I'm not. A baby, a child needs a family but you turn them down or won't allow your profile to be shown because of the color of their skin, if that's not racism I don't know what is.

I know we aren't perfect and we all sin, but we should call a spade a spade and not make excuses.

[aclee]

Originally Posted by Yash

Fran,

I will post here and say that I do think it's a form of racism when people only want to adopt a child of their race. And I find it abhorrent when Christians say this. When Christians say this, this line from a song runs through my head. "Tell how can I love Jesus when I've never seen His face, yet I see you crying and I turn and walk away."

People strongly disagree with me about it and have told me I was wrong, but I'm not. A baby, a child needs a family but you turn them down or won't allow your profile to be shown because of the color of their skin, if that's not racism I don't know what is.

I know we aren't perfect and we all sin, but we should call a spade a spade and not make excuses.

Crying my eyes out...THANK YOU! I'm so tired of people trying to tell me I need to accept that adopting an AA child "isn't for everyone" for one of a million different excuses. People need to look at THEMSELVES and say, I can't do it, I'm not strong enough to outwardly face down racism, that's the only real truth. I hate having to say it over and over, because then I think people think I pat myself on the back because I did "it". I didn't do "it" I did the right thing. I opened my heart and took the child God brought to me without turning any away based on only the color of their skin. Am I proud of that? Proud I was strong enough to right thing, even if it wasn't the easiest? Yes, I'm proud. Period.

[sbaglio]

Originally Posted by nikkianni

Supa: DH called that the "discount rack attitude" and it so disgusted him that we stopped all adoption talk for about three months.
Our agency charges the same rate regardless of what color the child happens to be. It's one of the reasons we chose the agency.

I feel the same way as Supa. It's difficult...we love our DD more than anything, but we wouldn't have her if it were not for the differential adoption fees we paid because she is biracial. Financially speaking, we were also not in a position to pay double that amount for an adoption of a child of color (and we specifically wanted a child of color). While I have mixed feelings about the practice, I dare anyone to say to me that my child was on the "discount rack", and expect to leave the conversation with kneecaps intact.