[michellemartin]

Just for Nicole (hope I make you laugh a bit) twinges twinges twinges twinges twinges
twinges twinges twinges twinges twinges twinges twinges twinges twinges twinges

In case the rest of you think I'm nuts here's the quote first said by Nicole
"(LOL, is the word "twinges" starting to sound funny to anyone else?)"

I think twinges are a totally normal for both sides of the traid. Someone said about babyshowers after the baby came becuase well, you never knew when you'd bring home your child. I never had a babyshower at all. I had to plan my sisters babyshower within weeks of placing. Now that was a twinge filled day. Even though I wasnt going to parent, a little celebration of the life I was bringing into this world would have been nice.

[79nic]

ROFL, Michelle.

Definitely agree. I think there are pain/twinges/whatever all triad members feel. Including, I'm guessing, adoptees. (Thinking of Elizabeth, reading the phone book, and staying up late every night before her birthday.)

How nice it would be if we could support each other in those "twinges."

[Cheryl62]

Agreed Nic!!!!

I think there are twinges all around, even with many adoptees. I didn't feel them as much growing up, honestly, but now that I'm facing head-on the pain in my b-mom's life, and in my Mom's feelings, yeah, these kinds of threads rub some raw spots.

While I honestly don't think that it's what anyone here really means, the twinges I get from these are things like "if a-moms feel they are not "real" enough moms does that mean we're not "real" enough children, or are second best?" "if b-moms are in this much pain, is our existence responsible for that?". I don't really want to think any of that is true - and I usually don't - but somehow I feel in the middle, responsible for "fixing" the pain on both sides, but there's no real way to do that, is there?

Maybe this discomfort at being in the middle, or hearing the more emotional "twinges" of a-parents and b-parents is why not many adoptees post on these threads? But, of course, for every post that makes me feel bad, there's another that really makes me feel good, so I suppose that keeps lurking here and reading! LOL!

Anyway - my vote is for support, education, understanding, and compassion. I think it's hard for all sides, just in different ways.

[Volfe]

Side note: I kinda like the idea of Showers for Bmoms
It could be a celebration of Life not Loss.
Clothes, gift certs, keepsakes, Journals, etc...
And publicized businesses could help erase the Bmom Stigma
Great idea - or not - I still like it.

Choosing Loss and pain does not make a person Less... but stronger. Brave are the bmoms, the IVFers, the adopting couples, the pregnant women. The risks are great, but most of us have heard - you knew the outcome, the risks, etc. How sad.
Just give them a durn hug and compassion (after the loss I mean).

Perhaps we should write Hallmark to create Mom Day cards for all of us: Happy Mothers Day: You will always be the Mother to an Angel.

Hugs everybody
I gotta work and can't debate just wanted to toss in Happy Confetti.

Maia

[Linnie65]

I just wanted to say that as an adoptee, it is not the greatest feeling to know that what your parents REALLY wanted was to have a biological child.

My parents wanted children. Most people try to have a biological one first. That doesn’t make me their “second choice.”

I agree with redheaded that biology and parenting are 2 different things. How many biological parents are lousy unfit parents? Lots. (none here, I’m saying, in general). Just because you give birth does not mean you will be a good parent.

[79nic]

Well...

I'm talking from a totally cerebral place now, emotions have simmered down, so I don't mean this to become a fight or anything.

But I wanted to clarify, LKS..

It seems there is a difference between trying for bio children first and then coming to accept adoption as equally wonderful as bio parenting, and trying for bio kids, "settling" for adoption, and really secretly thinking that your adopted child isn't "good enough" because they were adopted.

I mean, look at Brandy's case.... Her adoptive parents clearly did not resolve some issues, and when they had their bio child, Brandy was ousted from the family's home... (Sorry, hope I'm not overstepping my bounds, Brandy.) That is different from, say, my bdaughter's parents, who tried to have bio kids, tried infertility treatments, did some self-reflection, realized their main goal was to become daily care-taker parents, let go of the pregnancy dream (even though it still "twinges" sometimes), and then adopted.

I think the difference is in how the aparents perceive their adopted children. Trying for bio kids first, and then adopting, doesn't make adoption a lesser choice. But if the aparents feel that their adopted kids aren't as special as bio kids, then that's when it becomes a problem, IMHO.

And biology...

We acknowledged that biology doesn't make a good parent. But it does prime women to parent. That's all. Sadly, you are entirely correct, there are thousands of bio parents who make horrible parents....

[Girlie_Hen]

Giving birth doesn't "make you a good parent," but adopting doesn't "make you a good parent" either.

Love, time, a sense of humour, and nurturing (i'm sure the list could go on) make you a good parent.

That's why I liked Michelle's observation so much: both or either psychology and biology can contribute towards the making of a parent.

[jwmjwm]

That's exactly what I was trying to say in the quote that LKS used.

[tlc4kidz]

Thank you all......I just had a lightbulb moment! I couldn't figure out why this has been eating at me for the past few days. Now I realize it's because I'm coming from a whole other experience having both bio and adoptive children. I love them all and I am more than willing to share the title of "mom" with the woman who gave birth to them......because I've been there as a mom with my bios for 13 years now.

I GET IT!! ......okay, I may be a little slow, but I really had a MAJOR insight that I believe will help me parent all 4 of them from now on. Thank you for this thread and THANK YOU to all you wonderful birthmoms, amoms AND adoptees who have contributed!!!

I can't even really put into words exactly WHAT it was I got, but hopefully someone understands.....I'll stop rambling now

[amyway_j]

I met a lady at church last week from Micronesia. She said that in her country adoption is very common. She said that it is usually among family members or between people that have a lot of kids that are helping their friends who have none. She said that adoption is just a normal part of life over there. What struck me as interesting, was that she said there were many times growing up that she asked her mom why she didn't place her for adoption so that she could have two families that love her.

I think that is the bottom line. I think it is wonderful that there is another woman in this world who loves my dd as much as I do. That gives me a very secure feeling. All my insecurities went away when I met dd's bmom. I think a lot of the fears before birth are just the unknown. Right now we have a semi-open adoption, but I am hoping that as time goes on it will become open.


Amy

[skootinalong2]

Wow!!! I wish I could think of something wise or profound to say. Guess I am once again overwhelmed by all the "words."

[Brat]

I understand, TLC, and I appreciate the respect and compassion. Your words brought me to tears...because you understand why it's so hard for some of us. You realize that while you are an adoptive mom, your feelings may differ from other amoms who come from a place of infertility and loss.

Originally Posted by tlc4kidz

Thank you all......I just had a lightbulb moment! I couldn't figure out why this has been eating at me for the past few days. Now I realize it's because I'm coming from a whole other experience having both bio and adoptive children. I love them all and I am more than willing to share the title of "mom" with the woman who gave birth to them......because I've been there as a mom with my bios for 13 years now.

I GET IT!! ......okay, I may be a little slow, but I really had a MAJOR insight that I believe will help me parent all 4 of them from now on. Thank you for this thread and THANK YOU to all you wonderful birthmoms, amoms AND adoptees who have contributed!!!

I can't even really put into words exactly WHAT it was I got, but hopefully someone understands.....I'll stop rambling now