[RobinKay]

Originally Posted by KelleyF

If Grandma really loved this baby, she would realize that is unfair for a baby to be raised by a 70 yr. old. Very selfish on the Grandma's part.

Unfortunatley, it happens all the time. The same thing happened to a friend of mine. The 71 yr. old great-grandmother was given custody of her 2 yr. old fs. No one else in the family was deemed fit to get custody. Of course, the gradmother was the one who raised her 6 kids, all of which had criminal records and were unable to get custody. That fact alone, coupled with her age, should have been enough for her to be denied custody...but no, not in the eyes of the court. I guess they wanted to give her one more baby to screw up. Two months later the great-grandmother had a stroke and her fs was returned to her.

Your post brought back memories for me.

At the hearing where our ds was placed with us, the (idiot) GAL assumed we were the grandparents, and actually said we should not have him because "the same mistakes would be made". No mention of the OTHER two children raised by my parents-in-law that turned out just fine, one a military officer and one a church-going, solid member of her community who works hard every day of her life and always paid her own bills. (BTW, we were the aunt and uncle and ds is doing great with us.)

I do agree that if the whole family is dysfunctional, no child should be placed into that environment.

[RobinKay]

Originally Posted by FullQuiverMamma

At first glance it seems to me that everyone should rally around grandma and support her efforts. I mean, come on, what if that were your grandchild?? The saying: "blood is thicker than water" may apply in this case. I agree with previous posters; fostering is about reunification - not adoption. I especially am keeping this in mind as even an adoptive parent whose adoption is not yet finalized... It is their baby until it is mine. Even so, God gives us the honor of raising children - we don't own or deserve such a treasure.

How beautiful your words are. As a relative who adopted our son out of foster care, just reading your post gave me peace and healing.

My heart aches for the wonderful families who give and give to their foster children, wanting that forever family so much.

[finallyfree05]

I spent 7 years in foster care, and even though I had an awesome foster family I can honestly say I wish I had been placed with my grandmother. Instead, I missed out on getting to know my bio famiies.
Obviously though if the grandmother can't care for the baby then thats different, but if she was deemed a fit placement there must be something we aren't seeing. I pray for that baby though that Grandma can care for her the way she deserves...bio family is always best when its possible.

[KelleyF]

Originally Posted by GRGFOR2

One thing those children are learning is COMPASSION.. it is something that all children should learn. The 3 children this 70 yr old grandmother has have learned that not only are they loved but to care about others.
.

Compassion is absolutely a wonderful attribute, but you shouldn't have to miss out on childhood to take care of your 85 yr. old grandmother to aquire it. The children are the one's that are supposed to be taken care of here, not the other way around.

.[/quote]They will most likely be Doctors and Nurses with all kinds of compassion for their patients..[/quote]


Wow, that's a stretch, but ok, I'll go with it. Too bad by the time they get to college their will be no parents to help out with finances so they won't be able to afford medical school.

[KelleyF]

Originally Posted by RobinKay

I do agree that if the whole family is dysfunctional, no child should be placed into that environment.

Yes, very true. No matter what who you are. And yes, I know it goes both ways. I have been follwing your posts and your situation is nothing like this one. Ths is a dangerous family in my neighborhood. (luckily, not too closeby)

[KelleyF]

Originally Posted by finallyfree05

I spent 7 years in foster care, and even though I had an awesome foster family I can honestly say I wish I had been placed with my grandmother. Instead, I missed out on getting to know my bio famiies.
Obviously though if the grandmother can't care for the baby then thats different, but if she was deemed a fit placement there must be something we aren't seeing. I pray for that baby though that Grandma can care for her the way she deserves...bio family is always best when its possible.

I agree. It is best whenever possible.
It's just not possible for a 70 yr. old to raise a newborn adequately. The child will suffer. However, I believe contact with the child and the grandparent is very important.

[RobinKay]

Originally Posted by KelleyF

Yes, very true. No matter what who you are. And yes, I know it goes both ways. I have been follwing your posts and your situation is nothing like this one. Ths is a dangerous family in my neighborhood. (luckily, not too closeby)

Absolutely agree, KellyF. Like I said, just sharing a memory in general.

The safety and well-being of this child is the primary consideration. I hope the baby will be OK, and if it doesn't work out, hope the fparent will still be available for the child.

[Hadley2]

"It's just not possible for a 70 yr. old to raise a newborn adequately."

Kelley, I have to take exception. Such posts are just way too absolute and condescending both to other posters and all women 70+ everywhere for me. There was absolutely nothing patronizing or insulting to anyone in Notamomyet's post; quite the contrary, she took a gentle, generous tone in framing the situation in a different, more positive light. I think the judge you quoted, on the other hand, was, however, deeply, cruelly, and unnecessarily patronizing and insulting if he framed his comments in the way you report. In that situation, if it was not a safe placement, I think that could have been said in a far more respectful and appropriate way. No one should ever be shamed or publicly humiliated for trying to do the right thing by a child. I am surprised that a foster parent would approve of such unwarranted meanness.

I also don't understand how in the world you know anything about GRG42's acquaintance's grandchildren to say "wow that's a stretch" about their potential for success in any particular career! Frankly, I think it is a "stretch" to presume so absolutely that you do.

This specific instance in the op may or may not be truly safe for the baby, we don't really know and the op doesn't really know. We can appreciate her concern for the child and her empathy for her saddened friend without ganging up judgmentally on people we don't even know--and especially without ganging up judgmentally against an entire class of people--all women over the age of 70 who are also grandmothers.

Posters can also, since she asked for help in understanding such situations, offer up different perspectives on the value of the older relative caregiver, one that appreciates and tries to explain the positives of these arrangements. That doesn't make them patronizing or insulting in any way.

So, to the op, sometimes things don't seem to make sense from the outside looking in. FPs, your friend included, may not have all the information there is to have about the family. A lot of distortions and misunderstandings can creep in whenever people are talking about other people in the foster world--especially when/if some of the source is second- or third-hand from a caseworker. Anyway, I hope the child is not actually in danger and that this arrangement will work out for as long as possible. I also hope your friend will find some comfort along the way.

As for the generalizations that have been thrown around here, 70 is not actually that old anymore for many people. My MIL at 71 was in far better shape than I was at 39. At 5 feet and 96 pounds, she was all muscle--quite the little "hard body." She lifted weights in a new mom's excercise group, routinely biked or walked 8 miles roundtrip to her town library, and could easily run circles around me at any family event. DD2 was an infant that year and I distinctly remember one uphill walk when she took the stroller from me so I could huff and puff my way up with a little dignity....

She is 81 now and still walks and bikes, mows her own lawn, gardens, volunteers several different places a week (including taking meals to "old" people), and travels with friends. I wouldn't hesitate to leave my 8- and 9-year olds with her for a weekend.

My dad was still sailing at the age of 80, although his new wife, two years his senior whom he had married the year before--the same year he went to Australia, Fijii and NZ with friends--wasn't thrilled with it. He's turning 86 this month, drives, lives in his own home with that wife, etc.

Well, now I'm rolling. Of course, men get a pass on this, don't they? John McCain is 71, yes? Grandfather, yes? Why does no one say, "hey, look at that feisty grandfather running for president! Go gramps!" Ditto the first President Bush. But a let a woman, even a woman under 40 who has a grandchild do ANYTHING and suddenly that is the headline of the story--"Grandma runs for office" "Grandma fights fires" "Grandma robs 7-11"--it's ridiculous, really, what a fuss people like to make over "grandmas" doing anything real.

Some people age faster than others. I am AMAZED by how many actresses used to be older than me but are now clearly younger! Some are even younger than they themselves used to be!

Seriously, some people stay capable long into "old age." Some are capable enough and that is good enough to enable society to honor the child's right to his/her family and the value that family placement has for that child. You may see little or no value to these arrangements, that's OK, but if others do, please don't put them down for it. And please don't generalize against a whole class of people based on the fact that they are (1) female, (2) working on the third generation of their family, and (3) over the age of--?whatever age you've decided is "too old."

[RobinKay]

Why do I always want to clap my hands and cheer when I read your posts, Hadley!

[KelleyF]

Originally Posted by Hadley2

"It's just not possible for a 70 yr. old to raise a newborn adequately."

Kelley, I have to take exception. Such posts are just way too absolute and condescending both to other posters and all women 70+ everywhere for me. There was absolutely nothing patronizing or insulting to anyone in Notamomyet's post; quite the contrary, she took a gentle, generous tone in framing the situation in a different, more positive light. I think the judge you quoted, on the other hand, was, however, deeply, cruelly, and unnecessarily patronizing and insulting if he framed his comments in the way you report. In that situation, if it was not a safe placement, I think that could have been said in a far more respectful and appropriate way. No one should ever be shamed or publicly humiliated for trying to do the right thing by a child. I am surprised that a foster parent would approve of such unwarranted meanness..

Last time I checked, I was entitled to my own opinion. Yes, 70+ is much too old to raise a newborn. I know there are plenty of 70+ yr. olds in wonderful shape, and I'm sure they are wonderful babysitters, but to raise a child full time would not be in the best interest of either the child or the adult. I'm am not trying to be cruel or condesending, just realistic.
As far as what the judge said, he was not cruel to this woman at all, he was just right to the point. Please don't assume you know the tone and demeanor at which he spoke because you were not there.
I'm also assuming by your comment about a foster parent approving of such meanness, you are talking about me. First of all, he was not mean (again, you were not there) and secondly, where in my post did I say I agreed with what he said? Oh yea, no where! Maybe you should read the posts more throughly before you start passing judgement.

I also don't understand how in the world you know anything about GRG42's acquaintance's grandchildren to say "wow that's a stretch" about their potential for success in any particular career! Frankly, I think it is a "stretch" to presume so absolutely that you do.[/quote]

That's not what I was referring to when I said that. I just meant that every child has the potential to be a Dr. or a nurse. No matter what the background. I don't think we should "fairytale up" a potentially damaging situation.

[Withay]

Ok everyone, let's get back to being respectful.

[KelleyF]

Originally Posted by Withay

Ok everyone, let's get back to being respectful.

Funny, when Hadley posted, you wanted to clap your hands and cheer. When I post, we all have to be respectful. My post was no more nor less respectful than hers.
It's fine if you don't agree with what I'm saying, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but don't label me as disrespectful just because I have a different point of view.

[mom2behappy]

scroll up withay didn't write the post about clapping and cheering Robinkay did...

[Lumpkin]

A childhood friend of mine was raised by a woman old enough to be his grandmother. His childhood was spent being teased about the elderly lady that he called mom. He didn't have as active of a life as other kids because his mom wasn't able to get out and play with him like other moms. He spent his teenage years taking care of himself and his mom, and eventually getting into lots of trouble since his mom couldn't adequately discipline (or even look after) such a kid at her age. His kids will never know a grandma because she died before he got through community college (couldn't afford better on his mother's SSI checks).

Sure there are great things about more mature people raising children - better financial stability, more time to spend with kids due to their careers being stable, etc. BUT if I had a choice between allowing a child to be adopted by a perfectly suited family of a younger age, I'd tend to choose that over an elderly person who most likely won't live to fully raise the child.

I don't think there is always a clearcut answer to what is best for a child, but I do think that we need to think we need to look past emotions and think about the possible impact such decisions have on a child's longterm development.

[BethanyB]

I believe there are grandmothers who can raise grandchildren at that age and grandmothers who cant. But foster parents are there to love and raise children until they can be reunified with their bio families. That is our job. Its not our job to judge whether the family member can properly take care of the baby. That is the judges job and I have a feeling that some of the facts we have been given here have been stretched a bit. Not by the OP but by her friend. The judges job is to take everything into consideration and Im sure he did. Its normal to feel anger and sadness when losing a foster child that you hoped to adopt but the child deserves to be with its family if at all possible. And the judge thought it was possible.