[pandatj]

Hi... I adopted my husband's two girls after they came to live with us in 2003. BMom had a very chaotic life and was not making good decisions. She moved across the country and hasnt really made consistant efforts to see her kiddos. The youngest, now 7, does not know BMom. The eldest, now 11, remembers Mom, but lies so much we dont know if what she is telling us is the truth or not. We have invited the Bmom and Bgrama to visit with us in the past. We have a PO box for them to use, as well.

BMom now has a new daughter. She hasnt called or written the girls in about 1 year. I have emailed her, I have tried to keep her in contact, however, it seems like she would rather not talk with me at all. I feel she wants me to let her have un monitored contact with the kiddos. (there is allegations of neglect and abuse, enough founded to remove kiddos from visits with Mom in 2003.) BGramma seems to think we are awful. She thinks we made up lies about abuse and neglect and that her daughter, Bmom, cannot do any wrong. She believes we should send the kiddos out there for visits, un monitored. Mind you they live 2500 miles away. She was thinking a few weeks. (Understanding that this is her daughter, I know she is going to believe her daughter over the adoptive parent of her grandkids.)

I am torn. On one hand, I want to make sure they are safe. 7yro has never been away from us. 11yro lies so much she would cause chaos for everyone. Bfamily seems to critize everything we do or say, and make us feel like we are out to destroy them. However, we are the ones who have kept the contact going... On the other hand, 11yro doesnt know what she wants. She wants to see her, she doesnt... Yes, she is in counseling...

So we made the firm decision that they would not travel there this summer, but left the invite open that they could come and visit here... We have not heard anything... Also, 11yro wants to know why BMom wants to see her, but she cannot take the time to write her... I think her lying and anger stems from BMom and her own feeling of inadequecy. BMom blames 11yro for everything happening prior to 2003... I am sad for my girls, I want to make the right choice. I do not know what that is...

This situation haunts my mind every day... I do not want to make a selfish move, but I do not want to make a mistake either. ....

I want to hear from you... PLEASE!
Thank you!

[pandatj]

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I think your 11 year-old has a point...why does she want them to visit for 3 weeks, but can't be bothered to write the girls?

I would be extremely leery of sending my children, at only 7 and 11, to spend 3 weeks with someone who is a virtual stranger to them.

I would offer as a compromise, that you can ALL come for a visit, and you will stay in a motel with the girls, but they can spend as much time with you and the girls as they want or they can come visit you at your house.

Until the girls have an established relationship with their birth mom, I would not allow them unmonitored access. Especially if there is a history of abuse and blaming the child for the abuse and other issues.

Best of luck in whatever you decide to do and please keep us updated.
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Christina

Adoptive mom to Pumpkin* 4 in October
Foster mom to Bubba* 2 years old and Sissy* 1 year old
*nicknames to protect confidentiality
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[pandatj]

Christina, I agree with that. How do I get over the feeling that I am making the wrong choice. (The Birth Family tell me I am "Killing them"... how do get over this feeling that I am letting others down...)

I guess it doesnt matter what they say.. I took the responsibility of protecting the kiddos and they can hate me all they want... But wow, is that a burden of stress... TO be hated... I think it kills my self esteem.
Thoughts?

[Sam-N-Tony]

I think its in the best interest NOT to send your children to their grandmother/biomom for the summer. I think it can be very detremental to your kids emotional state.

If they are soo interested in seeing the children they should hop on a plane and come see them. I think its way out of line for them to request that you send them there. I even think that even just seeing bio Mom could send them way overboard with emotions. I would tell them (bio mom and grandma) to start writing letters and calling consistently to open up the lines of communication with the kids. That way you are doing things in steps not a huge jump.

Only you and your dh knows what's best for your children. Take your families critiscism with a grain of salt because ultimately you are their parents and know whats best for your kids.
I think you guys made the right decision for your family.

[vegaschristina]

When you adopted those girls, you agreed to put their needs ahead of everything else on this planet. Let me put this to you another way, and see it from the other side for a minute.

You send your girls for 3 weeks. The 11 year old already "lies so much." What happens if she goes there and tells lies about you and your husband endangering them? Or what if something happens to them yet she lies about what happened because her bmom makes her feel guilty for the mom's perceived responsibility of the 11 year old in losing them?

If you allow contact without any form of monitoring, you could be setting yourself up for TONS of issues in the future. If they claim you are killing them for not allowing contact, you could always tell them that it is a privilege that they need to earn, but successfully maintaining contact with the girls and successfully having monitored contact.

[pandatj]

I am soo glad I came back to this site... It had been some time... But I needed you two to help put this in perspective for me... Hubby just gets frustrated.

And 11yr, has actually caused us problems from her lying... I thought about that. She could go there and start all sorts of stuff...

I feel bad for 11yr, but I hate the stress it puts on our family. Any thoughts on lying?

[vegaschristina]

Originally Posted by pandatj

Any thoughts on lying?

A large stick? (Just kidding) I'm trying to get my 4 year old to stop. You figure it out, please let me know

[jbee]

can i borrow the stick when your'e done?
go with your gut. sounds fishy and a bad idea.

[aedems]

Just a quick thing that I do with my own kids if I "catch" them in a lie. It is usually the typical kid stuff, but could work in a lot of situations. Ex. I see one of the kids take a piece of candy out of the jar, even after I have given them specific instructions of no candy. I then ask "A, did you take a piece of candy out of the jar" (this is usually of course while they are still chomping on it). The child says "No". I then tell them that they have 2 minutes to come and tell me the truth. If they do not, they will not only get punished for eating a piece of candy when they were told not to, but also they will get doubly punished for lying about it. It usually works and then we have a long discussion about how it is very hurtful to lie to someone and that is why you get punished. The punishment for eating candy is usually no candy for how ever many days. The punishment for lying is usually something being taken away that they like (TV, music, etc.) You have to catch them in the lie for this to work though. They get tons of praise though for telling the truth and I thank them for telling me the truth, though they still get punished for whatever the deed was that they did, but not for lying if they decide to tell the truth. Who is on first?

[pandatj]

aedems- That sounds like something, we have NEVER tried... I will try it tonight,... And let you know how it goes.

Thank you!!!

[pandatj]

So, I tried that two minute deal. And sure enough she told the truth, but will that get her to stop lying? huh? I think after a while I will change it to 1 min. Then 30 sec.... I will work on changing her behavior. I made a deal with my self last night. I am not going to get upset when she lies any more.

[aedems]

Oh absolutely no emotion can be shown, except to state the facts and that lying is hurtful. There actually should be no emotion involved (though I know it is difficult) with punishment anyway. I do not know your FC/SC background, but think about why she is lying to you. Most likely, as little kids do, she did something "bad". If she was abused because she did something "wrong", it was probably loud and hurtful and a lot of other adjectives. So, she start lying and therefore she didn't get in trouble. It was her defense mechanism, although probably didn't always work, but maybe it did some of the time. Keep the emotion out of it. State the punishment and follow through with it. I would leave it at 2 minutes or whatever set time you decide. If you decrease it, she may take that as a power struggle and in the end really what do you have to up the ante to? This also gives her some time to think about it and process what she is doing and hopefully learn to just tell the truth the first time, saving herself the two minutes and the subsequent punishment to follow.

If she is starting to do better and you know she has done something wrong, ask her if she has anything to tell you regarding (example) who ate a piece of candy out of the jar. Tell her not to answer you right away, but to come talk to you in a few minutes. That way, the lying hasn't even happened, but she can use some of the lessons she has learned and hopefully tell you the truth the first time. This will take some time though. She needs to learn that when she does something wrong, which all kids do, that the punishment will be fair, but done lovingly. She is waiting for the abuse again, because in their eyes that is the "norm" for them.

I am glad it worked for you and I hope it continues to. Good luck and keep me updated!!

[pandatj]

Sounds GREAT... I will try it and let you all know how it goes...

Thanks!!!!

[jennymac527]

I think your instincts are right on! You've been extremely gracious and I agree that they can visit the girls in your hometown and start to develop a relationship on your terms. You need to keep your focus on the kids, regardless of the pressure you may feel from Bmom and Bgrandmom. There is no excuse in this day and age with email that the Bmom can't keep contact daily/weekly if it were that important to her. I lost contact with my Bdad when I was young and there are terrible feelings of rejection and anger that develop, but those kids will remember you putting them first, and supporting their feelings. Good Luck!