[Rubi]

Hi, I've got a strong willed son, aged 5yr....I've been struggling this last week (more than before...)handling him. I have tried all kinds of diccipline: Time out, spanking, talking, taking away things, loving, hugging....with out much success....For example yesterday I asked him not to walk on the ironing board that was lying on the floor...He then just walks on it and gives it a little extra jump...Or I ask him not to walk on the clean wet floor, then he deliberitly walks on the floor and smeers his dirty shoes on the clean floor...I ask him not to yell at his little brother, then he screams harder...I can carry on and on....Sometimes he will scream and say that he will NEVER EVER listen to me.....This breaks my heart!

Luckily he does show remorse afterwords...some times....And he is a well behaved 'angle' at school. The swimming instructor yesterday even called my to say what a special wonderfull jewel of a child I've got! This makes me feel more guilty and wondering 'what am I doing wrong' to aggrivate this behavior?

Does any of you have suggestions how to handle this behavior?

Thanx

[cborsa7]

For example yesterday I asked him not to walk on the ironing board that was lying on the floor...He then just walks on it and gives it a little extra jump...Or I ask him not to walk on the clean wet floor, then he deliberitly walks on the floor and smeers his dirty shoes on the clean floor...I ask him not to yell at his little brother, then he screams harder...I can carry on and on....Sometimes he will scream and say that he will NEVER EVER listen to me

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What did you do when this happened? It's difficult to understand the problem without knowing all the particulars. I do recommend a book called 123 magic though. Hope you find something that will work for you soon.

[Rubi]

What I did...I asked him to please not do it or I will punish him by not letting him go to his swimming lesson....But then he already did it....He did listen but will just say...agh it doesn't matter....

[Biblemom]

I have two of these children so feel for you! One is bio (and just like I was as a child) and the other is my fs who has RAD. He is a terror at home and angel in public - classic RAD. Good news is that when they are older they are less likely to 'follow the crowd' and give into peer pressure because they do their own thing and follow their own set of rules. Instill the morals/values now and it will payoff later in his life. I just keep telling myself that I was like this as a child and lived to tell about it...

[lucyjoy]

Can you rephrase what you are saying? "If you want to go to bed early, go ahead and walk on the clean floor." If he walks on it, off to bed early-no bargaining or exceptions no matter what he misses.

Or, say nothing and hand him cleaning supplies to reclean the floor when he walks on it. If it takes him 4 hours and 3 tantrums, bummer.

If missing swim practice is a stated consequence, he MUST miss the practice for choosing the action. If it bothers YOU to use this as a consequence, don't but never SAY it will happen unless it will.

Parenting with Love and Logic is a wonderful parenting tool for helping kids learn to make choices. There is 123 magic for birth to age six, parenting with love and logic covers 2-12, and then there is a teen book.

Whenever possible, give two choices that work for you and let him choose. It helps keep the defiance down sometimes.

Statements that he will never listen to you can be either ignored or replied to with, "I wonder how that will work out for you?" in a calm tone.

The fact that he does well in public and poorly with you isn't about your parenting. It is either normal kid who figures you're his mom and have to put up with him, or it could be an attachment disorder/issue behavior.

The less reaction he gets out of you, the better. He needs to suffer the consequences without getting the pizazz for the behavior.

[JGarrick]

Originally Posted by lucyjoy

If missing swim practice is a stated consequence, he MUST miss the practice for choosing the action. If it bothers YOU to use this as a consequence, don't but never SAY it will happen unless it will.

I couldn't agree with this more. Never threaten a punishment you're not willing to carry out. That's a prescription for being routinely ignored. I think many of us are guilty of this from time to time, but it's worth the effort to try to be vigilant even if we're not perfect.

[qs mom]

never mention something you aren't willing to follow through on.

I went to a creative parenting seminar. I think that is what it was called. It was quite interesting, in that the instructor said "what is it with ASKING kids to do things? and ASKING them PLEASE?" Part of being in a family and in being in society is doing what you are told. His premise was to mention the good things your kids do.

He said that we all have a 'love cup' and it needs to be filled. When it is full, we don't get as easily frustrated or angry.

It really is simple and sounds kind of stupid. But it has helped with my son a lot. I'll tell him -

Hey! I noticed you fed the dog. Good job. Thanks.
I noticed that you remember your manners. That's very nice of you.
I noticed you put on CLEAN socks (a issue at my house).

All of that noticing makes him feel good. Gives him value. So, when he gets upset, he's feeling good about himself and doesn't want to feel bad about himself.

Just a thought.

[cborsa7]

What I did...I asked him to please not do it or I will punish him by not letting him go to his swimming lesson....But then he already did it....He did listen but will just say...agh it doesn't matter....
Reply With Quote

The absolute key with discipline is following through with what you say. I can't tell enough by what you posted but it may be that you are not being firm about the consequence. You also have to find what really matters to your child. There WILL be something, TV, favorite toy, etc. Again, I recommend the book 1-2-3 Magic, but be sure to stay consistent and follow through or you'll be wasting your time.

Good Luck!

[qs mom]

"You also have to find what really matters to your child. There WILL be something, TV, favorite toy"

I just wanted to say that the above is not always true. My son came from an orphange and had nothing that was his own. He was almost 3 when he came home. He remembers it. He may not remember having nothing, but he remembers the feeling. He DOESN'T care about things.

I have in the past take away Boy Scouts, soccer, dance lessons, toys, TV, video games, playtime - he really doesn't care. He's been without before, it doesn't phase him. He'll find something else to do. He has been sent to bed early - so what? He'll play with his fingers and toes - he's picked his toenails til they were bleeding because he didn't want to sleep yet. Spank? He feels no pain. If I had the inclination to beat him senseless, it wouldn't matter, he'd laugh, he doesn't feel pain.

So what's a mom to do? I try to fill up the 'love cup'. It helps him. He has a better self image. He wants to do better. He wants to please. Does he still mis-behave? Sure. But he actually is making better choices and trying not to.

[lucyjoy]

I'm with Q's mom. Many of my kids did not have one thing they cared about. They were use to having things taken away. Control was what they cared about because to them, it effected survival.

[cborsa7]

I just wanted to say that the above is not always true. My son came from an orphange and had nothing that was his own. He was almost 3 when he came home. He remembers it. He may not remember having nothing, but he remembers the feeling. He DOESN'T care about things.

Yes, I agree. In a case where you have a child that cares about nothing, you have a bigger problem than a forum is going to solve and you should seek counseling. If your child has nothing he loves there are obviously issues that need to be dealt with professionally.

[qs mom]

I didn't say that he didn't love. He doesn't CARE about THINGS. He LOVES people. But, I'm not going to take away his grandmother as a punishment.

My son is not RAD. He loves deeply. Is affection on both his terms and mine.

However, he has no attachment to 'things'. 'Things' disappear. They are not, nor have they ever been important. Toys and games are to play with. Guess what? He didn't have toys for 3 years. He can play with a stick or a rock. There's always something to play with. He never even saw a TV until he was 3. So, it's no big deal to take it a way. He understand that soccer, dance and ice skating are a privledge, not a right. Again, always something else to play with.

Just because a kid doesn't have an attachment to a thing, doesn't mean they are severly troubled. It usually means they are resourceful. And as LucyJoy said, controlling.

I can put my son in an empty room. He will entertain himself. He might lace his sneakers, tie them together, stack them up, put them on the wrong feet and walk funny, take the laces out and play with the strings. He WILL dance. He doesn't need toys, games or TV to entertain himself. He's smart, he knows it. So what if you take it away?

And controling - why should a person allow another person to be in control of their happiness? My happiness does not depend upon what someone else is going to let me do.

I was simply pointing out that broad statements are not always true. Kids are very different. All kids - regardless of their beginnings.