[Withay]

Here is another update from Friday evening.

Sect Children to Remain in Custody

Judge: Sect children to remain in custody - Crime & courts - MSNBC.com

[Mommytinkerbell]

One of our fkid's caseworker was sent there to help with all the work they are doing to possibly identify each child and who is who, as well as who are sibs, etc. She said she'll be gone til the end of the month, and I spoke with her near the 15th of April. We are near Houston and they are sending lots of cws from here. We said we have two spots for school age kids as well, not sure if they'll need us yet.

I told them I didn't want to take any babies from there bc we really want to adopt and I'm sure these cases will not only drag on a long time but I believe many of the mothers, if they leave the compound and do services, can get them back. (IF they even do bring them into real state custody. That hasn't been decided yet right?)

[msgypsylee]

I know this won't happen but the moms and kids should be moved together. These women grew up in this environment and this is their norm. Many of them were probably "married" at an early age too. To minimize the trauma they should keep the mom's and kids together and try to help them as a group. I think the Mom's are willing to do anything they have to to keep their kids. Given the opportunity to live a different life might be something they are interested in. But the abuse can not be ignored.

So sad

[Mommytinkerbell]

Ooooh I like that idea! I wish the moms could go too. I bet many would want to as well. Let me ask this of you all too.. If an Amish girl called in the same abuse, would they remove all the Amish children from their parents????? My guess is absolutely not. But because they aren't polygamists??? Probably. So basically we are removing their kids because they are polygamists. Then why didn't we remove before now? And if they remove all these kids from this compound, and we know that we could easily find all the other compounds in the US, why not go remove all the kids from those too, based mostly on our opinions of how life 'must' be for them? Or because it's against the law to practice polygamy? Again, if that's the case, people have known this particular sect was moving there in 2005, I read an article yesterday online about how the Texas town wasn't sure it wanted these people to move there, etc. Why not take their kids away back then? Also, the teenage girl who called said her husband, a 50 yr old man, raped and beat her. Then ok, maybe remove teenaged married girls?? Investigate their cases to see if any are being abused but every single child, newborn to 18? Male and female? On what grounds??? I'm just trying to make sense of all this mess. I don't know what to think really.

[dtmckel]

Just wanted to share my thoughts on this. I live in Texas, about 3 hours from El Dorado where the "Ranch" is located. First, to explain why they have not went in before now, they had to have a GOOD reason to go onto the private property and the phone call from the girl was enough to allow them to go in. Even though many thought they were breaking the law in many areas, they could not just go on the property.
As for the women, I do not think that they really feel like they are doing anything wrong by letting the young girls (as young as 13) get spiritually married and have babies with men who could possibly be their uncle or even father. They had a choice to either go back to the ranch or go to a safe house and only a very few chose the safe house (which would have been closer to their children). The state have to protect the children FIRST and foremost. I really feel like the women would take the children right back to the ranch if given any opportunity. This is the only life they know and they feel as though they are living the life that will get them to heaven. There is so much to this and even the babies are at risk of abuse. If you listen to the women, they are programmed to all say the same things. It is sad but the state has the responsibility of protecting the children.
The way that I look at this is, if the state goes into a home and finds that a child is being abused, they remove all the children of that home. The ranch is like one big home. They are all related and they really do not even know who their biological parents are.
I stand behind the state for doing their job. These children need the chance to make choices and break the cycles that are occurring.
They are breaking the Texas laws but the children need to be the top priority. I am sure that there will be charges brought against some of the men and possibly even some of the women.
I think we all need to pray for the children, the parents and the state so that the right decisions and actions can be made!

[Mommytinkerbell]

That makes sense, dtmckel. I was watching Nancy Grace a few minutes ago and it was showing the inside of their homes, etc. One woman mentioned that there were no toys, etc. I didn't see any either. Another woman who lived there previously, or within that type community, was saying that they stopped having birth certificates when older men were getting prosecuted for impregnating teens. It's so sad, all of it.

[Suziebearhugs]

I don't know how I feel about it either.

That is A LOT of children displaced from their families. Based on what could be considered religious discrimination.

Then again it is NOT ok for 50+ year old men to be having sex with 12-13 year old girls. Wether they "believe" they are married or not..."legally" they are not and it is a crime, wether the young woman consents or not.

[MomwithFive]

How sad for all these children.

[tinatyme]

This is incredibly sad and there will be no clean resolution to this case. The reality is that this is a sexual predator's dream. While we know of the sexual abuse of the teenage girls because they got pregnant I'm sure there are other abuses going on. If there was sexual abuse happening to the smaller children and/or the young boys it would be hidden within the community and no one would report it because of fear of recriminations and their indoctrination from birth about obedience. That is not a healthy environment for any child and the state should step in. They were breaking the law and they were abusing their children. They all live in the same household, intermarry, and discipline together so all of the children needed to be removed.

As happens all over the United States, if they would like to get their children returned to them they need to follow a caseplan that addresses the abuse, clear any criminal charges, and prove that they won't engage in those behaviors in the future. If they can't do that then their children should have a chance at a future with an adoptive family.

[Forever_family]

"As happens all over the United States, if they would like to get their children returned to them they need to follow a caseplan that addresses the abuse, clear any criminal charges, and prove that they won't engage in those behaviors in the future. If they can't do that then their children should have a chance at a future with an adoptive family."

Exactly! Its sad, but I do feel there was reason for the removal. There are things that we don't know or the kids would have been returned by now.

My mom, my dad, my Grandmother met the "Prophet" of this "church"/cult back in the 80's. He was my Granmother's uncle. They are taught to lie, they are brainwashed, they openly convert people to their "church". If a pedophile decided to join this group this would be the ideal situation for them. I have heard of young men from this group who were molested, nothing was done. Who would do anything about it? They have no contact with the outside world. I can't imagine the abuse that has gone on for the most part unseen. Its time something is done. I feel sad for the displaced children and the young mothers, however, they have continually broken the law by allowing their daughters to be raped by old men and hiding behind religion as the reason it is done.

[FullQuiverMamma]

Originally Posted by dtmckel

I think we all need to pray for the children, the parents and the state so that the right decisions and actions can be made!

That is about all we can do and it is a mighty powerful tool...

[Suziebearhugs]

Anyone watch the Dr. Phil show today?

All I can say is WOW! Gave me a whole new perspective. A lot more abuse, brainwashing,fear/intimidation tactics,etc, than I ever imagined.

[chickymum]

I am with the state. What kind of 50 or 40 or 30 or even 20 year old man feels that he needs to marry someone who is 13! It is very rare that an adult male would actually enjoy the companionship of a child in a husband/wife relationship except in one reguard. And that makes me feel sick to think of.

[hkolln]

I have the book written by that one girl about her life on a FLDS ranch...and I thought it was very good. She eventually escaped from there but not after alot of abuse on the hands of alot of people.

It is so sad that they truely believe what they are doing is right. And taking the kids has NOTHING to do with religion...it has to do with protecting those kids from abuse and neglect. It doesn't matter what religion you may have it is illegal to have sex with a child! It's sick and disgusting...and immoral.

It's going to be very hard for those kids to adjust to the "real" world. They are so brainwashed into thinking the outsiders are the terrible people it will be a very hard adjustment. All we can do is pray for them.

[Mommytinkerbell]

It is very, very sad. I heard they are moving them now to several shelters near us in the Houston area. Someone said they heard they won't allow them TV or red meat, etc in these shelters. Usually they don't ask a person's preferences when they come into care. I wonder if they'll always stay in shelters, and continue to eat their own diets, etc.. Doesn't seem good for them to always stay at shelters (would be like an orphanage, institution) because if they ever get adopted they won't be used to how we all live, family life more like we all live, even though foster care would be an adjustment, it seems they'll need it eventually.

I'm glad the kids are safe now. I just wonder if they know now that the call was bogus, so now they are basing it on 'underage marriage/child abuse', etc. then they'd have to remove all the kids in all the sects everywhere here. If not, then all it takes is another bogus call to 'help them get in the door?' Then people will start doing that too. I think maybe we should take all of them from all of them and stop it now. There will be no real changes at the other places until it's stopped altogether there too, right? (I know they have to have 'reason', but that came pretty easy this time with the call that was made.) What do you all think about all that?