[DrAmanda]

I hope this is OK to post here. I am just wondering want some other firstmoms/birthmoms think regarding this scenario. Say you did a private open adoption. Did you still hold out hope that your birth child would come back to you somehow? Would you ever say things like this to his/her a-parents?

[Jillie_sweetheart]

Amanda,

I am always going to wish Monkey man were here with me. I am always going to wish there was a way that he could come back to me.

I know it's not realistic and I know it will never happen but sometimes it is irrational thoughts just like that, that allow you to keep putting one foot in front of the other.

I wouldn't say that in front of aparents but that is just because I don't want them to feel like I am a threat. From what I know you are still very early in your adoption. She is still grieving and just trying to move forward. I don't even know that I would address it. I think if you need something you could acknowledge how much this must hurt her. It's more wishful thinking or at least it is in my case.

[JustPeachy]

Originally Posted by DrAmanda

I hope this is OK to post here. I am just wondering want some other firstmoms/birthmoms think regarding this scenario. Say you did a private open adoption. Did you still hold out hope that your birth child would come back to you somehow? Would you ever say things like this to his/her a-parents?

I didn't have an OA, but I thought I'd reply anyway. I'm not sure what you mean by a birth mother holding out hope that her child would come back to her somehow. Are you saying that your child's birth mom tells you she wants him back and regrets her decision? Or that she hopes he will return to her once he is grown or as he gets older, as if you are just filling in a temporary spot in your child's life? Or does she mean she would like for your/her child to be part of her life always? That he would relate to her as a mother too?

Like Jillie indicated, I always wished I could have raised my son and hoped he'd be back in my life someday. We are reunited now. I knew I could not get my son back once I signed papers, and would not even want to do that, however, there is always that longing to be with your child and want him or her in your life. I think it is hard for anyone who has not experienced this to fully comprehend. Before I had my son and experienced pregnancy and birth, I could not understand it, either. I thought because I was planning for adoption and had reasoned it all out in my mind, it would be relatively easy, and while I would miss my son, it would be more along the lines of losing an old friend that you might think of fondly from time to time. How naive I was! It is so hard to put into words the strength of the bond between a natural mother and child. Relinquishing a child does not at all change that bond. You will always want your child and hope somehow that they will be part of your life.

If I had an OA, I don't think I would have expressed that to my son's mother for fear that if I "said the wrong thing," it would have negative consequences. Even in a semi-open, I would not have expressed the longing I had to be with my child. I might say I missed him so much but know I made the best decision, or something along those lines. If, however, as I got to know her, I felt I could trust telling her these deep feelings, I think I would. The thing is, given the power differential in OA and semi-OA, there is always that fear that you will say or do the wrong thing, which could potentially result in being cut off. Sometimes it's just too big a risk to take and that fear is so very strong. I know when I would send updates, I did a lot of "tiptoeing around" because I just did not have enough information about my son's parents to know what might upset them and what wouldn't. It's a tough balancing act. I'm sure they had similar confusion about how to relate to me.

Could you clarify what you child's birth mother said? And is it something you find upsetting or threatening? If she is expressing to you similar things as what I and Jilly have experssed, I think it is wonderful that she feels so comfortable with you that she can open up like that. I can see where it might feel threatening to hear those things. If, on the other hand, she is saying things that are way out of line or intentionally hurtful, that is another issue entirely. Without knowing exactly what she has said, it is hard to really give an answer, though.

[DrAmanda]

Well, I tend to not share much about J's birthmom, but I guess I will tell a bit about what she has been saying. It has been a couple things. When we were getting off the phone the other day she said, "I'll let you go so you can take care of my baby." I replied with, "His daddy is taking great care of him while I'm talking to you."

Then earlier this week she told me that she had a dream that we came to visit when J was 3 and he cried so hard because he wanted to stay with her, but he wasn't old enough to make that choice yet. I think she really believes that J will choose to live with them when he is older (I'm not sure what age she has in mind). She kept saying that the dream was so realistic and she just knows it is going to happen like that. FWIW- We have plans to visit next summer (when J is almost 2), and visits will probably only be every other year due to distance and expenses.

I don't want to crush her hopes and dreams, but I want to make sure she understands that that adoption is a forever thing. Yes, we are open and plan to visit in the future, but J will not go to stay with them. We already made that clear while we were there after J was born. Birthdad asked if we would let J come stay with them for the summers when he was older and we said flat out that we would not be comfortable with that at all.

I'm not going to even try to pretend that I understand all of the emotion and heartache that go into placing a child for adoption. I can't imagine the pain. I want to be emotionally supportive of birthmom and dad, but I don't want to pretend that this fantasy of J coming back to live with them is a possibility.

[belleinblue1978]

They need some counseling that isn't from you.

I wish everyday that I wouldn't have been in a situation where I had to make the choice to place Kiddo. Seriously, I don't know a single person that wants that and who doesn't wish it could have been different.

I'm adopted, so that shades how I feel about all of this. I would be absolutely appalled if Kiddo tried to come back to live with us. The only way that would happen is if CPS removed him. If he tried to triangulate us against each other like that there would be a firm, no they are your parents, not me.

Now, that doesn't mean that recently there haven't been comments about a few things that bother me and my DH. Comments that Kiddo's mom has made to me that is and that if he is really a problem we would take him back. That of course is said in jest to help me deal with some crappy stuff that has been said to me. I would never express that to his Mom and Dad though.

[Jillie_sweetheart]

Personally I would talk to the agency and see if the social worker or a counselor could help her work through some of these things.

There should be a way to explain that adoption isn't like when parents split up and that there is no age when he can just decide to live with them.

As for the my baby comment I often will write about my son especially when I am upset. Even though he isn't with me he is still my son in a strange way. I don't say that to his parents because I feel like it would be disrespectful. When I write though I write a lot more about "my son" or "my baby".

From what you have mentioned about J's bmom I do know that there are some memory issues and there and possibly some other mental issues.

[alys1]

I think it's way too soon to expect her to be realistic about it, or to expect her fantasies to disappear. Think her feelings and fantasies are normal. Believe thinking of him as "my baby" is also normal. I'd say "our baby" to her... because in some way, he is the baby of all of you. He has 4 parents, and he always will. The eternal conundrum of adoption.

So given that these feelings are normal, what I suspect is different about her is that she doesn't have a filter in place, doesn't know that the "average" person wouldn't say those things to you. If I remember correctly, she's slow mentally? If so, likely no one is going to change her feelings just by talking to her, she may not have the capacity to comprehend this in the way others would.

In response to: "I'll let you go so you can take care of my baby." I'd say, "Thank you!" Wouldn't try to layer on a lesson in my reply. If she said, "dream that we came to visit when J was 3 and he cried so hard because he wanted to stay with her, but he wasn't old enough to make that choice yet." I'd say, "Wow you are REALLY missing him right now" -- active listening. Reflecting back what she's feeling (missing him but hoping he will come to her.) I'd do reflective listening with her, to the best of my ability, in the same way that comes easily for me with 3 yr olds or 5-year-olds. Maybe an image of her in your mind as 3 or 8 while talking to her?

How she will feel in 2 years or 5 years or 10 years is different. Those will become known... at that time. Likely her fantasies about him won't be as strong. Likely she'll have been a mother again, at least by the 10-year mark.

She is in pain. Let her keep her hopes and dreams. A doc I once read said, "You can't cure everyone, but you can *care* about everyone."

[belleinblue1978]

Ahhhh, I didn't know about the delays, that changes everything.

She is never going to think about this the way you do. Alys is right she also is never going to have a filter about it and she isn't going to understand why you correct her would be my guess.

FWIW, Jillie, it isn't strange that you think of your son as your son, he is your son. I am the daughter of two moms and two dads, so is my son. Heaven help the person that tells me I can't call him mine.

The one thing my Kiddo's mom has always done is always refer to him as our son. I don't know why that stuck with her, but it did.

[DrAmanda]

She is not mentally delayed, but she does have memory problems. I do refer to J as our son. I' ll reply more when I am not on my phone.

[Jillie_sweetheart]

Sorry Amanda I must have misunderstood another post.

Is she getting any sort of therapy? A counselor should be talking with her on things like this. I think letting someone else explain the realities of this birth mother life to her may be best.

[Sunshiny]

I am going to answer your question as openly as I can. I definately hoped my daughter would contact me as an adult. I hoped she would tell me her life as an adopted child was great and hoped to give her information and form some type of family relationship. I never thought I would be in the mother role with her.

Everything changed when she contacted us early and the reality of her adoptive life, divorced parents, custody battles, and emotional abuse surfaced. She was looking for a mother and a family. So of course my thoughts and emotions changed. Life is complicated as are people. Our expectations change when confronted by what is the reality of our situations.