[echaos]

It's very scary to me that there are still people out there trying to overcome their homosexuality and become straight..... how sad for them to lead such a repressed life.

[NDN]

Originally Posted by wenrl

I just read the Exodus article posted by NDN and again I say huh? 30-50% of all lesbians experience domestic violence and the percentage is even higher for gay men? Am I just niave or living in some sort of utopia? According to these numbers around 1/2 of my friends should be in violent relationships or have some scary stories to tell. And yet they don't. Where do these numbers come from?

I, too, wondered about the source of the statistics. Unfortunately the article does not provide a bibliography for the source(s) of these numbers. I suspect that, as with many variables in life, these destructive behaviors are concentrated in some areas and sparse in others. For example, a disproportionate percentage of my homosexual friends are now, or have been, in abusive relationships. This number is much higher than the 30-50% cited in the article. I am certain that this is not the case across the board, so it becomes and interesting undertaking to try to understand why the concentration is so high in my area of the world. It is something that we may never know.

In any event, the point of posting the article was to show that the arguments for & against the same-sex marriage proposals are not always based on hate or tolerance vs. intolerance. Instead they stem from completely seperate worldviews (sorta the nature v.s nurture debate, if you will). Some people hold the viewpoint that homosexuality is more about behavior than being an innate sense of identity.

It is not a politically correct viewpoint, but one that many hold sacred. I say all this to get to my point. I have heard interviews with the woman that authored the article that started this thread. If I understand her viewpoint correctly, it is her concern that legalizing (and therefore legitimizing) homosexual unions will make the behavior more accceptable to the general population.

She didn't seem to believe that growing up in a homosexual home automatically means that a child will be molested. However, she stated in one of these interviews that "sexual deviance" breeds more deviance. I understood her concern to be that an overall acceptance of homosexuality as equally valid to hererosexuality would open the doors to a "slippery slope" into more destructive behavior--as she claims happened in her family.

As an aside, the author of that article tried for quite some time to appear before the Canadian legislature. She hoped to testify before them about the same-sex marriage debate. However, they repeatedly refused her request. This, she says, is the reason that she began writing about her experiences. I can only presume that she was trying to fuel a public outcry (?).

[dadfor2]

andy,

i agree, it is totally sad that people feel the need to become straight because they hate themselvs so much.

it says so much about how society feels about homosexuality.

ok, now i go on my soap box...

I do believe that all the hate and the uniformed comes from church or how people interpert things.

as for violence in the household that would make someone gay/lesbian is something new to me, i have never heard this before.

my brother and i grew up under the same roof, we were 1 yr apart in age. There was no abuse in our household at all. they would never even spank us.

yes, we went to church every sunday also, but my parents were totally left winged liberals, but raised us with morals and empathy and a sence of God and what spirituailty really meant.

now, to get to my point. when we hit the teenage years, i was the one who got into some problems, my brother who is gay, did not.

i was the black sheep of our family, my brother was not, he was very family oriented.

He was not molested, abused or anything. he was a normal kid with normal issues, it just so happened that he was born gay.

my parents didnt cause it, no one caused it. It is what it is.

I guess thats what i have trouble understanding with what some peoples ideas or beliefs are about homosexuality, when really, their beliefs or ideas has nothing, and i mean nothing, to do with homosexuality.

you are either born gay or straight or bisexual for that matter. not sure why people have such a hard time understanding this simple concept.

nothing caused it.....if something did cause it, then it could be fixed. and i truly believe, that the people who claim they were gay and now straight or fixed, have more issues then their sexuality anyway.

i knew my brother was probably gay when i new what the word meant. He was who he was.

when we were about 17, he came out to me, we discussed the whole thing in detail, then i asked him did he ever want to be straight?

he did say, there was a time that he thought about what it would be like to be straight, and what it would feel like to not worry about what people thought.

even though my parents really didnt care that he was gay, he wasnt so much worried what we, as a family thought, but total strangers.

strangers of all things.....

i thought that was such a sad statement, i couldnt even imagine what that must be like to feel that way.

no one should ever feel less then someone else. we are all the same, period.

and until some of these people get off their high horse and just educate themselves a little, we wouldnt have our g/l teens feeling less then, and trying to hide and having issues around low estemm.....

the cycle of hate continues with letters and websites like that one. And yes, i do get angry when i read this crap, because these people are actually killing our kids....

these are the people that our children also hear, and they start to question about who they are and if its wrong...these are the people that assest our children commiting suicide because of their beliefs that they teach.

ok, im getting off my soap box, but i do get angry, and yes, i do take this stuff personally, because when i read this stuff, it is hurting someone that i truly i love, my brother.

[echaos]

Thanks Dad!!! what a great post!!

[79nic]

Standing up and applauding your post, dad. Awesome, awesome post. It's about time someone said it.

[FostAdoptMoms]

Hi Andy and All -

As a new member and poster, I wanted to say KUDOS for starting threads for Lesbian/Gay foster, foster-adopt, and adoptive parents. My partner and I are seeking to foster-adopt and are in the process of our homestudy. We have two children (my bio from prev. relationship) and are seeking to adopt a sib set of 3. - - Thank you for giving us a place to feel "at home" - -

Now- about this article...
I will avoid the line by line review and just say that I am sorry this woman had such a terrible childhood and would agree it is more related to an abusive home and poor choices by her dad - than anything having to do with a homosexual home. I hate that such articles (or people) are used against the future of our families. As many have said - ours is fairly "regular" and boring - with our lives revolving around kids, dogs, work and bills. - CRAZY isn't it! - There is no gay "agenda" or "lifestyle" - just us seeking the right to be recognized and respected as the loving family we are. (don't get me started...)

I will not be made bitter by the negativity - I'll keep loving my partner, loving my kids, and offering our heart and home to those who may need it. (I can see why the others are so afraid...)

Thanks again Andy! - I'll keep on posting on your other threads in hopes of a more prominate location for Lesbian/Gay forums.

S -

[NDN]

I have thought much about this thread and this womans story since I first heard about it. Since everyone seems to agree that her problems were caused by abuse, I feel comfortable momentarily veering off the original intent of the thread.


The question was asked as to whether it is really possible that people grow up in homes with such abuse...the answer (as many social workers, foster parents, and others on this forums can attest to) is a resounding YES!

While it seems unimaginable to those raised in loving homes, or those who are trying to raise their children in such an environment, some children endure terrible abuse and even torture at the hands of parents.

I would just like to take this opportunity to thank all those out there that try to help the children fortunate enough to escape these abusive homes. I also want to remind everyone how important it is to report abuse. I cannot tell you how many times I have been told by others about children they knew were being sexually or physically abused that told me "it's none of my business" at the suggestion of reporting. Any time a child is being harmed, it is everyones business.

[kelleymac]

I'm deeply troubled by this article as it perpetuates the myth that homosexual parents are more likely to engage in risky sexual practices and perpetuate abuse than straight parents. It's just not so.

Statistics indicate that homosexual men are far less likely to commit violence against children than straight men. And the conduct described in this article is clearly abuse perpetuated through generations, not the result of someone's sexual preference.

I think it's sad that the impression many straight people have of gays and lesbians is so far off the mark. I admit to being guilty of just such ignorance living in the midwest, but I've since had the opportunity to live in San Francisco where I am friends with wonderful gay people. (straight people too, BTW )

This woman still has unresolved issues with her father that stem from much more than his sexual orientation. She needs to deal with those issues and open her eyes to the fact that many, many straight people engage in risky sexual practices and abuse, and that sexual orientation has no bearing on a propensity for either one.

Ugh,
Kelley

[1of2moms]

I truly feel sorry for the author of that article, she had a horrible childhood. I do agree with this statement she made: "children need responsible monogamous parents who have no extramarital sexual partners. Parental promiscuity, abuse and divorce are not good for children."

Thankfully, our fson has found that with us. And if we have nudity going on, it is the fact that our boy loves to wander around naked. I am sure he will eventually be less of a nudist but right now, we don't mind.

[dadfor2]

elizabeth....what is it with kids and nudity..... ....i dont quite undertstand that...

thankfully my boys grew out of it....but i never quite got it....

[Leigh131313]

A canadian chiming in...

Ok..as far as I know, the gay marriage thing went through....There are still a few politicians saying they will stop it, but I'm pretty sure it's a done deal at this point...

My thoughts on this leading to adoption for gay couples..


Ummm....sure, why not??

1- most agencies (all in my province, not sure about others) are OPEN adoption agencies...in other words, the BIRTHMOM picks the family...if she doesnt WANT a gay couple raising her child, she wont pick one. If a birthmom DOES pick a gay couple, well that is HER decision to make. Even without the gay marriage thing, she could of handed her baby to a single gay individual to raise with their partner.....so really, there is NO CHANGE here.. Some agencies may now be required to show their file, that wouldnt before.....big deal!

2- if they go through the gov't.... These children are almost always older/special needs children. The estimated wait for a newborn baby through the gov't is NINE years....so NOBODY (virtually) goes through them for newborn adoptions, it is all private (see above point..lol) Now, these children DESPERATELY need homes....if opening up the possibility for gay couples to adopt helps give these children a family, that is AWESOME!!! We need more people stepping up to the plate here.....Do you HONESTLY think NO family at all is better than two individuals who will love you for the rest of your/their lives?????????

It's so ridiculous.....

Leigh