[lovingheart]

Bio called on Halloween night stating she was having hard day as it would have meant a lot for her to have taken little guy Trick or Treating (by the way had never asked so we never thought about it and we have not heard from them in over a month). I wanted to say that Halloween, B-day, Thanksgiving and Christmas are something she is not going to get back if they cannot start working the case plan because the State is not going to just give him back unless they show change. However, I did not say this. I was very proud of myself for having restraint especially after a day of running around showing off costumes to relatives then trick or treating, then having a house full of guests. So out of curiosity what would you have said? I kind of skirted the issue by telling her to call tonight instead because we had a house full of people and I could not get him to come to the phone.

[chloroxsis]

Hmmmm. I think I would have said that we need to pre-plan visits. I would like to keep the workers up-to-date on visit plans. I'll take many pictures so she could see him in costume, but unfortunately, it's too late to arrange something tonight.

[stevenstwin]

Am I correct that she wasn't actually ASKING to take him trick or treating, but just saying how sad she was that she couldn't? I guess it would depend on my relationship with her. If I felt I could be HONEST I think I'd say exactly what you were thinking. However, if I thought that would only make the situation blow up, I'd probably just say something really non-commital like "yet, it must be tough". Certainly, she NEEDS to know that it is her own actions causing this, but some just aren't able to hear it.

[shavon]

I guess my response would have depended on where the case is..

If it was strictly foster, I probably would have told her she needed to make some kind of arrangements witht he caseworker.. As it is not up to us when the kids have visits...

If the child was already adopted by us I probably would have sympathized with her but not have commited to any thing..

tough spot for you..I think you handled it just fine

[Ashley-n-D]

No matter how mad it would have made her id have stated the honest truth "if you had bothered to call or visit your kid this month you probably could have tagged along with us. And if you don't follow your plan soon you may never get the chance again." that's just me. I'm kinda cold like that when it comes to parents that just do try but want perks. Had a similar prob the other day D's dad called wanting visits right around D's bday I attempted to set one up got the machine and haven't got a call back yet suprise suprise it is not a special day anymore so his concience is gone

[breakspencils]

i can't imagine a bio calling my home. our bio mom didn't get to take them trick or treating, won't get them at thanksgiving or christmas, probably. however, they had a visit yesterday morning and I DID send them in costume. but she didn't bring a camera even though I told her I would do this for the visit, so now she still expects me to send pictures to her.

[athikers]

I would have brought the child to her house to trick-or-treat... for five minutes so she could see them. Or in a foster situation, I would have asked a caseworker to bring them, or something.

In fact, that's just what I did with my daughter.

I always try to think of it from their view. Holidays are special, despite the fact that they screwed up, they miss their kids even more on holidays.

[GoddessDanu]

I would have told her that I was sorry she was feeling sad but that if she stuck to the case plan she might have next Halloween with them.

[arbuckle17]

I would have told sorry but we had already made plans centering on the holliday and that she should contact the SW to determine the best method to work with us and the dept to work around hollidays in the future.

We generally make plans about 2-3 weeks in advance of the hollidays.

[Hadley2]

I understand the frustration we sometimes all feel, and really do sympathasize with it, but I am pretty taken aback by the question posed in serious terms and many of the answers.

But first, why is the mother calling your house? Does she have dss clearance and your permission to call into your home? Does she have dss clearance and your permission to visit with her child over the phone in your home? If any one of the answers to those questions is "no," then the appropriate reply is, "I am so sorry you are feeling sad. You are not supposed to call here, however, and I should not be speaking to you. You need to take any concerns you have to the caseworker." Then I say a polite goodbye and hang up.

If the answers are yes, then the appropriate response is, "I am so sorry you are feeling sad." Then I would proceed with whatever I have been bound to do with regard to her talking to her child in my home. If it's OK, you could say that now is not a good time because of such-and-such and suggest another day and time for them to talk.

But, geez, it is absolutely NOT within a fp's bounds to be telling a parent what they can and can't get based on what the fp thinks is or of their behavior, or to be chastising a parent for failures, or to be making judgmental statements of any kind to the parent, or to in any way imply that the fp has some control over what happens in the case and the parents' situation--mainly because we don't. To do any of those things is far out of bounds and can be quite destructive and counterproductive to the goals of the case plan. It can even blow up the case in several different ways if the defense lawyer gets wind of it.

We just have no legal or ethical right and no business going there with a parent. We are in the picture to take care of the children and parent them for the state in the absence of their parents. We are about the kids, not the parents.

We can vent to each other here, vent to other fps in fp associations, even vent to the cw, but not to the parent.

[stevenstwin]

What about in those states and counties where the Foster Parents are supposed to be mentors or co-parents to the bios? I don't think the OP meant to imply that if the mother did "x" then the FP could decide to allow more access - I think she meant it in a more general "you need to follow your case plan to get your kids back' sort of way.

Originally Posted by Hadley2

I understand the frustration we sometimes all feel, and really do sympathasize with it, but I am pretty taken aback by the question posed in serious terms and many of the answers.

But first, why is the mother calling your house? Does she have dss clearance and your permission to call into your home? Does she have dss clearance and your permission to visit with her child over the phone in your home? If any one of the answers to those questions is "no," then the appropriate reply is, "I am so sorry you are feeling sad. You are not supposed to call here, however, and I should not be speaking to you. You need to take any concerns you have to the caseworker." Then I say a polite goodbye and hang up.

If the answers are yes, then the appropriate response is, "I am so sorry you are feeling sad." Then I would proceed with whatever I have been bound to do with regard to her talking to her child in my home. If it's OK, you could say that now is not a good time because of such-and-such and suggest another day and time for them to talk.

But, geez, it is absolutely NOT within a fp's bounds to be telling a parent what they can and can't get based on what the fp thinks is or of their behavior, or to be chastising a parent for failures, or to be making judgmental statements of any kind to the parent, or to in any way imply that the fp has some control over what happens in the case and the parents' situation--mainly because we don't. To do any of those things is far out of bounds and can be quite destructive and counterproductive to the goals of the case plan. It can even blow up the case in several different ways if the defense lawyer gets wind of it.

We just have no legal or ethical right and no business going there with a parent. We are in the picture to take care of the children and parent them for the state in the absence of their parents. We are about the kids, not the parents.

We can vent to each other here, vent to other fps in fp associations, even vent to the cw, but not to the parent.

[fostapeepz]

I always deferred any statements such as that to the caseworker. I had the bio-mom try to get me to arrange visits or other things, and I always told her to call the caseworker. Often she didn't, and that was too bad. But that was her choice.

[ranoutofnames]

I had to read the OP a couple of times because some of the replies made me think maybe I read the OP wrong.

Not sure if I reread (several times) and got it right... so if not, let me know... there was no plan for her to have contact on Halloween night. No one has heard from her in a month (not you or the cw) and therefore there have been no visits for the past month. On Halloween night she calls your house. She's saying she's basically sad she wasn't able to be there for this Halloween. I'm assuming (just from being a mom) that she's sad because she knows she can never get this Halloween back and that's what is making her sad and "having a hard day" because she would have liked to have been there but knew she couldn't.

This is just the start of what I consider the Holiday Season for Kids... and it lasts through Easter. There is Halloween, Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Year's, St. Patrick's Day (my community does a big parade for this), and then Easter. It's like one family gathering or happy event with children/family after another. With as many children as I've had in my home, I've gone through it too and truly understand many of the emotions I can imagine you are having.

For most people we associate a happy childhood memory around a holiday, and maybe for this mother this was the one holiday she associates as a happy childhood memory and she wanted to experience it with her child. To me Halloween isn't the old fashioned "dead day" but rather when it comes to children it is all about pretend, imagination, possibilities, hope, and CANDY. Costumes aren't just scary anymore, I can't tell you how many Princess costumes and Mario Brothers I saw this year! It's a chance to visually express yourself and fit in.

My response to mom (if my scenario is correct)... "your child had a wonderful time and I took pictures to put into the life book. Let the cw know when you will be coming to another visit and I will send him in his costume so he can Trick-or-Treat you". Let her know there are several more holidays to come and although they may not be together on the special day that she should make their visit time special.

I usually figure it's not my place to judge. I can feel a lot of things but those are my emotions and not something I need to burden the parent or anyone else with (I come here to vent ) I encourage them as much as I can... being a parent is HARD and even the best of us make mistakes along the way. Usually not to the same extent as the parents whose children are in foster care, but mistakes.

We doubt ourselves along the way... lord knows after a recent melt down of A1 I called my mom and just cried. Everything seemed to be falling apart and then A1 was BAD... bad enough I looked at the Wal-Mart worker who was standing in shock and said "she's 9 and mentally ill".

We also all have some regret, and this is likely one of a million the bio-parent is going to experience in this foster care journey. Sometimes understanding and compassion is all we can/should offer.

[Biblemom]

I have learned that many times Bio families just want someone to listen. They aren't always expecting you to 'fix' whatever it is. Sometimes they just need to talk.

[lovingheart]

Sorry I have been a little busy and was not able to get on the computer until tonight. I appreciate all the responses. I was just asking a question not looking for a response to give her (for those who seem a little touchy about the topic I was very nice and did not say what my tired, overworked, impulsive brain suggested I say). Here the state always asks if you are willing for the parent to call your home unless there is a court order stating they cannot. You as the foster parent get to set the rules about days, times, and what is appropriate to be discussed. If they do not follow your rules you can block their number. Parents are given your name as well (this does not really matter to DH and I as we have very public, high profile careers and could not keep our names secret in our geographical area anyway(small town)). Because we are such a small town the state allows us foster parents to decide if we want the parents to join us at a public event/place (parade, street fair, trick or treat or at our only department store) unless there is a court order stating otherwise. We just need to let them know that we allowed it and what happened. We do not supervise his regulare visits. He has not seen them in two weeks for visits but we had not heard from them in a month before this phone call. If she had called prior to trick or treat time DH and I may have considered letting them come with us for a short time and have gotten CW approval. I have been nothing but supportive to his parents and have encouraged them to keep their visits no matter what and let them know of all the new things their child is doing. I even offered to try to get a picture to them of him dressed in his costume. I was not judging them, just thinking the facts. They have supervised visits. The visit supervisor does not work holidays or after 3p.m. on holiday eves. The state has told them that they cannot have more visits, longer visits nor unsupervised visits until they start working their case plan. It is a fact not a judgment.

As for am I allowed to say that she needs to call back another time. I am because the only reason they are allowed to call at all is because DH and I are willing to let them and encourage them to do so if they can respect our rules and boundaries. I refuse to force a child to talk to someone on the phone if they do not want to when it is not court ordered. And since this is a toddler we put the phone on speaker phone while she talks so he can still run around the room and play while she talks to him. I could not do that on Halloween night because I had a housefull of people and he refused to come to the phone itself. I suggested she call the next night instead.