[Judilyn]

For those of you who know me you know that we adopted our youngest d through the foster care system at age 5. She was 2 (almost 3) when she came to live with us.

We had well meaning, but misinformed friends, relatives and even a caseworker tell us that we would always have challenges with her because she was a foster child and "they" come with a unique set of emotional problems.

Our d has always had a problem with lying. But now those lies are out of control. She also steals, everything from other family members items to food and hides it in her bedroom. She has begun taking her very favorite clothing and hiding in in the attic. These are outfits that she adores. I DON"T GET IT.

We have tried individual counseling, and Big Sister programs. Right now we are in family counseling because of the constant sibling rivalry(another story). We have tried taking privelages away, including her trip to summer camp. We told her that good behavior would earn it back but she does not care.

I don't know what else to do. Someone please tell me that there is hope. PLease tell me that those people were not right and that I won't wind up with an overly defiant pre teen/teen that longs for her bio parents(both deceased) and makes our life miserable.


Oh, one more thing I should tell you. She takes meds for ADHD. But only on school days. She get in the most trouble while at home on weekends. I think it is time to start taking the meds all week long so that she can think before she acts. But, I feel so guilty about it. But if it would help her do better she would feel better about herself. I know that it is not an easy out. There are under lying issues that need to be dealt with here.

And also we have the a decision to cut her bio siblings out of the relationship for a while until we can get her under control. We have noticed a strong link between contact wiht her older bio sister (age 19) and her behavior. It is because her sister questions her about every decision we make concerning our daughter and fills her head with crazy deas like "you can come and visit me in New York this summer". Then we have to say no. We have tried talking to the older sister buts that is like talking to a brick wall.

I'm losing it. Someone through me a lifeline, PLEASE!


Thanks for letting me vent.

[Missy M]

Judilyn...I am so sorry you have this problem to contend with and even sorrier that I don't have a solution to offer. Iposted to say that you don't have to feel guilty about thinking she might need meds daily; LOTS of kids in her situation do. I worked on an Adol. Psych Unit for years and believe me the kids who are in-patient are given meds daily. The only time we'd with-hold meds would be during "blind studies" in which one RN would either give the medication or a placebo and the other shifts would observe and record the behavior in an attempt to see if the medication could be with-held successfully.
I say please talk it over with your Doctor and don't feel guilty about wanting your child to have a "normal" life daily. Best Wishes....MissyM

[love4]

Kids do things for many reasons. We adopted two girls at the age of 11 and 12. One cuts herself and she tells me she is trying to cut the pain out. My youngest has physically attacked us many times. She said she is afraid we will abandon her and that maybe we can't handle her. She was in many placements and each one failed. She figured we would do the same. I let her know through words and actions that we are big enough to handle anything she puts in our way. Kids hide things for fear of losing. Maybe they had to fend for food. Maybe their needs weren't met. Taking away things from my girls never worked because they had so much taken away that they built a "so What" wall. Love has changed her. A different way of parenting but it is working. You can pm me if you like. love4

[beach4me]

Just passing thru and saw your post.

I don't have any words of advice, but I have 2 children (bio) with ADD and ADHD. We do meds 24/7. Taking them off on the weekends made them more emotional and the behavior spun off the chart. It was worse than before they started taking meds! The Dr. explained to me that it does take days (sometimes weeks) for their bodies to adjust to being off the meds. So, taking them off for 2 days and then putting them on is like have them giving them an extra "fall" on the emotional roller coaster. It just isn't necessary.

After being on meds 24/7 for a month, my 11 yr old son expressed that he felt so much calmer....all the time and did not have all the guilt of the bad weekend behavior.

You might want to try it.

Good luck!

[mlbsands]

I am sorry that you are going thru all that.. I also wanted to comment on the meds.. Please do not feel bad about putting her on them 24/7 our foster daughter definately needs them and it would do more harm to her to have the emotional ups and downs with going on and coming off the meds..

Also.. as 1 other poster indicated.. you may want to try to chage some of your techniques.. our previous FD did not care what we took away it would never help her to do better.. she "EXPECTED" us to take things away and was just "justified" in her actions when we did..

Instead these kids need to know sometimes that no matter what they do you will still love them and treat them well.. I know that this may seem the wrong way.; but it actually worked with us..

now we really think before we take anything away and we see if that will really make a difference.. and many times when we have instead let her keep things or still go places we have told her that we love her and we are still letting her do these things.. then we do something like assign some extra chores or something like that...

good luck

[lucyjoy]

There could be lots of things going on here. I had kids chop up clothes they liked because they didn't feel they deserved them. Also, bio sib could be causing loyalty issues about acceptingnice things from you. She wants to keep them, so she hides them.
Stealing is a tough behavior to lose. Make sure she is doing something for restitution. Hold her 100% accountable for her choices. If she hides the clothes, don't replace them or even look for them. If she's stealing and lying-no going to other peoples houses as she might take their stuff(and tell her this with the deapest, loving empathy). If the therapist cannot help you in this area, find one familiar with foster care and adoption that can.
Don't give up yet, it could be a temporary set back that just needs some strong attention.

[Dianna]

when faced with out of control circumstances was get evaluations, diagnosis and then proper services. It helped tremendously. It is not a stigma to take the medications that give one the ability to function well. Sometimes people need meds to be able to learn, grow and be aware of the good things around them.

Read and educate yourself. It is time to do the homework given your daughter's unique set of circumstances and behaviors. How can you best help her have a good life?

This site has lots of good resources and experienced people. Look at the special needs forums, and the experts there. You can do this, you just need the right tools. Best wishes.

[Linny]

While I agree that this child's behaviors might be for many reasons.....I'll just add to the advice that in selecting a therapist (which, I believe I would be seeking at this time).....I think you'd do well to find an attachment therapist.
Many of this child's behaviors sound 'attachment related'.........and finding a good attachment therapist, might help in many ways!
Good luck...and don't give up hope. While I'm a firm believer that 'foster children' usually DO have 'issues'..if adopted as older toddlers or pre-schoolers......she is still young. Given the right help.....she'll be fine.

(And don't feel guilty about the meds, if youre MD thinks it's okay during the weekend....I'd certainly try them, regardless of the day.)

Sincerely,

Linny

[leenab]

Even although you've had your daughter for years, remember the past she came from. We are in the process of adopting our 2 sons from fostercare.

With both of them loss of privildges and things as a form of discipline really hurts them. One son lost his f/a mother because she broke the ASFA law, the other son was neglected for the first 2.5yrs of his life. They are both very young at 3yrs and 4yrs old. But still remember their losses. Taking things away from them doesn't work as discipline. Instead we use positive forms of discipline like letting them earn things with good behavior.

This has worked very well for the boys. They have both had enough loss in their lives and taking away more things just gives them the message that we don't care for them, or don't love them. When reality we love them both so much.

You may want to read an oldershild adoption book and books on positive discipline. Try not to set your daughter up to fail, my husband is working on this with our sons. It's easier said than done.

For your daughter the bond between her and her bio-sister doesn't seem to be a healthy one. If you are able to speak to the bio-sister I would explain to her what's happening with your daughter. Your DD is probably feeling a divided loyalty betweeen the two of you. She may have a lot of concerns that she's not expressing. You may want to put their relationship on hold, or change it to phone contact supervised by you.

It really sounds like a difficult situation with the older sister who has also lost her parents. So she doesn't want to loose her little sister too. I think being 19yrs old and just gaining her independance and not really wanting to be without her little sister may be putting a lot of stress on your DD.
Hope this helps,
LeenaB

[lizr5478]

hi there.. Ok here I go... I just wrote you a LONG response post and here in Illinois where it JUST WON"T STOP RAINING... the power flickered and the computer turned off and I LOST MY WHOLE LOOONG post to you...haha sorry had to get that out

well I am an adoptee and hearing about your d sounds almost like it could have been my a mom talking about me.!!!
I am now 26 yrs old and I am a recovering addict... Let me tell you I did not NOT grow up in a bad household... I barely ever ever saw my parents even drink alcohal... SO I truely believe that where I "came" from that there must have been some 'disfunction" well my POOR mom did NOT know what to do with me... My dad left and got remarried and moved out of state.. and at about 13 or 14 I started ditching school ALL the time... NEVER listened to my mom... she tried to get me and my brother to go to "family therapy" too, and I HATED IT... I walked out several times...I then went to individual therapy which was MUCH better FOR ME, but THEN it turned out my therapist was like telling my mother stuff about our sessions and I HAD MAJOR trust issues... so I STOPPED THAT TOO!!!!

First off let me saw I can remember back to when I STARTED to go the wrong path ... I used to be VERY social and INVOLVED in things... I had 3 dance classes a week.. was real involved in my church youth group and took piano and was in softball...
I QUIT EVERYTHING... I thought I didn't have "time" for any of it..
First off TRY to get your daughter Involved in POSITIVE activities!!! BIG TIME!!!! Find out what she is intrested in AND GET HER INVOLVED!!!! see what kinda people she's hanging out with... I stopped hanging out with all my friends that I had "grown up" hanging out with... cause I was into "other" things.... Its really inportant too to show her CONSEQUENCES!!! You know where I live as a kid you get ARRESTED FOR TRUANCEY when you "cut" school 'so much'. Well for 'repeat offenders' you can get sent to the "juvinille jail" well for what EVER reason I ALWAYS ALWAYS got out of it... wheather it be because m mom hired a lawyer or promised A B or C ... well now looking back... I WISH I had gone to that KIDS JAIL thing.... I am not saying ANYTHING is my moms fault she did what she could...her health was poor so she could not deal too great with my stuff..
but as a kid I KNEW That ... she grounded me... I WALKED OUT THE DOOR.... any kind of 'punishment' NEVER worked on me....
I was HORRIBLE.... and now looking back... like I said it was NOT her fault she TRIED but she couldn't control lme... I got sent to a "theraputic treatment school" where there were kids who LIVED TEHRE who were 'wards of the state' and then kids like me who just went there for school... Basically the schools "goal" was to teach you how to "act" and THEIR WAY of acting...
They would get in your face AND SCREAM AT YOU.... They would RESTRAIN YOU.... It was really bad... and I feel that places llike that only Mess a kid up more, I just learned more MESSED up things from the other MESSED UP kids that were there.... I didn't LEARN anything education wise....
I got sent on a trip called "upward bound" which in my school district was like the 'national program' OUTward bound... THAT program did more than anything for me... I TOTALLY suggest stuff like that... It helped me to see what AWSOME things I was capable of and how far I could push myself IN A POSITIVE way... there was NO "I CAN"T DO IT" or "I WON"T DO IT" those are foreign things to that group....

I know I have rambled but I just wanted to share a bit about ME to maybe let you know what NOT to do.... You know NOW a days... people are SOOO quick to throw out 'psyc-diagnosis's' and all this crap, when In actualaity, Its usually just a kid that has SOMETHING inside of them that like needs to Come out and its either gona come out thru NEGATIVITY or POSITIVITY.... try your best to see where shes coming from, who she hangs out with!!!! what her GOALS are.... what her LIKES are.. get her INTO POSITIVE ACTIVITIES!!!!! maybe send her instead of her regular summer camp look around for programs like OUTWARD BOUND that help kids like your daughter find out WHAT they are capable of... and SOMETIMES... being out 'in the middle of NOWHERE the middle of "NATURE" really helps a teen, to see what ELSE is out there... IT DEFINATELY helps the MIND and Can clear a mind a bit.... but there are groups and things that focus on bringing things out of people in positive manners, BEFORE THEY BECOME TIME BOMBS LIKE I DID... OR TURN TO DRUGS LIKE I DID... I think for whatever reason, as an adoptee,,, I felt like i was always trying to "fit in" somewhere... ecspecially once I got into the "hormonal" age.... I resented the WORLD for me not having my "real parents" and its not because I didn't LOVE my adoptive parents...

well Geez... I am sorry, I will SHUT UP NOW.... sooo sorry to ramble... My heart just Truely goes out to YOU and your daughter.. And I am just Really probably OVERLY compassionate about stories like yours cause I Don't wish the path I took on ANY other little girl, and I don't wish the hell I put my mom thru ON ANY other MOM!!!!
please Keep me posted!!!! What State do you live in??? and what kinds of 'programs' do they have for girls like her????
take care!
truely caring,
beth

[Judilyn]

I appreciate your responses and PM so much. I spent a lot of time this weekend researching RAD and I think you are right, that is what we could be dealing with.

Tu. I am calling a therapist that works wiht RAD kids. It will be a 1 hour drive for me one way but well worth it. I feel so bad for her. I wish I knew what to do to unlock all the hurt locked into her tiny soul.

I know at times I get so frustrated because she just will not follow the simplest of rules. And nothing we do seems to work.

Boy, I hate to admit it but this is the place to get support from other a moms. There have been times when I've regretted the adoption. Not her, just the commitment. HAVE ANY OF YOU EVER FELT THIS DESPERATE? But I am her true mom, I'm in it through thick and thin. I'm in it for the long haul.

I love her and with God's help I will see her through. I can do all things through Christ.

[lucyjoy]

Most definetly I have felt that desperate and I have a kid now that seems to find buttons to push that I didn't know were there.
Glad you've located a therapist to help you. There are lots of parents here who have been or are where you are at now so talk away.