[millie58]

I was told that also; I have 2 sets of brothers and both sets of bio siblings got new numbers!!! go figure!!

[hkolln]

Originally Posted by ScrapMonkey

This is really an easy process. You go into the SS office with your new birth certificate and a second form of ID like an insurance card (we had our son's Medicaid card with his new name on it). When you fill out the form, it asks you if this child has ever had a SS# issued. You check NO. This child with this name has NOT had a SS# before. This was NEVER told to us for our first adoption, but thankfully the agent saw he was adopted from foster care on the adoption decree I brought and said, "Of course, let's get this done." I heard other people talk about checking the no box and I thought it didn't make sense. Then, for our second adoption, this info was provided to us by DCFS.

Hope that info helps someone, it sure helped us!

But my question is:
When you sign the form aren't you agreeing that this particular child NEVER had a SS#? Isn't that considered an offense if they do a search and find it by chance?

[ScrapMonkey]

No. This child has never had a social security number. It's not a simple name change as some suggest, it's an adoption with a new birth certificate and it was explained to me this is the proper way to get a social security number for a child adopted through foster care. It is how many, many DFS agencies tell their parents to apply for the card.

[hkolln]

Well it must vary by area because here they won't change it if the child knows they are adopted and they will not budge.

[tylind23]

The Social Security guidelines are very specific. A new number is not to be issued except in extreme situations. The workers at the SS office are not trying to be a pain, it's just policy. It's true that a new number can be issued for an adopted child if they do not know they are adopted. The only way to get a new number issued for a child who does know that they are adopted is to prove immediate danger (victims of domestic violence, etc.) or to prove that the current number has been abused (not just that there is a possibility of it being abused in the future). You may occasionally find a SS employee who will disregard the rules, but if they are doing their job, these are the only ways to get a new number issued. Even then, these decisions should not be made by the worker at the window. There are forms to fill out, documentation to be submitted, and it is all sent in to the Central Office for approval.

To the person who posted about not knowing if their foster child has a SS number, if you take ID for you and the child (shot record, school record, medicaid card, etc.) and proof of custody to the SS office, they can tell you if a number has ever been issued for that child.

[tylind23]

"No. This child has never had a social security number. It's not a simple name change as some suggest, it's an adoption with a new birth certificate and it was explained to me this is the proper way to get a social security number for a child adopted through foster care. It is how many, many DFS agencies tell their parents to apply for the card."

The child is still the same person, just with a new name. That person has been issued a number in the past and this could be considered Social Security fraud. Not saying anything would come of it, but it could be considered as fraud. Also, issues could still arise because the old number is still active so the birthparents could still misuse that record, and this will still affect that child's record, even if that is not the number they are currently using.

[hkolln]

Originally Posted by tylind23

The child is still the same person, just with a new name. That person has been issued a number in the past and this could be considered Social Security fraud.

This is what we were told too. Because it is infact the same child with a number then you cannot get a new number unless you can prove fraud on that current number OR domestic violence (and even then we were told domestic violence only pertained to adults!) If the child is of the age of knowing they were adopted then they would not issue a totally new SS number. We were told to go to the SS office in another area of town to get her name changed on her current number. That was all we could do.

Technically you are lying when you say this child has NEVER had a SS number when in fact that particular child does. Not that you would get caught but I didn't feel like I would afford to take that chance personally.

[Sdirector]

Not advocating fraud, but wouldn't it be extremely difficult to match the child's new name with their old one? Adoption records are sealed by the court, so any link could be difficult.

[LibbyHawkins]

Originally Posted by hkolln

This is what we were told too. Because it is infact the same child with a number then you cannot get a new number unless you can prove fraud on that current number OR domestic violence (and even then we were told domestic violence only pertained to adults!) If the child is of the age of knowing they were adopted then they would not issue a totally new SS number. We were told to go to the SS office in another area of town to get her name changed on her current number. That was all we could do.

Technically you are lying when you say this child has NEVER had a SS number when in fact that particular child does. Not that you would get caught but I didn't feel like I would afford to take that chance personally.

I think that presenting your opinion on this is fraud should be noted, IMO.

Just my Honest Opinion. SS numbers in my OPINION are issued under a name, when the child's name changes, then, guess what IMHO there has not been a SS# issued. Now, my child is 18 months old and has yet to be issued a SS# so it is not something I will worry about if/when the adoption becomes final.

[hkolln]

Originally Posted by LibbyHawkins

Just my Honest Opinion. SS numbers in my OPINION are issued under a name, when the child's name changes, then, guess what IMHO there has not been a SS# issued. Now, my child is 18 months old and has yet to be issued a SS# so it is not something I will worry about if/when the adoption becomes final.

If that is the case then why is there a part of the SS office here that basically only does name changes? If infact the law stated what you say then they wouldn't need an area that does name changes. They would issue new SS numbers to anyone whom changes their name. And they have been pretty strict here after 9/11.

And in your case you could get it changed because of the childs age here.

[takingtheplunge]

SS office just sucks.
I read on line what I needed to get a number. Even though I won't have a b/c for a year, I have medical records. records of birth, mom's SS number, medical cal cards before and after name change, and I had adoption decree. The SS worker asked me if I wanted a new number. I guess the baby was give one already (they looked it up). I said yes I wanted a new number. She had NO problem doing that, but when I didn't have the birth cert, she would not do it. She said she got introuble for doing it before with just and adoption decree. It's lame really. I told her per the handbook, I have medical records and medical foot print from birth and Medical ID cards. This can sub for birth cert if I also have adoption decree. However, they wouldn't do it. I made them look up policy. Then, they fell back on their computer would not take it after they entered everything. They had to call a supervisor over. Then, they said that since the baby is over one, it's considered a "suspect" and I can't use the other documentation in place of birth cert. It doesn't say that in the handbook. It's stupid. All the paperwork I have generates the birth cert. So why do I need that to get a SS number. They can see her old number in the computer. They can see the decree. I hate government sometimes.

[Sdirector]

Name changes, with an adult, are usually the result of marriage and divorce, or possibly an adult adoption. When a person marries or is divorced, they keep their entire identity. In a marriage, that person will want to keep access to the same credit file, and in a divorce, they may not want to keep access to the same credit report, but they need to!

In a typical name change as I mentioned, a person probably has worked, and wants to keep the credit for any social security taxes that have been paid in their name, and credit for working quarters. That would be the reason for the name changes, but not numbers changed.

With an adopted child, the entire identity changes. Most adopted children do not have credit files, nor have they worked to earn quarter credits for social security. Therefore, the issue is a bit different. They may also have birth parents (particularly in a TPR) that could potentially try to use the number to find them, or they could attempt to use the number for fraudulent purposes. When we adopt my daughter, I am concerned about her bmother (who has a history of fraud) using her number for illegal purposes, or for any one of the multiple husbands that she had who filed tax returns with her having access to the number.

So, given the spirit of the question, "Has the child ever had a social security number?" I would not feel uncomfortable if I had to answer "no." (Child's new name) has not ever had a social security number. You are not doing this for any intent to defraud anyone.

[ScrapMonkey]

Originally Posted by hkolln

Technically you are lying when you say this child has NEVER had a SS number when in fact that particular child does. Not that you would get caught but I didn't feel like I would afford to take that chance personally.

Technically, we're following the directions given by the state and given by MANY states to parents who adopt through foster care. If you don't agree with the procedure, fine. But it is the procedure we are advised to follow.

[hkolln]

Originally Posted by ScrapMonkey

Technically, we're following the directions given by the state and given by MANY states to parents who adopt through foster care. If you don't agree with the procedure, fine. But it is the procedure we are advised to follow.

Procedures are not laws though. It's not I don't agree with DCF procedures...believe me if I could change our daughters SS number I would BUT here the SS office will not allow it. Just because you are told one thing doesn't make it correct or legal.

[shaslove]

This thread is so making me want to hold off getting C a ss#!