[Boulderbabe]

There are a lot of new people on the boards, and a lot of new prospective parents. I think that is great---there is such a huge need for foster and adoptive parents! But something is concerning me, and I want to put it out there. I'm taking some flak for my position, so I want to make what I think clear.

I think many people who are new to the system are confused about who the system serves. When you're new to the fost/adopt world, and especially if you've never been a parent before, it's easy to focus on what *you* want and need. This is such an emotionally vulnerable time, and becoming a parent is an enormous step. When there are no guarantees about how things will work out, it's tough to have your heart on the line. I totally empathize with the idea that the social workers shepherding new parents through the process should be helping and supporting them, both logistically and emotionally.

But the foster care system isn't designed to help prospective parents. The system is not intended to help adoptive families get what they want. It is designed to do what is in the child's best interest, not what is in adoptive families' best interest. Because the system has so few resources, almost all the time and energy that social workers have is devoted to the kids. Second in line are the birthfamilies, since huge amounts of resources have to be devoted to trying to rehabilitate them, and make them safe for the kids.

Foster families come third in line: what resources the system can spare for them goes to supporting them and keeping them open so that more kids can come through these homes on a temporary basis. Recruiting and training foster parents is so costly and so time consuming that retaining them is critical for most systems. Even so, there aren't enough resources to keep most foster families in the system for more than a few years; turnover is really high in most places because the job is so demanding and the support is so minimal.

Adoptive families are the very last in line for help, support, and care from the system. I wish it were different, and that adoptive families *were* treated as the incredibly important parts of the system that they are. But fact is, there just aren't the resources to provide a lot of support for adoptive families. There isn't enough social worker time or enough money for training. As adoptive families, we are pretty much on our own and need to look out for ourselves.

I think that it is a pretty significant mistake for prospective parents to think of themselves as the clients in a fee-for-service business. If that were true, yes, they *would* be the focus of attention, since they'd be the paying customers. But the foster care system is not a business, and foster and adoptive families are not customers, and foster children are not products to be provided to the clients. As foster and adoptive parents, we are partners in the attempt to serve children. Our goals should be to provide the very best care for kids, even if that means that *we* are not getting the kind of care, attention, or service we'd like.

The children are and should be the focus of everybody's efforts. The foster care system is not about us. I totally and wholeheartedly endorse the motto I've heard social workers use: "families for children, not children for families."

I think that each and every foster or adoptive parent should be aware of that principle. Even more importantly, I think each and every one of us should endorse it. Being child-centered----keeping the kids as the first priority in everything we do---is the most important thing that any adult in the system can do.

[mrstkg1]

"But the foster care system isn't designed to help prospective parents. The system is not intended to help adoptive families get what they want. It is designed to do what is in the child's best interest, not what is in adoptive families' best interest. Because the system has so few resources, almost all the time and energy that social workers have is devoted to the kids. Second in line are the birthfamilies, since huge amounts of resources have to be devoted to trying to rehabilitate them, and make them safe for the kids."


I agreed with the bulk of what you said, except for the fact that it is been my experience over the years that the bulk of the resources in terms of time, energy and money go to the bio families in an effort to help them regain their kids. As a foster parent, you are fighting upstream if you within the first year of your time with a child do anything to oppose Mom and Dad. The system just isn't set up that way. You will be looked upon with a lot of suspicion and rightly so in my opinion. These people will be high, get arrested, stay with dangerous people, lose their jobs, lose their housing, fight with you and among themselves, go into rehab, leave rehab. This is the process they are going through in attempts to get their kids back and we just have to live with it.

If you are choosing to build a family through adoption, you have to recognize that you may get a 2-day old newborn who goes home 18-months later. It absolutely happens all the time. I can't say I agree with it in many cases, but that's what we've all signed up for.

I think I would really urge new foster parents who have this dream of a perfect hospital experience through adoption a short time later to have much more realistic expectations. Please understand, I'm not picking on anyone. I know what it is to love these children so much and see them go. But to be so in love with a one week old baby that you would fall apart if they went to family is not a good plan.

Having said all that, I believe that God has a plan for every child and every family. God bless us all as this is a very tough job.

[mnmomma]

I totally understand your point and agree with where the emphasis needs to be - on kids. However, there are different social workers with different roles. When a prospective foster parent works with their licensing worker, do you not believe that they should be treated as human and with respect? To have some level of communication? That is the issue I have picked up on in other threads. While I don't expect a social worker to hold my hand and call me daily, I do expect that I will be respected as an individual who is on the same team.

[CaddoRose]

I think the OP is making some really good points that new prospective parents entering this world( and I mean the foster/adopt world) need to know, because some of them will not be told these things by their agency or the state. We see this all the time on the forums. Understanding how things work in this world can help people adjust their expectations about how it will be. Knowing where you fit into the great scheme of things at least is giving you knowledge.

[mrstkg1]

It is my understanding that the role of the licensing worker is to get you licensed, sent you updates for training, do compliance checks and all the things regarding keeping you and your family up to code. They also walk you through the re-licensing process when you about to expire. They don't really provide support regarding placements, get you placements or become involved with the daily challenges of being a foster parent. They should be able to provide you with the handbook to help you understand how the agency works and all the policies and procedures. Other than that, they are not really there for support. You must find your own support system through family, friends and fellow foster parents and other resources like this board. There is a pretty high learning curve to being a foster parent and understanding all the ins and outs. I am just now beginning to think I get it and I have been a foster parent 6 years.

For example, when I was a new foster parent, I had two little boys. They both become ill and it looked like I would need to miss work for a week. I freaked out and call the case worker and told her I needed assistance with the sick kids and she never even called me back...When I finally did talk to her, she said, that's something every foster parent deals with and that I would have to arrange for backup childcare when necessary. Boy did I learn a lesson that day, that is that basically I'm on my own.

[DannieAS]

Originally Posted by Boulderbabe

Adoptive families are the very last in line for help, support, and care from the system. I wish it were different, and that adoptive families *were* treated as the incredibly important parts of the system that they are. But fact is, there just aren't the resources to provide a lot of support for adoptive families. There isn't enough social worker time or enough money for training. As adoptive families, we are pretty much on our own and need to look out for ourselves.

I think that it is a pretty significant mistake for prospective parents to think of themselves as the clients in a fee-for-service business. If that were true, yes, they *would* be the focus of attention, since they'd be the paying customers. But the foster care system is not a business, and foster and adoptive families are not customers, and foster children are not products to be provided to the clients. As foster and adoptive parents, we are partners in the attempt to serve children. Our goals should be to provide the very best care for kids, even if that means that *we* are not getting the kind of care, attention, or service we'd like.

The children are and should be the focus of everybody's efforts. The foster care system is not about us. I totally and wholeheartedly endorse the motto I've heard social workers use: "families for children, not children for families."

I know I'm one of the "newbies" and have been involved in some of the threads you have been involved with.

I don't disagree with the *it's all about me* thing. In fact, I also work for the state as a school employee, I know the state system...red tape, political undercurrent, slowness, frustration...I've also worked with a lot of foster children, adoptive children etc. seeing the good, bad, and ugly parts of the foster care system.

It's also true that people in different states and in different counties experience different things as well. Here is where I think the whole forum board dilemma/tension if you will is displayed.

I think what people would like to see is just respect all the way around. Whether or not I'm at the top or at the bottom of the totem pole, respect should always be a part of the process. For example...if I have a question, I e-mail my cw/aw and unless something is happening, I usually get my question answered within the business day (if not within the hour). Is the process slow right now? yes, but that has to do with the many people that work and have to look at things etc. So what is my outlook...I don't have a feeling that i'm at the bottom of the totem pole because communication is there.
Is the process all about the kids and their best interest? Absolutely! Why do you think they really try to match the best family out there with a particular child, so that it meshes and it can work for the mental health and stability of the child (not the other way around)
But depending on where you are and where you will be adopting from, this is where sometimes we might disagree. There are PLENTY of resources out there for adoptive parents where I"m at. In fact we have dang good post-adoption services (and I"m NOT talking about AAP because that's not a given, nor am I worried about that) and we have been told to tap into it.

Should people be aware that the system in general sucks and isn't the best? ABSOLUTELY....should we generalize and say that we all get the short end of the stick so get used to it? Ummmm...well I personally don't think so....
Should we expect the worst and hope for the best? absolutely! Should we maintain that our cws are supposed to suck and not communicate or give us some common curtesy? uh no...

just as I could get away being a bad speech therapist and missing all my deadlines and not calling parents when they would like to chat over their child's progress simply because I'm tenured doesn't mean that this is ok either.

Does what I wrote make sense?

[Boulderbabe]

Originally Posted by mnmomma

When a prospective foster parent works with their licensing worker, do you not believe that they should be treated as human and with respect? To have some level of communication?

I think that everybody in the system should be treated as human and with respect. And I think that foster/adoptive parents should get WAY more information than they actually do.

But I don't think that we should expect "good service" or that our needs or wishes will come first. I think that basically, if you're a fost/adopt parent you have to assume that no news is good news, and know that it's just going to take a long time to answer your requests.

I also think that foster and adoptive parents have to know upfront that the social workers are NOT (not, not, definitely not) looking out for the foster/adopt's family's interests. They are trying to place kids. So it's really important for foster and adoptive families to be very clear about their boundaries, and to enforce them. If we don't stand up for ourselves and our families, and make sure we know what we can and can't handle, nobody else will.

[Boulderbabe]

Originally Posted by mrstkg1
You must find your own support system through family, friends and fellow foster parents and other resources like this board. There is a pretty high learning curve to being a foster parent and understanding all the ins and outs. I am just now beginning to think I get it and I have been a foster parent 6 years.

Boy, isn't that the truth. I think the single most important thing that prospective foster parents can do is make sure they have an INCREDIBLY good support system. DSS is not a support system----you've got to have your family and your friends, your backup childcare, your respite care provider, and possibly a therapist.

One of the best things to come out of fostering for me is that I developed a great support system in the process. Many of the people closest to me now are friends I met through fostering. We hold each other up. :-)

[Boulderbabe]

Originally Posted by DannieAS

For example...if I have a question, I e-mail my cw/aw and unless something is happening, I usually get my question answered within the business day (if not within the hour). I don't have a feeling that i'm at the bottom of the totem pole because communication is there.

I like to think that social workers do their best to return calls and emails in a timely manner. But I know their caseloads can be HUGE, there can be people in serious crisis, and that answering me just might not make it onto the priority list that day.

I've had SWs who didn't answer my email for a week. I've actually had a case where I was out of town for four days, and I had put one of my fdaughters in respite care. The kid was taken to the HOSPITAL, and nobody called me for two days. I was absolutely furious. The SW's answer? "I had more important things to deal with than calling you right then."

It would be great if the SWs answered us within a business day. But in my experience, that is unlikely to happen all of the time.

There are PLENTY of resources out there for adoptive parents where I"m at. In fact we have dang good post-adoption services (and I"m NOT talking about AAP because that's not a given, nor am I worried about that) and we have been told to tap into it.

I think that before you assume that post-adoptive services are great, you should talk to some of the parents who have adopted from the system. We also have some really good post-adoptive services. There are support groups, training courses for special needs, medicaid, etc. But the truth is, this does not come anywhere close to addressing the needs that post-adoptive families have if their kids have serious problems. It's great that we have medicaid, for example, but very few doctors take it. Mental health coverage on medicaid is very low, and it runs out quickly if you've got a kid in residential treatment. Finding respite care for an emotionally disabled or medically fragile kid is extremely difficult.

I think it's really important to be fully aware of what those challenges are going to be before you jump in.

Look, I'm not trying to bash you. I'm just hoping that everybody who is new to the system is really aware of what they're getting into. The system is extraordinarily complex and challenging, and our kids often have complicated problems that come from their pasts. Everything seems great during the MAPP classes and licensing, but that is not the whole story.

Enthusiasm is great, and so is optimism. They go a long way in this process. But it's good to temper them with skepticism and a realistic appraisal of just how much support (or "service") you're going to get.

[Prettyboicris]

Originally Posted by DannieAS

I know I'm one of the "newbies" and have been involved in some of the threads you have been involved with.
I don't disagree with the *it's all about me* thing. In fact, I also work for the state as a school employee, I know the state system...red tape, political undercurrent, slowness, frustration...I've also worked with a lot of foster children, adoptive children etc. seeing the good, bad, and ugly parts of the foster care system.
It's also true that people in different states and in different counties experience different things as well. Here is where I think the whole forum board dilemma/tension if you will is displayed.
I think what people would like to see is just respect all the way around. Whether or not I'm at the top or at the bottom of the totem pole, respect should always be a part of the process. For example...if I have a question, I e-mail my cw/aw and unless something is happening, I usually get my question answered within the business day (if not within the hour). Is the process slow right now? yes, but that has to do with the many people that work and have to look at things etc. So what is my outlook...I don't have a feeling that i'm at the bottom of the totem pole because communication is there.
Is the process all about the kids and their best interest? Absolutely! Why do you think they really try to match the best family out there with a particular child, so that it meshes and it can work for the mental health and stability of the child (not the other way around)
But depending on where you are and where you will be adopting from, this is where sometimes we might disagree. There are PLENTY of resources out there for adoptive parents where I"m at. In fact we have dang good post-adoption services (and I"m NOT talking about AAP because that's not a given, nor am I worried about that) and we have been told to tap into it.

Should people be aware that the system in general sucks and isn't the best? ABSOLUTELY....should we generalize and say that we all get the short end of the stick so get used to it? Ummmm...well I personally don't think so....
Should we expect the worst and hope for the best? absolutely! Should we maintain that our cws are supposed to suck and not communicate or give us some common curtesy? uh no...
just as I could get away being a bad speech therapist and missing all my deadlines and not calling parents when they would like to chat over their child's progress simply because I'm tenured doesn't mean that this is ok either.
Does what I wrote make sense?

You make some great points that I agree with. So far everyone I have been working with has been communicative and respectful. I keep hearing about how "CW/SW's" are "overworked" and "horrible" but thus far my experience has been good. That may change who knows but I do agree that people shouldn't generalize. Also as you mentioned EVERY STATE IS DIFFERENT and I have read things that happen in my state that don't happen in others and Vice Versa. Just because someone is busy does not mean they are going to drop the ball. I am in the SW field and I see patients everyday just because I am busy doesn't mean the quality of service I provide is going to decline. If anything I am more attentive when busy to be extra sure I don't drop the ball. Dannie I like what you say about you being Tenure and still doing what you have to do. I think that is important for people to remember.

[DannieAS]

Originally Posted by Boulderbabe

I think that before you assume that post-adoptive services are great, you should talk to some of the parents who have adopted from the system. I think it's really important to be fully aware of what those challenges are going to be before you jump in........

Look, I'm not trying to bash you. I'm just hoping that everybody who is new to the system is really aware of what they're getting into

Before I answer, please, please, understand that I don't think you're trying to bash me

I think it's great to put realism with enthusiasm, but also realize that some of us don't jump in blindly....I try for the most part not to type sentences out of thin air. Before I signed up with the county, I do know 4 families that adopted through my county and everyone had good things to say and told me the realities and the good points, so I personally have done so.

Realize also, that for me personally, I go to work in a community where I've taken away knives from children (elementary) and deal with the brokenness of families in general so yeah I have acquired a weird sense of humor and optimism in general not so nice situations.

[Prettyboicris]

Originally Posted by Boulderbabe

I think that each and every foster or adoptive parent should be aware of that principle. Even more importantly, I think each and every one of us should endorse it. Being child-centered----keeping the kids as the first priority in everything we do---is the most important thing that any adult in the system can do.

I definitely agree that the focus should be the child. I do however disagree with a lot of the generalizations made in this thread. I know different states do things differently and I think that is where a lot of the tension/ confusion comes from. People have a tendency to say "You won't get this.." and "you can't do that.." but in a different state maybe they "May get this and that".

I think that in an attempt to help you can turn people off by the approach you take when relaying information. I think it is always good to share experience but there will be different scenarios that will play out differently for different people. I know I have asked a few foster adopt questions where people have said "In foster care that would NEVER happen" but then just as many people reply stating that in THEIR STATE it does happen and is perfectly legal. I personally think that people should be given the benefit of the doubt that if they are at least at a certain point in the process that they have an idea of what they might be getting themselves into. Obviously there are somethings people won't know or experience until they are in the thick of it but painting Foster care and the process as this dark cloud IMO is actually more detrimental than helpful. The way that the post reads makes it seem like foster care system is this bad system that is full of tunnel vision people who are overworked and could care less about all parties involved. I think this gloominess that is being put out there is why there are plenty of places that need foster/adoptive homes because people have been so "warned" about how the "system" is so "bad" that people don't want to even go through with anything.

Those are just my thoughts on the matter.

[embuck]

Originally Posted by Prettyboicris

I definitely agree that the focus should be the child. I do however disagree with a lot of the generalizations made in this thread. I know different states do things differently and I think that is where a lot of the tension/ confusion comes from. People have a tendency to say "You won't get this.." and "you can't do that.." but in a different state maybe they "May get this and that".

I think that in an attempt to help you can turn people off by the approach you take when relaying information. I think it is always good to share experience but there will be different scenarios that will play out differently for different people. I know I have asked a few foster adopt questions where people have said "In foster care that would NEVER happen" but then just as many people reply stating that in THEIR STATE it does happen and is perfectly legal. I personally think that people should be given the benefit of the doubt that if they are at least at a certain point in the process that they have an idea of what they might be getting themselves into. Obviously there are somethings people won't know or experience until they are in the thick of it but painting Foster care and the process as this dark cloud IMO is actually more detrimental than helpful. The way that the post reads makes it seem like foster care system is this bad system that is full of tunnel vision people who are overworked and could care less about all parties involved. I think this gloominess that is being put out there is why there are plenty of places that need foster/adoptive homes because people have been so "warned" about how the "system" is so "bad" that people don't want to even go through with anything.

Those are just my thoughts on the matter.

AMEN!

I would also like to say that I realize there are allot of bad experiences out there with the system as well as good. In my own personal experience I can totally see that CPS has NO TIME in small details but thank God for my agency that does in fact look after their foster and adoptive families. It seems like every social worker with CPS that I have had has yet to actually read my homestudy. They don't know anything about us and rarely know anything about the children in care. Their main priority is to do their job the best that they can with what little they have. This is just my personal experience and should not be assumed to generalize all of CPS workers out there. I think also they depend a great deal on private agencies to do the leg work for them. Now regarding my experience with my agency they are doing awesome! We, as a foster to adopt home, are just as important then the children in the system... and you want to know why? Well logically it comes full circle. If you had a home that prefered children A, B & C but were matched with X,Y & Z then there is more of a chance of disruption and causing more damage to that child. If the foster parents are not equiped to deal with certain things then it could end in disaster for the children and ultimately causing the turn over in foster family homes that you spoke of. It is JUST as important to communicate with foster families for the CHILDREN's benefit. Does this always happen? Obviously not, but I think its poor wording to say we are on the bottom of the list. We would all like to assume that the children come first no matter what but if the families they are being raised in are not as equally regarded then this effects the children's well beings.

There are ALLOT of families in the foster system who started out primarily wanting to grow their families this way. I don't see why this is looked at as a bad thing. I don't see how its fair whatsoever to use words like
"But the foster care system is not a business, and foster and adoptive families are not customers, and foster children are not products to be provided to the clients."

To me this is HIGHLY insulting. Why should you assume people take this approach to growing their families? Could people really be so cold hearted as to associate children with "products"? Can people be less intelligent then yourself simply because they do not share your views 100%?

Without these families allot of children would never find their forever homes. They would never have the parents who fought so hard to keep them safe and in a loving home. You cannot and should not place people into catagories. Each case and circumstance is different.

[quiescentfury]

My best advice - Get a mentor.

We are setting up a mentor program with my agency because when I was a new foster parent I called our SW all the time. Both county and private. There were tons of little things I did not know. I approached our agency with the mentor idea because I felt bad. Many of my questions could be answered by experienced foster parents.

Example - My kids adoption worker has 45 kids on his case load in about 30 different families. If all 30 families called him with 2 questions a week that is 60 questions and about 12 call a day. How can the SWs get any work down if all they are doing is answering phone calls and e-mails.

By having a mentor you might be able to reduce those questions and the SWs have more time to spend on the pressing issues.

[JJemail1]

BoulderBabe,

Just a short note to tell you I appreciate and learned from your original post. Thanks for having the courage and taking the time to word your opinion so effectively.

Best regards,
Jennifer