[maxkinzie]

Hi,
I know I'm jumping the gun a little timewise, but have been thinking about explaining "stuff" to DD...

Can't make sense of this one...How do I explain to DD that her bfather ditched BMom when he found out she was pregnant? I realize I don't know all the details but my opinion of him isn't real high, I don't think telling DD what a loser I think he was to leave is going to be constructive. How do you tell a kid that their bdad wanted nothing to do with them??????

Ideally I'd like her to understand "him" in a light that would at least allow her to talk to him and make her own decision about him (should he ever enter the picture). Or is there just no excuse for ditching, and don't try to soften it with "there's 2 sides to every story" type stuff?

If all goes as we all intend it to, we will open the adoption with BMom, all parties want her to be a part of DD's life, so hopefully she will at least have that :-)

thanks for any suggestions.
Max

[Linny]

You know, you can tell the 'softer version' of some sort----complete with basic facts----when and IF the first questions come about at a young age.
However, having had two adopted children who are now grown, and having little ones still at home, it's been our experience that when the age permits, complete honesty is the best way. If the story seems 'sad or unsettling'...then that's the way it is.
You could always say, 'I don't know all of the reasons, but this is what we were told'....and this is truth, while telling what you DO know. But, I have no belief in lying to any child about anything...especially when it comes to their biological beginnings.
Keep in mind that just because children might be adopted, in no way makes them immune to nasty circumstances; just as easily as birthchildren might be involved with similar circumstances as well.

Best of luck to you. I personally know that this stuff can be tough to deal with; yet, it must eventually be told with truth.

Sincerely,

Linny

[HBV]

Great topic. I find H's bdad difficult to like, and I struggle to think of positive things to say about him aside from the fact that he did do what was best for H at the time of placement. We see him, and I intend to keep our promise in that regard ---unless I believe H to be in danger, of course.

H is FAR too young for it to be an issue now, but it will be at some point. Certainly it presents an opportunity for teaching H about choices and consequences, but like Max, I sure would love to hear from others who've been through this already.

[NJNative]

I can tell you what I have told my 15 year old about his birthfather. He also left the birthmother high and dry and after my son was born, really had little or nothing to do with him. He was more than happy to sign the papers terminating his rights and left town immediately after.

I told my son that his birthfather was young, not in a committed relationship with the birthmother, was a high school dropout. Because of that he had no education and no job. He was clearly not a person who was in any way, shape or form ready to be a parent. I emphasized that it had nothing to do with him -- he was an infant -- but had more to do with his lack of both resources and a relationship with the birthmother.

On the other hand, I made sure I told him that if he found himself in a similar situation, I would hold him to a higher standard than that. I would expect him to take responsibility for his child. I also reminded him that he had his dad and I to rely on for support and his birthfather did not (he was raised by grandparents who were elderly).

Interestingly enough, my son is somewhat interested in seeking out his birthmother when he's an adult, but told me in no uncertain terms that he was not interested in finding his birthfather. He may change his mind later on, but who knows?

I would be honest, but tactful, when dealing with this sort of thing. Doesn't do the child any good to lie to him, but neither does being too blunt about it.

Good luck!

Robin

[HBV]

Thanks, Robin. I agree with you about the honest tactrul approach, and I really like the part about holding him to a higher standard.

I just cringe when we have to go somewhere w/ bdad. He is HORRIBLE about women in general (though he's polite enough to me) and he spends most of his time telling us about his latest conquest or his latest brush w/ the law, usually with words not used in polite society.

Sometimes I secretly hope that by the time H is old enough to understand anything about it, bdad will have lost interest in the contact, but I don't really want H never knowing about his bdad.
Bdad's extended family is really very nice and I do like them. Sigh...maybe what I should really hope for is that bdad will do some serious growing up while H is doing the same.

[SanInUtah]

Originally Posted by maxkinzie

Hi,

Originally Posted by maxkinzie

I know I'm jumping the gun a little timewise, but have been thinking about explaining "stuff" to DD...

Can't make sense of this one...How do I explain to DD that her bfather ditched BMom when he found out she was pregnant? I realize I don't know all the details but my opinion of him isn't real high, I don't think telling DD what a loser I think he was to leave is going to be constructive. How do you tell a kid that their bdad wanted nothing to do with them??????

Ideally I'd like her to understand "him" in a light that would at least allow her to talk to him and make her own decision about him (should he ever enter the picture). Or is there just no excuse for ditching, and don't try to soften it with "there's 2 sides to every story" type stuff?

If all goes as we all intend it to, we will open the adoption with BMom, all parties want her to be a part of DD's life, so hopefully she will at least have that :-)

thanks for any suggestions.
Max

You condone what you justify. I've never preached this to my son but we've touched on it. Being a man is about restraint and responsibility. He needs to learn it and believe it. I think he gets it now.

Our son knows that his parents where married and his mother wound up living in a car with 7 kids. (His siblings remember this time so there's no hiding it.) He also knows it's because his father was mean to Mom and she had to escape him. When he asks where BF is now I tell him I don't care, we don't want to know him. If he'd acted like a man my son's bio-family would be intact. When you're part of a family respect is one way that you show love. BF has no respect for his kids or his ex-wife. We don't have to respect Bf, or his actions.

That's just my opinion. There's a cross-section of young men out there that think it's their place to spread their superior seed and then disappear when the bills arrive. In L.A., it's not uncommon to hear them bragging about having 4-5 kids, none of whom they know, by 3-4 different women...by age 25. Some even allow their kids to go into foster care or sign their rights away, all the while creating new children. That's not being a man. They aren't fathers. (Can you guys remember the name of the basketball player who's gone on record recently as having around 20 illegitimate kids? He was strutting about it.)

If I want my son to be responsible for his own actions, and his own children someday, then he has to hear it told truthfully. I've also made sure that my DH has had this talk with his little sister. She's 14 and boy crazy. We had to convince her that boys are incabable of a clear thought from ages 13-18. That hormones rule their lives. That they won't 'die' if she holds back. When she acted incredulous my son piped up saying "...you'll have kids you aren't ready for if you do sexing before you're married!". LOL

[blambdin]

I am a birthfather and have never met or had contact with my birthdaughter. The birthmother and I were both 17 years old at the time of adoption. I would hope that the adoptive parents didn't think that I "ditched" my responsibility. I worry that they think that and that they tell their daughter that they "don't care who he is".

I only stepped in on the post to give you a glimpse of the other side. I have thought about my birthdaughter for the last 32 years. Would she have had a good life with me at 17 years old? Maybe not the best, but I would have given it my all. I was young and have changed a lot in the last 33 years, I have grown to become the man that my parents raised me to be. Please be sure that what you are telling your children is open and not spiteful. People change and emotions take over. This young birthfather may have been so scared that he didn't know what to do, he may have thought that this was the best thing to do. He may not have had the support that the birthmother had. No one can say how he will feel in 10, 20, or even 30 years. He is the only one that will be able to tell his side of the story. It would be wonderful if he were given the chance when that time is appropriate. I wouldn't say anything negative, even if it was true. My wife has two children from a previous marriage and we would never say anything negative about their dad. She divorced him, the kids did not. When they get older they can make their own decisions about him.

I hope that this makes sense and that you don't mind a birthfather jumping in.

[maxkinzie]

Appreciate the replies so far!

blambdin...Bingo!! That's what I want to do. Even tho it looks pretty bad from where I sit (bdad late 20's, disappeared as soon as was told of pregnancy) I so don't want to judge what I don't know.- Especially to DD about someone who will always be a part of existence. I was hoping maybe I'd hear from BDad's, hear other sides. so, thank you! I know no one can answer for our BD, but I want to broaden my horizons!

Max

[bromanchik]

Originally Posted by SanInUtah

When he asks where BF is now I tell him I don't care, we don't want to know him. If he'd acted like a man my son's bio-family would be intact. When you're part of a family respect is one way that you show love. BF has no respect for his kids or his ex-wife. We don't have to respect Bf, or his actions. [/i] LOL

No, you do not have to respect him, respect is something definately earned. However, your answers and attitude are sending a message to your son that you consider part of who he is to be worthless. In not "caring", in not wanting to know about him, you are invalidating your son's need to know. Not everything is black and white and even the most dysfunctional people have some redeeming qualities. You need to find those qualities for the sake of your son. Just because you do not care about his birthfather does not mean he does not as well. He would not have asked about him if he did not have some kind of interest.

And bottom line... they do share genetic material. They may share physical characteristics as well as skills and temperament. Helping him find the positive things he shares with his birthfather as well as helping him understand his fathers actions and how they affected his birthfamily, are both important tasks.

[ajjhmf]

Well, what we do is present the facts of the matter without emotion or opinion. Then we talk with our son about how he feels about what we've told him. We look at the situation from different points of view, let J draw his conclusions and then talk about how he feels. I'm also quick to point out that people can and do change. Just because someone made some bad choices at one point in their life, doesn't mean they will continue. It's about grace and forgiveness. Two things I want my son to experience and practice in life.

I personally don't have a very high opinion of J's birth family, but that's just my opinion. Although I am working on forgiving them in my own heart. J was adopted from foster care so there is some bad stuff there. But they are still J's birthfamily and someday he may want them to be a part of his life. I need to respect that.

Blessings,
Jenny

[NJNative]

Originally Posted by blambdin

I am a birthfather and have never met or had contact with my birthdaughter. The birthmother and I were both 17 years old at the time of adoption. I would hope that the adoptive parents didn't think that I "ditched" my responsibility. I worry that they think that and that they tell their daughter that they "don't care who he is".

I only stepped in on the post to give you a glimpse of the other side. I have thought about my birthdaughter for the last 32 years. Would she have had a good life with me at 17 years old? Maybe not the best, but I would have given it my all. I was young and have changed a lot in the last 33 years, I have grown to become the man that my parents raised me to be. Please be sure that what you are telling your children is open and not spiteful. People change and emotions take over. This young birthfather may have been so scared that he didn't know what to do, he may have thought that this was the best thing to do. He may not have had the support that the birthmother had. No one can say how he will feel in 10, 20, or even 30 years. He is the only one that will be able to tell his side of the story. It would be wonderful if he were given the chance when that time is appropriate. I wouldn't say anything negative, even if it was true. My wife has two children from a previous marriage and we would never say anything negative about their dad. She divorced him, the kids did not. When they get older they can make their own decisions about him.

I hope that this makes sense and that you don't mind a birthfather jumping in.

I certainly don't mind a birthfather speaking up. And don't think any of us would say negtive things about birthfathers to our children UNLESS they were true.

But I don't agree with you that we should not say negative things EVEN if they are true. My son is entitled to the truth about his background. Not some fantasy that I make up. I have told him the facts: his birthfather was a high school dropout with no job, possibly had had some problems with the law, left the birthmother during her pregnancy, had little to nothing to do with my son as an infant. I also tempered that with some things for him to think about: his birthfather was very young, had no education, was raised by elderly grandparents, so clearly had dysfunctional family issues and he had no stable relationship with the birthmother.

Not every adoption is the same. If my son's birthfather was someone like you -- just a scared young man -- at the time of his adoption, that's what I would tell him. But clearly his birthfather was someone with great big issues in his life. I don't want him to decide to find him some day without being aware of that. He needs to know that.

[Birth4Mom3]

My DH was always told that his BF walked away when his Bmom found out she was pregnant. That's what SHE told the agency when she placed him.

We found BF a few years ago and it was the farthest thing from the truth.

Sometimes what you think you know - with the information you have - isn't necessarily the truth. What we "know" should always be tempered with a grain of salt until the whole story is revealed.

DH hated BF for years - for no reason at all.

[NJNative]

Originally Posted by Birth4Mom3

My DH was always told that his BF walked away when his Bmom found out she was pregnant. That's what SHE told the agency when she placed him.

We found BF a few years ago and it was the farthest thing from the truth.

Sometimes what you think you know - with the information you have - isn't necessarily the truth. What we "know" should always be tempered with a grain of salt until the whole story is revealed.

DH hated BF for years - for no reason at all.

Yes, well, I can only tell him what I know. But since this information came directly from the birthfather, not from anyone else, I'm pretty sure it's accurate. Our adoption was a private one, not an agency adoption, and the birthfather had the opportunity to complete medical information on himself and his family, etc. What he completed was VERY sketchy in some areas (that's a lot of help to my son -- NOT) but it included the information about his education, lack of job, no contact with my son, etc.

I still say my son is entitled to know what I know -- and I do tell him that it's probably a more complicated story than what we know.

Robin

[ajjhmf]

I complettely agree that we need to share all the informationw e have with our kids... at the appropriate times based on their own understanding, of course. But I just think we need to temper our emotions out of it.

[karaleah]

fwiw, our dd's birthdad is a sex offender, gang member and drug addict and this is what I plan to tell dd about him... I'll eventually give her the full story of what we know when she is much older, but this is sort of the "elementary years" version.

"I don’t know where he’s at or what he’s doing now, but when you were born and while you were a baby, your birthfather was making a lot of irresponsible choices.

He was using drugs, and doing other really bad things. As a result of this, he had to go to jail. When he got out of jail, he kept making bad choices. His life was very unstable and it would have been impossible for him to raise a baby safely. Usually, people use drugs and do illegal things because they’re very hurt and sad inside. I pray for your birthdad, that God will heal his hurts and help him be responsible and make better choices. I hope is able to get off drugs and have a good life. I don’t know if that’s going to happen, but it’s what I pray for."

It's not perfect, but it's the best I can come up with. I don't know any good things about him, so I can't share those with dd. Maybe we can do "I wonder if..." As in "Your birthdad was really tall. I wonder if he liked to play basketball?" I think I'm going to be saying "I wonder if..." and "maybe" a lot when I talk about him.