[soontobethree]

Our DTC date was March 04 but we still have not received our referral, although most March families received referrals by the end of September. Anyone else out there seem to be under tighter than normal scrutiny?

[KarenInCa]

That is really strange, Ive been told that it's normally down to 5 months now after DTC, but the SWs dont want to admit that, just in case it takes 6. What does your SW or agency say about it? And I'd probably try to track if the docs really were sent at that time or not. Is there something in your documents about you/your family life that might have held up the process after DTC?

[soontobethree]

Originally Posted by KarenInCa

That is really strange, Ive been told that it's normally down to 5 months now after DTC, but the SWs dont want to admit that, just in case it takes 6. What does your SW or agency say about it? And I'd probably try to track if the docs really were sent at that time or not. Is there something in your documents about you/your family life that might have held up the process after DTC?

CCAA has requested two additional documents, one in July and another in October. It could be that they changed our DTC date to be when they received those additional documents.

[KarenInCa]

Most likely, if they added docs in October, your actual DTC was in October. Kind of crazy thought, that they waited till Oct to ask for more docs. Sorry to hear about your delays, it must be really difficult. When I was pregnent with my son I was 2 and a half weeks over due. Every day seemed like a week over due. So Im sure what you are going thru is very similar!

[redat38]

I'm so sorry to hear about this as well, I would agree that your actual DTC is in October as well it is strange that your agency didn't info. you about this.
Have you talked with them about a new DTC date? This at least would give you more of an idea of when your referal would be coming, it is so hard to wait, but if we have an idea in mind of when we'll be with our little one it sometimes makes the wait a little easier.
Here's hoping for some clarity soon,
Jane

[englishyankee]

Do you mind if I ask the docs they requested in July and October?

Happy New Year to all!!

[soontobethree]

The document they requested in July was a "Letter of Unemployment from me." A friend who has adopted through another agency said this is standard, but our agency (fairly inexperienced with China adoptions) says they have never been asked for it before. In October they asked for Hepatitis B test results for my husband and myself. Our agency does not believe that the DTC date would change that drastically but I'm not convinced. Thanks for your encouragement. This is our third international adoption and I guess the first two jsut went too smoothly. God is in control I'm sure! Happy New Year.

[KarenInCa]

Hep shots are not required to travel to China. They are recommended, but NOT required, so that should not have had an influence on your real DTC. Unless your agency decided to wait to get the hep results (for whatever reason) to actually DTC for you.

[soontobethree]

Our agency received (and passed along to us) the LID date in April 2004 so we know the CCAA received our documents. Was Hep test part of your medical exam? Maybe that is the problem, our form did not ask fof it. My suspicion, however, is that they may have changed our date to the date that they (CCAA) received the final documents they requested. We have adopted twice from Vietnam already.

[KarenInCa]

No, Hep B or A are not a part of the med exam. It is merely suggested to get them done. I think you're right that they changed the date. But I have no idea why they would change it based on Hep results, being that its not required documents. Keep us posted.

[redat38]

I know when we had our physicals done for our Dossier we had to have Hep B test done. I guess it depends on the agency and maybe our agency that does deal with China allot is aware that CCAA would be looking at that.
Soontobethree, your right this whole process is in God's hands and it's all in God's timing so when the time is right you'll be in China holding your daughter.
Keep your chin up.
Happy New Year,
Jane

[soontobethree]

Thanks for the reminder Jane.

[sak9645]

It seems as if your agency is not communicating well with you, and may have made some errors.

First off, when your paperwork first went to China, your agency should have put you in touch with other members of your dossier/travel group. Most agencies encourage families who will likely be traveling together to get to know each other in advance. You would then know when other members of the group got their referrals (if they did), and would be able to ask your agency why you did not get yours at the same time. China will tell your agency if a referral is not going to be made on schedule.

Second, it appears that your agency sent an incomplete dossier on you. As an example, there is a specific form your doctor must fill out for China. One of the tests on it, which must be reported as positive or negative, is the Hep. B test. If your agency sent the wrong form, and it did not call for the Hep. B test, your dossier would be flagged in the review room at the China Center for Adoption Affairs.

I'm not sure what a Letter of Unemployment is, but if both parents don't work, yet have more than enough income from investments, the homestudy would need to cover this, and the financial statement sent to China would also document this. If it did not do so adequately, your dossier would also be flagged in the review room.

If the agency sends an incomplete dossier on a person, it is quite likely that a person's paperwork would actually be "kicked out" of the dossier group in the China Center for Adoption Affairs review room, and set aside until all items are in. If, indeed, China told your agency that your dossier was incomplete and that you were being kicked out of your dossier group, you should have been informed.

And once the new paperwork was sent, your agency should have checked with China to see whether you were going to be given a referral with your original group, separately from any other group submitted by your agency, or with a later group.

You need to call your agency, and ask to speak to the Executive Director. Tell him/her that you are concerned because your dossier group all got referrals and you didn't. Ask what the CCAA said when it asked for the financial and medical information. As an example, did it say you would get a referral with your group if the information came in promptly? Did it say you would get a referral separately from any group? Did it say that you would get a referral with another group of dossiers sent by your agency? Did it say there was a chance that you would not get a referral at all?

You deserve to know what is going on, and your agency should be able to tell you. If it doesn't know, it should ask its contact person at the CCAA.

Sharon

[soontobethree]

We are working with a very small agency and there were no other dossier's sent in with ours so the dossier group does not exist.

The form that our agency uses for medical does not have a place for hep blood results and other families before and after ours have processed along fine without the standard CCAA Med form. I'm beginning to find that the process is not as regimented as I thought, meaning that the same things are not required all the time. I guess more than being just a big "machine" the CCAA is a group of people just like you and me and with people come inconsistencies and subjective judgements. The bigger agencies that cross every t and dot every i, have everything covered just in case and I think that is why their adoptions run more smoothly.

Our agency requested a status update from CCAA but has not receied it yet. The letter of "unemployment" is a letter written by me and notarized, stating that I am unemployed but that my husband's income is sufficient. This form is now required I think and is relatively new on the requirement list. My unemployment and my husban'ds income was covered in financial reports and home study. Our agency has not had anyone denied by China before, but it seems there are lots of preculiarities with our situation.

As I mentioned in a previous post, I know that God is in control and there is a perfect time table. I was just curious whether any other families were having similar issues. I'm very thankful this is not our first international adoption. It's much easier to wait for the third than it was the first (my opinion.)

[sak9645]

A couple more thoughts:

I know that hindsight is always 20/20, but anyone contemplating adoption should check out agencies very carefully, before signing on. This is true even when working with a country where everything is well-organized and stable, like China.

One of the most important things a family should seek is experience. If the agency, itself, isn't long experienced with China, it should have an Executive Director or China program coordinator who comes from another agency where he/she had substantial China experience. There is simply very little excuse for an agency making a mistake on the dossier requirements for China, as they are very straightforward. And the CCAA is very receptive to agencies who have questions.

References from families who have used the agency in the recent past for a China adoption should also be checked carefully. These references may include families whose names were supplied by the agency, itself. However, do remember that these are probably the agency's most satisfied clients. It is important to get a better sample by asking folks in one's local adoption support group, or by going on-line to a group like this one, A-Parents-China (which has over 10,000 members), etc. A person should, however, request that comments come to him/her by private e-mail and not on the public forum.

And when references are checked, it is important to have very specific questions that speak to the potential applicant's actual situation. As an example, a person who has a disability may want to know whether the agency advocated well for someone else like him/her. A person who has never gone overseas and who is really worried about the travel, should ask about the degree of "hand-holding" that the agency did for families while they were in China, and so on.

Questions about mistakes can be very telling. As I said before, there really is little excuse for an agency sending an incomplete dossier to China. The agency should know China's requirements and review dossiers meticulously for compliance.

If a reference reports that China held up his/her dossier because a certain document that is normally needed was missing or in the wrong format, that should be a red flag. There is also little excuse for an agency sending a person to China, only to find, when he/she arrives at the Consulate that his/her USCIS clearance has expired and that he/she will have to stay extra days in Guangzhou while a new one is rushed through.

However, if an agency commits an oversight -- and even the best agency may make one on a very rare occasion -- it should IMMEDIATELY notify the family, and make every effort to resolve the problem quickly and at little or no extra charge.

Sharon