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  #16  
Old 01-22-2013, 06:09 PM
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controllnmychaos controllnmychaos is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAHmom
I have no advice, but wanted to offer prayers. Is it possible for the father to get in touch with the SW that did the adoptions to see if she can help?


Aren't foster-adopted children supposed to be looked in on every once in a while? If it has only been seven months since the adoption, I would think it would be prudent to get CPS involved before they find out on their own. I find it extremely sad that it got to this point with all the safeguards and oversight in place.

If this was a bio, and the young children were living in a dangerous environment, with a mother who walked out on them, I find it hard to believe that there would be this much sympathy. I wouldn't doubt if this case leads to an entire department to change their policies, and maybe they should.
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  #17  
Old 01-22-2013, 06:14 PM
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control, once the adoption is finalized, if you've had the kids at least 6 months, the cws are out. the kids are yours. the only time you see cws is when you're waiting for finalization or if you were a straight adopt home for that 6 month period.
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  #18  
Old 01-22-2013, 06:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by controllnmychaos
Aren't foster-adopted children supposed to be looked in on every once in a while?

Not here. Once the adoption is finalized, the child's parents have never done anything to require CPS involvement or oversight.

Now, if the parents want involvement, some circuits do offer services (such as counseling) to adoptive families.
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  #19  
Old 01-22-2013, 07:49 PM
preacherjt preacherjt is offline
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Originally Posted by Lorraine123

Do not blame the parents. In my book, the dad is not noble for doing this. He chose disordered children over his spouse. His wife had to be a loving mother or she would not have gone through what she did. Very sad, but that seems to happen a lot with marriages of RAD parents. These children are such great manipulators and triangulators. You think you have a strong marriage - don't be sure. I read somewhere that 80% of all marriages where the couple adopted an older RAD child fails.

This dad needs to determine who can be saved and focus on that. He can't save them all.

I agree, we should never underestimate the things that RAD behavior is going to bring out of a person. It should also be noted that sometimes kids are just good enough that they know how to do what they need to do to make it all the way to adoption. You may think you know what's up and what it's going to take to help the kids, and then BAM! It crumbles in a hurry.

It isn't even just finding out how strong, or weak, your marriage really is. You will quickly find out a lot about how strong/weak you yourself really are, and your spouse will discover that as well. Needs you never even knew you had will suddenly start screaming from within you when your incredibly difficult children keep your own needs from being met.

I know very well how this whole situation would have come to be for this father, and how it would have ended the way it did. He is trying to do right by the kids, and make this world a better place. She agreed that it would be a good thing to do, and even when they disagreed everyday about how to take care of the first three, they still agreed that they could/should help three more. All he needed to do was catch his wife at a moment when things were going well, even if it was only for a day. She probably had lots of reservations along the way, but didn't know how to express them, or didn't think they mattered, or didn't think he would understand, or didn't want to get in the way of helping needy children.

There is a lot of risk in this thing we all do. Marriages will be tested, and sometimes not until after adoption is finalized. Many do seem to find out that they have to choose between a spouse who can't take it anymore, and the children who still need a stable parent. The decision is really not all that easy if you really think about it.

Yeah, I understand this father. I don't think he should be seeking a path out of the adoptions, at least definitely not yet. He needs professional assistance. He needed it long before his wife left, to be certain. He either didn't see it, or was too stubborn to admit to it. I hope he does find what he needs. I hope the kids do, too.
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  #20  
Old 01-22-2013, 08:06 PM
TemporaryMom TemporaryMom is offline
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I don't think it would be too difficult to find a new home for those younger children. BUT, it seems to me that maybe the displacement should be with the 13yo in question. If all other children can manage through with dad and therapy, why disrupt the littles for the 13yo. Not saying to get rid of the 13yo, but, imho, *this* is exactly what CPS should be helping with. Dad can do a voluntary placement of the child with CPS, which will open a case, and then hopefully get the child into RTC through CPS funding.

This is one of the biggest reasons I advocate that ALL children adopted from foster care should get MEDICAL period, until they are at least 18. Not to say all medicaid is equal, I understand it varies from state-to-state.

Also, if dad contacts SW, they may be able to help arrange respite for the littles until something can happen with the 13yo. Here, they offer respite for bio families, so why not for adoptive families.

I'd not be so quick to blame these parents. Children with intense RAD are master manipulators. The child may have waited to show his/her true colors after AFTER they adopted the littles. And, sorry, but managing 3 littles alone is a LOT, but then add on one or two teens, let alone teens with RAD.

I'd not be so quick to rule out mom either. It is one thing to leave and try to escape older kids, but the younger ones, she is likely really bonded too. She may just need TIME. Perhaps she can then take the 3 littles and dad keep the 3 older kids with of course visitation and such. Maybe that can give the other child the time they need. I don't think it was mentioned how long the older children have been with the family or adopted.

Please pass along our prayers to this poor father. I can only imagine the stress and pain he is in.
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  #21  
Old 01-22-2013, 09:58 PM
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Thanks for all the input...actually a lot more than I expected. I did talk with Dad today & the older kids are 13, 11, and 9. The 13 year old is full blown RAD, sneaking out of the house to meet with boys, lying, stealing, the works. The 9 year old is the one who tried to burn the house down intentionally--put a roll of paper towels in the oven and left it turned on high, luckily there was nothing but smoke SAID he wanted to kill his parents by doing it, and STILL is not considered a risk to himself or others because he didn't actually manage to do it successfully, this time. The 11 year old is seriously depressed bordering on suicide watch--he MAY be able to get into the state hospital if he actually tries to kill himself! This man is basically watching his entire family fall apart. I don't know what mistakes he/she/they made in the past and if they should've, could've, would've done it differently, but nobody deserves this.

After a full day of calling around I have determined that there is NOTHING helpful out there that is easily accessible until you pull out the pocketbook--and we're talking a pocketbook with several zeros at the end. Period. End of story. No easily accessible post adoption services, if the adoption is already finalized and they were not written in the subsidy agreement. DCFS gave me a total brush-off. In their county no trained respite care, even PAID respite care! Only a crisis nursery that will take children short term for appointments and such. The only specific program for children with severe behavioral issues only provides services for children under age 5. Since the younger children are not the one with issues that is out. Nothing accessible through the district, that I could find. I can totally see WHY this dad feels like he is out of options.

At least in this county we have a respite program specifically focused on providing care for families who adopted out of foster care and a crisis nursery that can take children for up to two weeks as needed. And no, I can't get them into the program since they are not in the county!!!

So I think I've done pretty much all I can do, for now. Short of volunteering to take the little ones myself, and don't think it hasn't crossed my mind! Not at all possible where I am at in my life right now, unfortunately.

I did pass on the info for CHASSK. At least that's something for him to look at if he does decide to go with a disruption. I would love to see that avoided, but really have no idea where else he can turn!
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  #22  
Old 01-22-2013, 10:14 PM
TemporaryMom TemporaryMom is offline
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Oh my! That is so heartbreaking. I just don't get it. I guess I won't complain about my state. As bad as it is, we do have PASSS for post adoption assistance. Is he a member of a church or anything? Maybe he could get some assistance that way?

We'll pay thousands upon thousands of dollars to give "services" to bio parents who refuse to admit what most of us know, they not only are incapable of raising children, but do NOT want to, yet we can't pay to assist a father who has adopted some of these child. We can't afford to pay to help the kids?! It is infuriating.

HRISME, has he tried to contact your states NACAC rep? When i contacted mine for Chubbs' AA negotiation, he was working with a family to try and renegotiate subsidy. Maybe they can help?

NACAC | Adoption Subsidy
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  #23  
Old 01-22-2013, 11:03 PM
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I agree with contacting NACAC as they are always helpful. Is there a Foster and Adoptive Parent support group in his area? Perhaps he could contact his local state representative for assistance to see if they have any ideas? Has he looked into what the local Mental Health Center might offer in services?

This is from the NACAC website which list what is offered in Utah {sorry if you have already seen this}.
NACAC | Adoption Subsidy.
The above page lists who your NACAC representative in that might be able to assist him.

My prayers are with him as he tries to make a decision that will affect each of the members in his family...
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  #24  
Old 01-23-2013, 08:32 PM
hrisme hrisme is offline
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THANK YOU for posting the link to NACAC. Through them I was able to locate a respite program that provides care for a minimal co-pay. If nothing else at least this will give him some time to focus on himself or a couple of the kids at a time. Hopefully that will help!
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  #25  
Old 01-24-2013, 03:37 AM
TemporaryMom TemporaryMom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hrisme
THANK YOU for posting the link to NACAC. Through them I was able to locate a respite program that provides care for a minimal co-pay. If nothing else at least this will give him some time to focus on himself or a couple of the kids at a time. Hopefully that will help!
Oh that is good news. I hope things work out for this papa and his children.
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Children:
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Current Placement:
Mr. Blue Eyes - 8 months older than AS - goal: Adoption By Me!/Concurrent Reunification/Family Custody - Who the H knows????

Former Placements:
Princess and her sis Monkey - 2 years
Respite: Big Sis and Lil Sis - 10 days
****************************************************************************************
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  #26  
Old 01-24-2013, 08:51 AM
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controllnmychaos controllnmychaos is offline
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Please believe me when I say I am really not trying to be difficult. I am just trying to wrap my head around this and it's not working. How is this situation not a total failure for these younger children?

I sincerely believe every word you all are saying about RAD. If a family is knowingly dealing with sexual abuse, physical abuse, or addiction and then decides to have their fifth or sixth child, how is that not wrong? Big difference is that most of the bios we run across get pregnant in three minutes. Adoptions take time. Questions are asked. I find it highly improbable that they were not aware all three of the older children had major issues. Or that the marriage had issues. Say they just wanted to help a kid in need. I see episodes of Animal Cops all the time where hoarders actually believe they are doing the animals a favor, when clearly they have just made the animal's lives worse.

What about the six year old that was privately adopted? Do you really think the bioparents that signed their child over thought that child would be dealing with a dangerous living situation and a mother that walked out on them? What is killing me about this is that it has been less than a year since the last adoptions. Does anyone believe this came out of the blue? These children are paying the price for decisions adults have made.

If you see a mother on the side of the road beating her child, do you stop and give her a business card for anger management, or offer to babysit so she can have a break? Or do you call the cops? These children's lives are undeniably at risk as well as their physical and mental well-being, with one man trying to handle six of them alone. Bad things are already happening. If that is not worth a hot-line call or CPS investigation, I don't know what is.
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  #27  
Old 01-24-2013, 09:48 AM
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Also there are RTCs in other states (like mine) who run privately off of donations and accept out of state placements. Im not sure what state youre in, but if you want info to a few goods ones just let me know and i will pm you.
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  #28  
Old 01-24-2013, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by controllnmychaos
I find it highly improbable that they were not aware all three of the older children had major issues. Or that the marriage had issues.

My DH and I never had much conflict in our marriage before kids. I wouldn't say we have a lot now, but it's sure a lot more now than we ever have. But we work through it. We had no clue how our marriage would be impacted because we had never experienced the added stressors to our marriage. Something good can certainly go bad, and it can go bad quickly. We went from managing some challenging behaviors one month with our fs, to being told he needs in patient psych stay just 2 months later. We never dreamed what happened would happen and how it would affect all of our lives and our marriage.
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  #29  
Old 01-24-2013, 10:50 PM
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Originally Posted by just-breathe
My DH and I never had much conflict in our marriage before kids. I wouldn't say we have a lot now, but it's sure a lot more now than we ever have. But we work through it. We had no clue how our marriage would be impacted because we had never experienced the added stressors to our marriage. Something good can certainly go bad, and it can go bad quickly. We went from managing some challenging behaviors one month with our fs, to being told he needs in patient psych stay just 2 months later. We never dreamed what happened would happen and how it would affect all of our lives and our marriage.

I am sorry you went through a tough time. But you didn't abandon your children. Crack can turn a good person into an addict overnight. But it is not an excuse to let children live in peril.

To this day foster parents have a bad wrap in our society. Just look at how they are portrayed in major movies. All because of the few bad ones. That little Russian boy put international adoption on everyone's lips. In a bad way. Nobody blames the child, just the adults. I'm not saying it is right. But that's how it is.

One thing I do agree on, it probably would be best for the younger ones to get into a stable home as soon as possible, before any more mental damage is done. Or one of them ends up seriously injured or killed.
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  #30  
Old 01-24-2013, 11:11 PM
RhondaBear RhondaBear is offline
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If local resources are scarce, would it be possible for him to move his family to an area where they are more accessible? Maybe he could call the people who helped find respite care and see if they could recommend a location that would have the resources his children need.
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