[Boxerlady29]

Originally Posted by jren

Maybe a pinch collar or something? It has "points" that face the neck, but they are NOT pointy at all - couldn't peirce the skin. The points don't cause pain, but when the collar is pulled, it can pinch the skin. (You don't pull hard - and we tested it on our own skin to make sure!). We used it with the direction of the trainer - a specialist who worked with police dogs and retrained fight dogs for pets. Maybe if you had something that you knew could stop the dog if you had to, you wouldn't be afraid.

A prong collar!!!
You can get them from Petsmart. Made my boxer a changed little man. lol

[mandiedandie]

In response to the "prong collars", etc...we've tried just about EVERY collar out there with her, and although the prong collar helped avert her attention on walks, it didn't do what I hoped for it to, which was to help assert our dominance. I actually bought a Gentle Leader head collar, and it's kind of working, but it's the 2nd day. She doesn't pull with it on, but sometimes she just doesn't walk at all. It's supposed to reinforce your leadershop role. She did pretty good at the Vet today, a dog tried to come up to her and she started growling and I stood up and in front of her and she shutup and accepted a treat for calming down. Also, a group of 4 dogs started fighting and we had to walk by them to get to the exam room, and she followed me without getting involved. She snapped at the vet while she was getting the shot, but it was pain induced and she didn't try to attack anyone after the needle was removed, so that's good...I think?

As for PetSmart, the lady seemed pretty knowledgeable and reassuring when I told her of our problems and they say they only use positive reinforcement. She said that not all dogs like other dogs, etc, so we don't have to force it, but letting our dogs around other dogs and people should help them a bit. We don't have any behaviorists here in Yuma, AZ. We have only one other trainer and like I said, they're on vacation, and even then, I don't know how effective they'd be. Neither of our dogs have problems guarding food or toys or treats, I could stick my face in their bowls while they're eating and they'll just look at me and keep eating.

I'm not afraid of either of my dogs, if that were the case, I'd be less likely to try and work on them and have a hard time loving them like I do, they're not aggressive with us, just other dogs (mainly) and people they don't know (sometimes, but not always...sometimes they love strangers...it depends, it's weird). I meant I am frustrated and afraid of what the outcome will be and that Cadella's (the big dog) fear will never go away and that we'll have to get rid of her because she'll become aggressive with the baby because of it.

We don't yell at our dogs, we try to stay pretty calm. Cadella only really responds to positive reinforcement, but I can't tell her in a high pitched, excited voice to sit ebcause she doesn't listen then...only when I speak in a normal, calm voice, but after a while of training, she just acts pretty aloof and like..NOPE, we're done. It's just knowing if that's okay and means we are on the right track or if I am doing it wrong. Hmmm. I will check out the site. Thank you

[mrskt]

Something in your last post just caught my attention - you should only be doing short training sessions - maybe 5-10 minutes, or start even shorter and work your way up... training sessions are all about positive reinforcement and trying to hold their attention more than a few minutes at a time will frustrate you AND them! Shorter, more frequent sessions may help...

Good luck!
Katy

[mandiedandie]

Thanks...I know they should be short, yesterday I just kept at it, and it drove me nuts and we were both exhausted by the end of the day. It's just hard when you know you that it could happen ANY TIME, and I just want us all to be well-prepared. Thank you Katy..I will TRY to remember to stop spazzing out.

[SupaModel]

Well while we decided to begin our adoption process our french bulldog of a year and half just dropped dead. We have no idea why we just came home and found him like that.

So a few months later after being done with homestudy and on the wait. We decided to get TWO chocolate lab puppies!!! Of course we were thinking by the time we get our baby the labs will be much older and trained. We also thought it would keep our minds off the adoption.

Well a few weeks after getting the puppies we get the call telling us a baby was born and do we want him
So now I'm a SAHM with a new born baby and TWO chocolate lab puppies!!!

Hate to say it but the Labs have been a HUGE mistake. I just dont have any time to train them and DH is at work all day. I really feel sorry for them.

Hey... Does anyone want two labs???

[binkybear]

Being a person who has rescued from shelters, and humane societies I'm going to ignore some things here so I don't bug myself out or others out! -eek-

I would recommend anything by Ian Dunbar. His books and videos are some of the most regarded amongst those who practice positive reinforcement training with your dog. I can say this from personal experience. If you are uncomfortable with a trainer or training technique and your gut says something is not right, walk away with your dog. More harm can come from it than good, especially with a dog who is already anxious or fearful. We worked really hard to undo one trainers use of a prong collar. At the time I thought "they knew best". We finally found an outstanding trainer and facility who basically told us anyone can call themselves a certified trainer becuase there's nothing really governing it all. Trust your gut and your dogs progress.

Gentle leaders are good harnesses. We found a harness called "Sense-ible" to work on our dogs (who range from 45-90 pounds). It stops the pulling and jumping and does not affect their face at all, just goes around their "torso". About asserting dominance and all of that stuff. Your dog just needs to know that your ok and in control. A good trainer will take you out on a walk or watch what you're doing and correct you most times, not the dog. (it's pretty funny how that works!) One example with my first dog years ago was I would start to get worried way before my dog saw the other dog coming towards us. I would tighten up on the leash signaling to my dog that something was wrong and the dog of course would react. A good trainer will help you through all of those things. Good Luck and have fun with the training, it should be positive and fun for you and the dogs

[ecs5298]

We brought our dd home at 36 hours old and the dogs didn't have any problems. You can have them cuddle with a blanket that is the smell of the baby. Give the dogs lots of attention when the baby comes home. Keceesmom (sorry sp.) says a doll that cries is good. Otherwise open the door to the nursery. We have both cats and dogs and that worked out really well. One dog is considered our dd's dog and the other one has a princess complex anyway. They are both German Shorthaired Pointers. We have 3 cats and they are Maine Coons. Never had problems with them either.

[RNB]

We are German Shepherd breeders and have done a lot of training with people and their dogs. My first thought is for you just to get a German Shepherd because they are awsome with kids, but that would be kinda prejudice. PM me and I'll send you the picture we took a couple weeks ago 2 week old J.J. taking a nap on our Shepherd. But the key is what you already mentioned...socialization. And what Jren said with regards to the pecking order in the house is great advice.

The first thing is that no matter what breed of dog you have, you have to get in your mind that they are pack animals and you are the head of the pack (the alpha dog). Now that said, here are a few tips you can start now that will pay dividends later:

1. Roll Fido over on his/her back (even against their will) and pin them there with you (the alpha) on top. If you have a dog that resists this, they may alreay think they are the alpha, and you'll just need to make it known they are wrong. Remember, dogs are pack animals and their social ladder needs to be established early. If this hasn't been done they will think they are the alpha and you are under them. If you have ever seen puppies in a whelping pen "play fighting" you'll understand, they are really establishing the alpha pup.

2. Never feed your dog when they tell you to. In other words, you eat first, then feed them. In the pack, the alpha dog always eats first and the lesser dogs bring them food. If your dog eats first and then you sit down to eat you are showing them that they are the alpha. Same goes with snacks and toys. You tell them when it is time for these things, not the other way around.

3. Never let your dog take you outside. In other words, when it is time to go outside have them sit and after you have stepped outside, you call them out. The same for when you go inside.

4. When playing or cuddling with your dog, never let them be on top of you or even have their head above yours. This goes back to the whelping pen. A dog standing on your chest is a dog yelling, "I run this house!"

5. What Jren said about not letting them in the baby's room is true. Eventually the dog(s) will need to learn that you are the alpha, then all the other humans, then them. And everyone above them makes the rules and boundries.

6. Socialization is great to teach them not to be nervous around other dogs and people. They should teach you about how you being nervous will run right down the leash to your now nervous dog. The class should help eliminate this, but you can help now by taking the dogs around people or other dogs. Maybe take a walk once in a while and stop to talk to someone for a minute.

7. Do not let your dog out in front of you while walking them. They should always walk in a "heal" position. Right next to your left knee. A good prong collar will make this clear while doing training. Particularlly for those not so bright breeds. After it is clearly established that you are the alpha and you are walking him/her, not the other way around, then allowing them a little free leash once in a while is okay. But most of the walk should be with them right next to you.

8. Breed. For most of us, we probably had our dog before our kids. There is nothing we can do about that. However, for the next dog, research the breed. Going to the AKC website and reading how a certain breed is can eliminate headaches later. For example, many people ran out and bought those lovable Dalmations after the remake of 101 Dalmations. What 99% didn't do was read about how those dogs require 2-3 VERY active play sessions per day. Hence the reason shelters across America are full of Dalmations, and landfills are full of chewed up furniture. Cute, yes, but they need to release lots of energy or they will release it on your stuff. Or how about the very active family that falls in love with the puppy with the big ears, so they bring their new Bassett Hound home to find that the only fetchng being done is them going to get the ball he won't go get. There are some excellent family/kid breeds out there (German Shepherds are honestly among the best for families in my opinion.)

Last example, and I'll bring this free dog training to a close. German Shepherds belong to the herding breed. If the family (their flock) is not all in one place, they are not happy. So at night, Cherokee will check the girls rooms to make sure they are in bed, now she checks the crib to make sure J.J. is in there, and once my wife and I tuck in for the night, she goes to bed. Her bed is at the foot of our bed next to the crib (never on our bed, that is for the alpha and his wife).

Spend 5-10 minutes a day working with your dog now, and when the baby comes you should be just fine. (But then keep an eye on the dog anyway, lol. )
RnB

[alinev]

Assume nothing. My DH and I met at a dog run so our dogs were a huge part of our existence, in bed, on the furniture. Sweet with everyone, children included. Fast forward 2.5 years, our wonderfully socialized beagle took a nip at our son. I almost threw up. I immediately went to the internet and to my surprise found out the 2 million, yes 2 million, children are bitten in the face every year. They are not "attacked" they are "corrected". In a dog pack, an older dog will nip at a yonger dog to correct it. The fact was that my dog was only acting on her most basic instinct . We spoke to a trainer and immediately had to change all of our previous behavior, no dogs on the bed, no dogs on the sofa, etc. We had to completely reestablish the heirachy of our home to protect our children AND our dogs. The trainer said to ALWAYS remember that dogs are NOT little people in furry clothes. They are hardwired for certain behaviors and although we all want to believe, or have previously seen, that our dogs act more like Lassie then Cujo, it does not mean that the same animal cannot be provoked.

There was a happy ending for us, kids and dogs are all fine, but it was an eye opener that I never saw coming. Follow your instinct, get a trainer, research animal behavior and NEVER leave your child alone with your dog.

[Fran27]

RNB, no offense, but those methods are way past... Dogs are not stupid. They know we're not dogs. Using dog methods to make us the alpha will just make the dog nervous and fearful. You need to get their respect to get them to see you are the alpha, and that's not going to happen by forcing them on their back.

[nikkianni]

Training sessions: You may have mentioned this (or someone else did) and I missed it, but when it's time to "work," switch your dog's collar. It doesn't have to be to a choke or spike collar or any of those. Just something with a different pattern or look will do. This is their signal that it's time to work and not play.
I personally never use a choke, spike or shock collar. Even though my latest addition has tempted me sorely over the last few years. I don't like them and I won't use them. I tried it once and hated it. Can't imagine how the dog felt about it.
We have two Golden Retrievers and I've raised and shown Goldens and labs. We've also had more mutts than I can count over the years.
I didn't do anything to prepare our dogs for a baby, I know I should have but I didn't. They're both obedience trained, though the male likes to forget that as much as possible. But they have their boundaries and they know them. They sleep in our room, DEFINITELY not our bed. Our house is all hardwood floors except the living room, so they are allowed to roam wherever they wanted except onto the carpet unless invited. When they've been naughty, they have to spend time in the mudroom. Our male actually punished himself for getting in the garbage, lol.
Our male is the biggest gump ever, but he's also sneaky-smart. Our female is very protective of me especially. But they're both true Goldens, so aside from a frisbee, kids are the best things EVER. We weren't too worried about bringing a baby home. Still, my cousin's pitbull attacked her two-year-old apparently out of nowhere so we were well aware that we had to watch our dogs carefully.
When DD came home, Luke fell in love. Seriously, he follows her around wherever she goes, sleeps beside her crib and is now her own personal furry jongle gym. We were shocked at how careful and sweet our hyperactive 98 lb ball of energy could be.
Libby on the other hand wasn't interested. At least that's what I thought. Then when Eve was about a month old, the poor, poor Schwan's man stopped by. Let's just say that my personal protector is now Eve's personal protector and the Schwan's man has a healthy respect for standing outside of a door at all times.
Now that DD is cruising and crawling, Libby is showing more interest. I walked into the dining room not too long ago to find Lib cleaning Eve while Eve sat beside her and giggled.
Anywho, I think that you just won't know for sure how your dogs will react until a baby is actually in the picture. But I think taking socializing steps is a good way to prepare them. And getting them used to baby things isn't a bad idea either. Swings, cribs, music, that kind of thing.

[Cjmeck]

I have to make this quick but I really wanted to respond to you. Fear aggressive dogs are absolutely the hardest dogs to rehab. I say that as a former vet tech, and owner of a rottweiler and (formerly) a german shepherd. And I love love love pit bulls. You should get the book called "The Cautious Canine" by Patricia McConnell. If there is anyway you can help your dog; the answers will be in that book. My rottweiler has been the absolute best dog in the world with my kids. But my german shepherd was another story--her personality was identical to your dog. I loved her more than I can possibly explain. I tried different dog trainers, different animal behaviorists, she went away to be trained/rehabbed for 9 months even... But, ultimately, she was afraid of my son and growled at him. So, sadly, we had to give her away to a friend with no kids. I'm not telling you this to make you sad, but to tell you it is a very real possibility that you won't be able to help your dog. There is a very very small window of opportunity for proper dog socialization; and some dogs just cannot be helped. I hate that, I really really do. I miss my shepherd so much; and its been 5 years since we let her go. But being a mom sometimes means you have to make very hard decisions for your kids. Read the book. Call Cesar Millan--the Dog Whisperer Maybe he'll come to your rescue. You're very smart to work on this now.

[Casey677]

I've only read the first page. We have three large humane society rescue dogs. So far they've been fantastic with our girls and way more tolerante with tail and ear pulling then I ever imagined. I will say that almost three years later, we still have problems with them eating the kids' toys. I have baby gates everywhere and only one is actually for the kids, lol. While we are gone, they are now only allowed in the kitchen /dining room / masterbedroom area. The rest of the house is gated off and I have to make sure there are zero baby toys on the floor in the rooms they can access. I have grown used to the toy eating and yes, it would be eaiser to just walk out the door, but if we did that so many things would be lost. It is only one of my dogs that starts the toy chewing, and then the other two join in.

The biggest problem was in the very beginning, the dogs pooped in the nursery to show their displeasure. That lasted for about 3 weeks. Ewww!

Oh, ours sleep in the floor in our room as well. No more bed or couches for them!

[mom2handq]

We were so nervous about this with our dog. She was hyper, needy, and not well socialized, and could be fear-aggressive with other dogs. However, when we brought our first son home it was like she understood completely. She's actually calmed down quite a bit, and has never been aggressive with the boys even when they sit on her or pull her tail.

One thing we didn't expect was that she would act out (in non-agressive ways) to get attention from my DH and I. She started peeing on the floor (which never happened before), knocking over the trash can and stealing food whenever we turned around. All annoying things, but posed no harm to our kids.

[spine]

socialize. that includes having people over. once you have kids, all kinds of people will probably come to your house-- relatives, kids' friends, social workers, etc.

walk your dog. walk tall and confidently, and do a lot of direction changes to help teach the "heel." your fear-aggressive dog will likely pick up on your assertiveness and trust that you're taking care of things. (if she's cripplingly fearful, do tons of research and try to get an in-person trainer who is familiar with fearful dogs.) you decide when and where to go, you don't look down at your dog (she looks up to you!) and you don't allow her to break her "heel" for any reason (except, in the case of my rottweiler, when she just starts pooping mid-walk). if she wants to sniff, pee, or get all riled up about another dog or person coming by, you "free" her or you change directions, asking her to "heel." you can throw in quick changes of direction, sit, down, etc. if you have trouble changing her focus.
basically, your dog must listen to you, and when you tell her NOT to do something, tell her what TO do instead. if she assumes a stiff posture or puts up her battle flag (tail straight up) you tell her "no" or "leave it" and then give her something else to do. you're also showing her that you're handling the situation; she doesn't have to.
(these walks also serve to tire her out physically and mentally. give her a meal afterwards, and she'll probably sleep soundly for hours.)

you can also heavily reduce dog aggression with a lot of time and patience.

go to the library and surf around online for dog training books. and i canNOT recommend petsmart trainers. what a waste of time and money.

oh, re: prong/pinch collars. like any other training tool, they can be great if used correctly or terrible if used incorrectly. i'd hesitate to recommend one for a fearful dog, but i can't say what will work for cadella. just make sure you learn the proper way to use whatever training tools you use.

good luck!