[debsdone]

I actually think everyone is making sense. I agree about emotions and behaviors. I also agree about foster homes, and what foster parents have to deal with. This discussion, a spin off of another, was sparked by the words "I don't like this child" by a foster parent, right? Sure it seems unrealistic to assume there will be unconditional love for every foster child. To me, the fact that these words were spoken (written) changed ALL the dynamics. Words are powerful things. Emotions expressed tend to be different than those that remain unexpressed. (all this is just my opinion) Once something has been said...it remains out there. So if a job is to care for children, teaching, child care, or fostering, isn't it a bit reckless to express that emotion in a public forum? Doesn't that lend some additional weight to the words? I think it is good to acknowledge our feelings......but something like that is something that should be securely locked away until the child in question is gone from your care. I believe it would be impossible to be as "loving" in action as desired, once those words were spoken. Debi

[Brat]

I'm not a foster parent. I work with abused and neglected children through my occupation. Some of these are foster kids, but most live within their biological homes.

What Dianna described is consistent both with my experience with professionals in the foster system, and with a county orientation I attended as my husband and I looked into fostering and adoption options.

What Happy Mom Anna described is consistent with the behavior of some of the foster kids I know. The majority of these kids are in a group home that my organization partners with. These are kids who have had multiple home placements, and the group home is their last stop. They are some of the most heart-breakingly violent, unstable children in our program. I don't know what came first for some: did their anti-social behavioral problems cause them to be moved from home to home, or were they moved from home to home which resulted in their anti-social behavior? I suspect the latter in the majority of cases.

Basically, while we do not like our group home kids' behavior at times, we love them. Sometimes that's played out in emotions, sometimes actions--I am not clear from anything I've read in this thread that you can cleanly separate those out. The point is, they know through our *commitment,* by the sheer fact that we celebrate their victories and we don't give up on them when they fail like everyone else has, the true definition of love.

While I find this thread interesting, I find Happy Mom Anna's post humbling. Precisely because I know exactly how our agency's kids (and not just the foster ones) typically are, I am a gutless wonder, and I am seeking to adopt an infant who I hope won't have oppositional defiant disorder, reactive attachment disorder, and all of the other labels I see played out in the lives of kids in our program. If s/he does have those issues, we'll deal with them but unlike Anna, I'm not continually putting myself in a position where that will likely be the case.

I'm guessing that the reason why Happy Mom Anna asked if she was welcome on this thread is because she wondered if she would be judged for expressing her thoughts on this topic. I have not been watching the forum closely enough to see what instances make her feel so tentative, but I welcome her thoughts and hope that she continues to educate us on this topic. I'm amazed and inspired. I have no room to judge anyone who's not only fostering, but adopting troubled youth--hanging in there and showing kids the deepest measure of love: unconditional commitment.

[Brat]

Debi...

I agree with you about the power of words. There's a teen in our program--who just happens to be one of the foster kids--who had pushed his two main caregivers to the end of their rope. He was just not responding, and seemed to be getting worse. They were starting to generate some bad press about this kid. I'm their supervisor, and while only viewing their interactions with him peripherally, I knew how much they cared for him and were really just frustrated. I'd had a deep conversation with this kid previously, so I knew his story, and it's a devastating one. I strongly encouraged them to hang in there with him, and we came up with some ideas to further engage him. As a result, he's doing things that are completely amazing, and expressing his hurt through the arts.

While I think the bad press they were generating was defeating, and I would have been so frustrated and angry if it got back to him, I'm nevertheless glad that they got it off their chest, thankfully, privately. If they hadn't, we wouldn't have been able to work it all out together. I came into the conversation without all the stress and emotion they had endured, and because I was removed on some level, was able to help them to make sense of it all. So, I kind of think that it was helpful for that woman in the original thread to just speak out her reality. I'm hoping we all helped her through, and she actually said as much. After all, while these are public forums, I haven't a clue who she is--she could live in Australia or even be a man reallllly going undercover to remain anonymous. I'd rather her get it all out here than to people who might actually bring this up to her child later--like a grandmother or an aunt. None of us will certainly tell him!

By the way, I think she adopted him, or is in the process, but I'm not absolutely sure.... I believe the issue was whether she should disrupt the adoption, not send him to another foster home. But again, I could be off....

[HappyMomAnna]

To me a thought does not have much power unless it is spoken. When it is put into words it is confirmed--and floats out there in the air-----I think in the back of my mind that I feel something but, the moment I tell someone the feeling becomes real--and stronger and shows more.......
Once years ago I baby-sat a little boy who I decided I didn't like much.......... I owed it to the child, his mother and to myself to not baby-sit him anymore. It was simply not fair to anyone in the situation.....no matter how I attempted to overcome my feelings there was no way I could conceive that the child would be treated equal or fair when I had this attitude toward him.... He simply would never be able to win me over and when it came down to my treatment of this little boy there was no abuse, no ignoring, no deprival---nothing horrible---but, certainly less compassion, less concern, less fun--and cuddling, less play, less regard for him needs.....even if he had a clean diaper, lunch and a bottle---my touch was not of love, my talk was not sweet and dear, my want to give him a nice day not there. He didn't do anything wrong--he didn't drive me crazy--he was actually a good kid. But, the sound of his cry after nap, was a painful hit between my eyes, his wish to play or be read too, a chore for me to give-----it was wrong for me to continue to allow him to spend all day with me.....away from some place where he would be treated like the little boy he needed to be treated like.....

It is not possible for everyone to always love everyone we meet. It is OK to think in the back of our mind one feeling but, the moment we feel free to express that feeling is the time we need to make a choice....... Words make feelings real---Words have power if even only for ourselves.

My daughter was not 'liked' by her Foster mother. This woman had a list of things for me when she came to my home. Evidence that she was a problem. We dealt with so many behaviors at first. We read more into things then were actually true.

I will NEVER forget the Good-bye party at the Foster Home. There were 8-children in the house---and at least another 15 for the party---all ages. Our daughter had not eaten enough of her dinner to be given the 'right' for ice cream and the foster mother to be honest was a complete Bi*ch about it.......at her own going away party the Foster mother insisted she would not be given ice cream---but, the baby could have some and everyone else in the house could have some---except MaKaylah who had not eaten enough peas. This Foster mother didn't ask the parents of all the visiting children if they had eaten all their peas.....she didn't care...... and when I said something to her about the fact this was MaKaylahs party---she snapped at me and told me I better start right now being in control or she would walk all over me-----On a normal night I would not give dessert to a child who didn't eat dinner---but, at a party in her HONOR it really would not matter....

At home I heard stories--which of course I had to give the proper caution about inflated stories from our daughter---but, the more I heard these stories the more I decided they had some truth to them.......

Our daughter also came with a police report in her files. At a grocery store someone had witnessed a woman hit and bite a little girl in the parking lot.....the witness thought it was bad enough to call the police---report the license plate and report abuse.......the police investigated....questioned my Daughter who told them she liked her home and everyone was nice there.....
.........a few months after our daughter came home we passed a police car on the street and my little girl told me how the police were the bad guys---they take kids away and they are not nice to kids.....My heart knows the foster mother did indeed treat her roughly that day in the parking lot where someone saw it.....my daughter didn't tell the truth to the police when they came to help her........why would she? The police are bad guys.

There are other stories.....like the day my four year old was told to ware a diaper and drink a bottle for her nap---because she acted like a baby.

I also will never forget when I shared the State made Lifebook with the Foster Family and the mother saw that State had taken picture of my daughter holding the pet cat....the Foster mother flipped her lid and said, "I had no idea the let her touch my cat---Makaylah is not allowed to touch my cat--I can't believe they let her." She was really pissed about it---and I could only wonder why?

This woman actually said right in front of our children that, "We really wanted to adopt the baby, but we had to take her too....she has too many problems for us."

If a Foster mother does not believe disliking one of her children does not impact that child she is lying to herself. It does not take abuse outright to harm a child inside---just the subtle actions, the harshness directed toward one and the attitude can damage a child in more ways then you might imagine....

Like our daughter even when there was an intercession--her life experience was to defend the treatment of her Foster Mother---our daughter had been taken away from a mother who had abused her very much--- taken by the police---I am sure that 7-months later when they came to the Foster Home my daughter would have done anything to avoid that again.....

When a child has experienced abuse or neglect they are used to it---the react as a victim of it...... There is not much an outsider to the situation can do to uncover the truth. If a child fears the police more then the abuser then there is no way they will hear the whole story......Everytime the caseworker comes for a visit---my daughter asks me what she should say to him---and how she needs to be? When the caseworker is here my daughter tends to put on a show.....these behaviors have been taught to her......During the first few months of transition everytime she got in trouble one of her first questions was, "are you going to tell the caseworker about this---is the caseworker going to take me away?"

I know this did not come from me---I don't know where it comes from? Today is our last visit with the caseworker before we finalize and my daughter is very HAPPY she can tell us that she is very glad the caseworkers are going away forever! The records don't indicate a caseworker has ever said or done a thing to give my daughter this feeling. Some of it I am sure comes from her experiences with her birthmother---but, I believe much of it comes from the fact the Foster mother threatened. In my mind I can hear the Foster mother say, 'EAT your peas or I am going to tell your caseworker."

I don't believe every foster parent who finds themselves caring for a child they 'don't like' would act this way or treat the child badly---but, I do believe it is possible to 'get away with' less then the best treatment. These kids words are discounted. There are so many things we can blame for certain behaviors....and once the adoption is final I do intend to let the state know how I really feel especially about that police report in her file......I do believe the foster mother treated my daughter abusively that day in the parking lot....and other days as well.....

Thank God some of her issues have been worked though here with us....Thank God we got her out of that HOME. And the only thing I wish was that the police would not have believed the words of a scared four-year old who had already been removed by them......someone should have given weight to her whole life experience....and at the good-bye party my daughter ate all the ice cream I was given and we have framed the picture of her holding the foster mothers cat and put it on the wall.

[Cleopatrick]

My "credentials" first, lol. Hubby and I have been foster parents for seven years. I'm also very opinionated on this subject and am probably not going to make any friends with my post.

I agree wholeheartedly with Sharon's post. No child should be in a home where they are not liked. It's not fair to the CHILD. Older child adoption is not like infant adoption. These are kids that have their own personalities already set in stone, they are not moldable like an infant is. They have a whole history that we may think we know all about, but those are words on paper, not the feelings, fears, and confusion that the child feels. They are scarred, scared, and have conflicting emotions that no child should ever have to know so young. They have adult worries with a child's brain to worry over them.

When a child comes to our home we do not love them. How can we? We don't know them. I don't love every adult I come into contact with and I certainly can't love every child I come into contact with. You do need to at least be able to like them though. Like grows into love. Dislike grows into hate. I did not love my husband when we started dated but I did like him enough to continue until I did love him. If we can't form some kind of an attach or a bond to a child in two months we will have them moved to another placement. Of the three times I've done this, two worked into beautiful placements where everyone was happy. One was moved one more time and then it worked out. It has nothing to do with behavior. I've been able to form a bond with some kids who are non-stop problems, and haven't been able to form a bond with really well behaved kids, and vise-versa.

I don't believe in fake it till you feel it because you are causing irrevocable damage to kids. They KNOW. They are not stupid and no matter how good of an actress you think you are, they KNOW. Both of my girls were moved from other foster homes that couldn't bond to them. We bonded to them with no problems. We've moved three kids we couldn't bond to, they found the bonds they needed. They DESERVE to have those bonds and to be liked and loved for exactly who they are! I do not always like my children's behavior, but I always like my children. And I would never acopt one that I didn't have both the verb and noun love for!

The sad reality though is, too many foster parents will keep the kids they are not bonded to for one reason or another. The sadder reality is that there are abusive foster homes out there that really couldn't care less if the child is bonded or not.

Last thing, I saw where someone posted that it's easier to get licenced for foster care then to adopt. I don't know about other states, but in ours that isn't true. We had the exact same homestudy done for our license as we did for our adoptions. The only difference was the words "Adoptive Homestudy" at the top of one and "Fostercare Homestudy" at the top of the other. I think it's sad if other states don't investigate their foster parents like they do their adoptive parents.

[crick]

I agree with a lot being said here, especially the not giving up and showing love through actions as much as emotion. Just have to just share my experience. It's a long one, so bear with me.

We adopted 4 kids from foster care last year. The initial bonding was quick and I felt a lot of love for all of them right away. However, after a few months, when their true personalities came out, I realized I was having a hard time continuing to bond, like, and yes even love one of my kids. Not that he was a horror story etc., but just because our personalities clashed. I wasn't prepared to deal with such a clingy kid that whined ALL the time. Drove me nuts and after awhile it made me cringe sometimes because it seemed like no matter how much attention I gave this child, it wasn't enough and needed a lot more affection than I felt I could give. It sounds awful of me, doesn't it? All this kid wanted was a whole bunch of love, but for me, the constant need on his part to hold my hand or sit in my lap, play with my hair, and be by my side constantly ended up irritating me because I felt like I couldn't even breathe sometimes. I'm all for displaying affection, but not 24-7, it just wore me down.

I talked to my caseworker about it because I felt so guilty especially since I was feeling like I didn't like or love my own child. She gave me the best advice I ever got. "Sometimes the one you like/love the least is the one you have to work the hardest with and the one who needs you the most" It just woke me up, making me realize how selfish I was being, and from that day on I worked twice as hard to bond with him. Did special things with him alone, had "mommy & me" outings, and spent a 1/2 hour before bedtime reading a story and just talking with just him and me. And wouldn't you know it, after a couple of months of doing this, getting to know each other better, we developed a special bond. So while I was showing love, I still didn't "feel" that I loved him as much as his siblings but then discovered when a neighbor yelled at him for riding his bike too fast, it brought out all the mother bear feelings and I marched up to that guy's house to give him a piece of my mind. It was then that I realized how much I truly loved my son and nobody was going to messwith my kid. It took 8 months after placement to realize that I really do love him, but I wasn't about to give up on him or even myself.

Yes, he still gets on my nerves sometimes, but everyone does at some point. I get on his nerves too, I'm sure!

Crick

[Brat]

Real quick 'cause I actually do gotta run...

Crick, Anna and Cleo...beautiful posts. My gosh, this is like being in college again. I learn so much.

Cleo, in California, the foster care homestudy is *much* more extensive, and I agree with you that it should be!

[Dianna]

I am totally behind the power of words, the power of action and the effort involved in changing your thoughts. I went to work on my negative thinking many years ago and consciously redireted the thoughts I chose to allow in my mind. I remember reading that you need to stand guard at the door to your mind. It worked well, it just takes a lot of effort. The same can be said for action. Words spoken are action. Everyone has feelings but how we choose to act and what we choose to say are a matter of will.

That said, I do believe that feelings are an important intuitive tool. How we feel is not simply a matter of what we are thinking. Sometimes it is a message from our unconscious.