[Navy_RP_Wife]

On November 14th, we had our first foster children placed with us. We knew about 4 days in advance that they were coming. So we took our 9 year old bio son and went shopping. We got the things that we would need to for these kids. Our fd is 6 and her brother is almost 4. Their history is fairly common yet heartbreaking too: bd in jail, mom addicted to crystal-meth, alcohol, etc. She's prosituted (fd told me she was glad I didn't ear high heels because that meant I was going out to do something bad), has been homeless with the kids. This is the 3rd time they are trying to reunify the family, which hubby and I do not agree with. When the kids were removed the 3rd time from her she stated her reason for relapse is because "its to stressful to parent both of the kids". Based on the Christmas gifts they recieved, its safe to say she favors her daughter, not her son. Anyways, our fd M, is "parentified" they say, she was the caretaker for both her brother B and mom. M is getting alot better is flourishing here, we tell her that her only job here is to learn to be a little girl. B on the other hand will drive you past the brink of insanity!! B doesn't seem to be attached to anyone but his sister, though he tells us he loves us all the time. He refuses to follow the rules or do what he is told. B spends alot of time in time out. When he does something wrong you ask him what he did and he can tell you exactly what he did wrong and he did it "because he wanted to." Now he has taken to urinating himself in the mornings because he is to lazy or tired to get out of bed, his excuses not mine. There is suspicion that he is a drug exposed baby. In this little boy's short life, he has either been left in the care of his sister (they were left home alone alot), dumped on others or with a family friend or in foster care. These children want to go home to mom, but tell us at the same time they like it here because they love us all, we don't move all the time, we take care of them, there is always enough food to eat, etc etc They were placed in foster care right before M's 6th birthday and she was wearing a size 3/4, she is now in a 7/8! We have little struggles with M, but B will bring us to tears because it seems we can not get him to mind us. The SW said she has seen alot of improvement in B, not to get discouraged. Any ideas what to do with him?

Thanks you and God bless!

[5dogz]

I'd sure put him in a pull-up at night and avoid any kind of struggle about potty-training! With everything going on in this child's life it's not surprising he's trying for some measure of control. I remember a presenter in a class I took who said, "when children can't control anything else in their lives they will often resort to controlling what goes into their bodies and what comes out!" They have only been with you a few weeks and who knows what kind of chaos they've suffered, or worse? At his age he doesn't have the sophisticated language skills to really express what he is feeling. Just try to avoid getting into a power struggle over something you can't control (you really can't control whether he chooses to urinate or not!) and realize there are reasons for his behavior and he probably cannot tell you what they are. Try to convey that he is loved and wanted in your home. From everything you've said, I'm sure this is going to take awhile!

[madfostermomma]

I'd try to get counseling. I am dealing with 2 boys ages 2 and 4 who have moved about 4 times plus been in respite care numerous times while living with previous foster family. My 4 yr old has some anger management issues we are dealing with and I have a counselor coming out in 2 weeks to start therapy- not only for him but for us to learn how to handle this. He is cognitively delayed and a fost-adopt placement so I need some skills if we do adopt and I am going to survive until 18.

I think sometimes everyone focuses on getting the children help but they don't think to get themselves help as well.

Give yourself plenty of hugs and hang in there- I'm going to tell you what everyone tells me - it will get better.

[Kate1129]

My fs was the same way. He was 3 1/2 when he came to us (he's now almost 5). He would wet himself. It was more of a control thing. he did it on purpose. So we just wears pull ups. He's now past it. It does get better! The best thing I found was to ignore it. If he can see it bothers you, he will continue to do it.

As for the time outs. Well I had to institiute time INS. When he was in trouble he had to be with me for an amount of time. I usually wear jeans. So he had to hold onto my belt loop. Everywhere I went he went. It was a pain for me and it was a real pain for him. But it has worked. He hated to just stand there and hold my belt loop while I took MY TIME to wash dishes or fold laundry.

Now when I can see he's getting overwhelmed and may start to act out I need only ask him "Do you need to stand with mommy for a mintue". Sometimes he says no and sometimes he says "Yes, for a minute".

It just takes time. I know what it's like, been there! I found the other thing that made a huge difference is that when he did something he KNEW was wrong, I made sure to look at him and smile and tell him he's in trouble. If he seen that it made me upset, he'd do it all the more. It's best to react the opposite of what you are feeling or with no emotion at all.

I HIGHLY reccomend reading up on Nancy Thomas! She's got some great things about attachement. She has a website and books out there.

[crick]

Kate has a good point with using a "time in" rather than a time out. He might do better with time in with you rather than being sent off to the corner etc. by himself. You might try sitting on the floor with him between your legs or sitting on the couch holding him. If he fights too much, you might make the rule that he has to sit next to you but not on you. Point is that he has to be with you and not away from you. In his mind, he might be thinking, "if I do this, then she'll push me away and I don't have to get close to her. She doesn't love me so I don't have to love her". A time in can start showing him that even when he does the wrong thing, you are not going to push him away.

You might also find time to do more attachment and bonding activities with him. Like holding him while he drinks out of his sippy cup, rocking him, laying with him before bedtime and forcing the eye contact, even if it's just for a minute.

And just me personally, I would make sure that you meet all of his needs right now. Do not let his older sister get him anything, even a toy. Or help him get dressed etc. This will help both of the children...let her be the child she needs to be and help him learn that it is a parent's job to take care of him. Right now he doesn't know that because his parents didn't do it for him.

Hang in there!

[Lorraine123]

I have nothing new to add, just agree with the previous posters.

Crick is right in that you need to meet ALL his needs. His sister should not be meeting any of them. This teaches her to be a child and him to rely on adults. Parentified children are very unhealthy. Also, you say he is attached to her, but it could be an unhealthy attachment and you need to break it.

As for the bed wetting, I would just do pull ups. He has had so much change in such a short time, that this battle isn't one to engage in. The problem may go away on its own, but if not, you can face it later.

I also agree with Time Ins. When a child is traumatized, the last thing you want to do is send them away. Time outs show them that they need to deal with their issues on their own. Instead, you need to teach him that you will be there helping him deal with it, no matter what. His bad behavior may escalate when you start using time ins, but thats ok. He isn't used to an adult be there when he is in pain. He will take a while for him to learn to accept that.

Get therapy. You need to find a therapist who is familiar with attachment therapy. The therapist needs to know how to work with tramautized children. Regular therapy will do more harm than good.

Good luck.

[cb131]

My kids are 4 s& 3r S was the mommy & we had to practically use a crow bar to individualize them It is okay but my problem is them playing together.I mean kids have to play but I listen constenetly for the bossy s to start telling r how to behave Now I am seperating them after 3 warnings to her. So then she is to play alone anywhere she wants for 30 min.She will actually do NOTHING at all alone.She will really try too.I give her ideas like logos or doll or playdough etc.But alone.She cannot stop herself from mommie look or Sh look nothing is worth it unless someone sees or watches.I do not know how to help her.We are beginning therepy & all but we have not gotten consistent.

[crick]

cb - don't know if this will help but I have scheduled days or at least a few hours of the day where my kids get to be "Ruler". Meaning they get to choose the games, choose the songs in the car, gets to be my helper in the kitchen etc. I have found this helps build up their esteem a bit and gives the boys more control to say "no" to their sister who likes to be the boss. It also teaches her that she is not in control over her brothers and also has to listen and play their games etc. Granted I have overruling power etc., but when they are playing amongst themselves, I needed a way to stop my dd from taking charge all the time. For us it has helped a lot.

Another thing I do with dd is if it isn't her turn to be in charge and she bosses anyway, then she owes her brother a chore or a favor. This can be anything from picking up their toys to drawing them a picture etc.

You also might try giving her a specific task to do for play time to help get her more comfortable playing alone. Instead of just giving her playdough, give her the playdough and also tell her to make a flower, or whatever you think she might like to make. Hopefully soon her imagination will take over, but it might help to give her absolute tasks for awhile.

[locoenlacabeza]

We have dealt with similar issues with our fs. Only he is the older of the two, but was very much shoved away as the lesser child in the bio home.
He was very detached from everyone and everything. There was no life in his eyes and nothing in his soul or so we thought.
We were pulling our hair out because nothing we did mattered to this kid. Time outs didn't work, time in's didn't work. NOTHING WORKED!
Finally one day things had escalated to a point that we were literally at our wits end. My husband was dealing with the latest outburst at the time. He and our fs were in the bathroom washing his face from crying, and my husband just looked at him and said "you know what R no matter what you do, no matter how naughty you are I am always going to love you." At that point something in that child clicked, and they made a connection. No it wasn't huge, but it was something to build on. I then learned that I needed to make that same statement to him as well. R still needs constant reassurance that he will be loved no matter what, and he still tests the waters. He probably always will. But the fact of the matter was at that point we got through.
Just keep reassuring your fs that he is safe and loved. I am willing to bet that he is testing you.

[TexasJingles]

Great advice from a lot of people. I've learned a lot from Nancy Thomas when it comes to helping my kids attach. I've seen a HUGE difference in T (my 8 yr old that acts about 3 or 4) as well as J (the eldest at 11, but he also acts about 4 at times) in the past 3 weeks of me using some of NT's techniques.

I just wanted to add that the best reading I've done (so far) on Nancy Thomas came from some on-line training I did for my foster CE's. I'm sure her books have the same materials (this was from a conference she gave), but I don't have the books yet and I got 8 hours of credit to do it! (didn't take me that long to read it).

Hang in there! We've had our 3 for over a year and we still have our days where dh and I pull our hair out. In the end, these kids are so worth it! They just don't know how to do some very basic things (you'd think they would, but nope!...no one taught them, or the caretaker didn't know how either!).

[Navy_RP_Wife]

Mahalo for all of the great advice. As I sat here reading all of the responses, I got to thinking to myself. When B, the 3 year, gets into so much trouble, I will tell him he is not able to play in is room he shares with our bio son,K, and his sister, M. We moved his toy box into the dining room and he has to play in the living room where I can see him at all times ( we live in a small 1 story house). These are the times that he is the best. Based on this prehaps the time ins would work better for him. so I will give this a try. When speaking with the kids worker, she told me he was just potty trained in May when they were put into the system AGAIN, so he is still new to pottying. We try very hard to not let M or K do for B, that we get what he needs or wants, but simply, 3 kids run us ragged and sometimes it just happens. But M is realizing she needs to stop, that it is not healthy for her. We remind her all the time that her job in our home is to be a kid and she is learning that very well. The counselor told us it is a small miracle M is making improvements that can be seen! Which made us feel so happy!! M told the counselor that when mom would leave them alone she would cry because she was scared but that B never cried. Probably because the one constant person for him was M. As for B, he told us to hang in there it will happen for him too. We have discover that B thinks if he is naughty we will call the worker to send them someplace else and he thinks it will be with mom, not another fh. So we tell him all the time that we love him and when mommy is better thats when they can go home but that they will be staying with us until then. Eventually he will believe us. Sometimes, I just feel like I could sit down and cry other the things that these kids have seen and experienced and other times I want to scream at the state for even thinking about sending these kids home again!! The reason mom gave for her relapse is because "it is too stressful to parents these kids." From what M tells us, confirmed by the worker, mom terrorized these kids about fh and the police. She was leaving the kids alone to go clubbing or whatever and told M if she called the police they would take her and B away and put them in a fh again where they would be beaten, never see her )mom) again, mom would go to jail, etc.

These two our first placements and are just breaking our hearts! I do not understand what this state is thinking to even consider sending them home again. But they say mom is treating this time around completely different and admitted that she was not ready for her kids to come home yet. Please pray for these kids, that their situation will be resolved in a manner that is best for them.

Mahalo!