[KarynB]

I'm sorry - I didn't see the part where Jenna said that, my mistake!

Belle - it didn't seem like the answers were making fun, but honestly, yes - the question really hit me funny. I really thought we (adoptive parents) were being mocked. Sorry - I just missed the part in italics at the bottom!

[agathaj]

stronger? No...I'm a birthmother buried deep in the closet and not about to venture out anytime soon.
Tolerant? _ Way, way less tolerant. Mainly because I hear the negative things people think about first mothers as they don't know that I am one and I think they are idiots....
Better? No, more like crippled. Emotionally crippled and often depressed from the loss of my first born child...

[BlackSheep]

Stronger? Well, being an adoptee too, I knew already some of what I might be setting my daughter up for in the way of emotions, but it was the best choice for the circumstances I was in. So, I guess that I did learn to be stronger for making this decision and living with it now for almost 26 years.
Better? It is a part of who I am and not sure that I would be the person I am today without it. Not sure if that makes me better.
More tolerant? I was always more tolerant of others than members in my family. I suppose that I do have more patience than I would otherwise, but I'm not sure that had anything to do with placing my firstborn child. The 2 I raised really helped in that department.

[keds]

Karyn, sorry if you felt that I may have responded to the post for any other reason than I thought others were interested in how I felt/thought about my experience, mine alone. I appreciated the question as so few ask or care. We're all here to support each other - regardless of how we arrived at the table. All the best.

[RavenSong]

Okay, I have to admit that I'm confused. I don't understand how this thread could possibly be considered as "mocking" adoptive parents. From how I read the OP's questions, birthmoms were asked if placing their babies had made them stronger, better, or more tolerant.

Even if Jenna hadn't included the disclaimer in italics at the bottom of her post, why would this thread be seen as mocking APs? I think all three questions are very appropriate for birthmoms to consider and answer. Just because there's another thread on the AP forum asking the same questions doesn't mean there's any mockery on this forum, IMHO.

[lahdh4]

Better: nope
Stronger: heck no
Tolerant: in a way I never wanted to be

[KarynB]

Originally Posted by RavenSong

Okay, I have to admit that I'm confused. I don't understand how this thread could possibly be considered as "mocking" adoptive parents. From how I read the OP's questions, birthmoms were asked if placing their babies had made them stronger, better, or more tolerant.

Even if Jenna hadn't included the disclaimer in italics at the bottom of her post, why would this thread be seen as mocking APs? I think all three questions are very appropriate for birthmoms to consider and answer. Just because there's another thread on the AP forum asking the same questions doesn't mean there's any mockery on this forum, IMHO.

Hey Raven,

I thought that because this thread was posted in the general adoptive parents forum in the exact same words a day previous. I guess it seemed to me a strange question to ask birth moms, and so I honestly thought it was posted more to mock adoptive parents for thinking they are "better, stronger, etc" as a result of their parenting experiences. Again - all of the responses were 100% genuine, I just honestly thought the question was posted as a form of mockery. Totally my mistake (as I have said) but just wanted to clarify - as I have said I learn so much from coming to the birth mothers forums and just reading, but wouldn't be able to do it (for my own emotional welll being) if I thought adoptive parents were made fun of, etc. Hope that clarifies...

[belleinblue1978]

Originally Posted by KarynB

Hey Raven,

I thought that because this thread was posted in the general adoptive parents forum in the exact same words a day previous. I guess it seemed to me a strange question to ask birth moms, and so I honestly thought it was posted more to mock adoptive parents for thinking they are "better, stronger, etc" as a result of their parenting experiences. Again - all of the responses were 100% genuine, I just honestly thought the question was posted as a form of mockery. Totally my mistake (as I have said) but just wanted to clarify - as I have said I learn so much from coming to the birth mothers forums and just reading, but wouldn't be able to do it (for my own emotional welll being) if I thought adoptive parents were made fun of, etc. Hope that clarifies...

Karyn,

I have seen VERY few instances of adoptive parents being mocked, made of fun of, or any of those things on these forums. Sure we discuss let downs and frustrations with our children's adoptive parents, but adoptive parents do the same about us. Just as that should be allowed, so should our conversations.

I'm glad you come here to read. We really aren't out to hurt adoptive parents though. We really just need a place to express our truths.

[KarynB]

Originally Posted by belleinblue1978

Karyn,

I have seen VERY few instances of adoptive parents being mocked, made of fun of, or any of those things on these forums. Sure we discuss let downs and frustrations with our children's adoptive parents, but adoptive parents do the same about us. Just as that should be allowed, so should our conversations.

I'm glad you come here to read. We really aren't out to hurt adoptive parents though. We really just need a place to express our truths.

Absolutely, I totally agree with you. In fact, I have never seen it, which is why I was surprised and wanted to clarify. As I've said, both my boys are adopted internationally so I used to know very little about a birthmothers perspective. I am so happy to have learned so much recently, and of course birth moms should be able to vent frustrations and hurts.

In the past I have stumbled across some very "anti-adoption" websites and they really threw me for a loop. And, again, for my own emotional health, decided I need to steer VERY clear from these sites. So, again, I just wanted to clarify how this post was intended. If it was mocking etc, I just wanted to know so I could stay away from that sort of negativeness.

[SchmennaLeigh]

I usually say/type/write exactly what I mean when I'm writing. And I did this time as well. This thread was not intended as any form of mocking. It struck me as very interesting, both what the adoptive parents had/have written and what we, as birth families, feel with regard to the question. Trixila herself thanked us for our opposite side of the spectrum replies.

I think, quite honestly, this was a fabulous thread full of heartfelt and well-thought out answers just like the adoptive parent thread.

Now that we've got that mess out of the way..

I'm really having a mental battle with myself over better vs. not better. There's SO much loss tied into placement. That loss in my life surely doesn't always feel better. BUT?

Well?

That loss has made me a better daughter. A better friend. A better wife. And a better mother to my children. I am more compassionate towards others plights. I am more aware of how my words affect others. (And I am more cognizant of when my words have hurt others and much more expeditious with my apologies in the post-placement years than I was in the years prior. I'm a stubborn soul, however, and sometimes still get stuck in the "I WILL WAIT FOR YOU TO APOLOGIZE FIRST" mindset. This is something I recognize as one of my deeper flaws.) I could type for eons as to how I am a better mother to my parented children because of that loss (and perhaps I need to sometime soon) but, simply put, I am.

And yet, flip side, placing destroyed my self-confidence. It's taken me years to rebuild to the point that I am today. And, even then, I have times where I am more vulnerable than at other times. While I can usually debate my side and stand strong in my beliefs, opinions and experiences, at other times I feel like that helpless expectant mother and let the words of others cut like knives. I also have become much more reserved, which probably isn't initially a bad thing if you knew the old me, but it has gotten to the point where I hate meeting new people and being in new social situations.

As you can see, I'm still debating with myself.

My worry, of course, and thus the reason for the extended internal debate, is that ... I don't want my daughter to think that her existence worsened my life. And then, at the same time, I don't want her to think that giving her away, to use the archaic terms, was the best thing that happened in my life.

Truth be told, it falls somewhere in the middle. I am neither wholly better nor strictly worse for having placed. I have changed, grown, learned, lost, grieved and, well, here I am.

[lahdh4]

Originally Posted by SchmennaLeigh

My worry, of course, and thus the reason for the extended internal debate, is that ... I don't want my daughter to think that her existence worsened my life. And then, at the same time, I don't want her to think that giving her away, to use the archaic terms, was the best thing that happened in my life.

Truth be told, it falls somewhere in the middle. I am neither wholly better nor strictly worse for having placed. I have changed, grown, learned, lost, grieved and, well, here I am.

I think the same way Jenna. I don't want Supergirl to feel that it was the worst or best thing that happened to me. That is why I am still working on me. My confidence is nothing. I don't have any.
Tolerant: only because I have to try and work on a relationship that is one sided and it has made me less tolerant of everyone else in my life if they cannot make up their minds to something simple (like, what is for dinner)

[thanksgivingmom]

I don't think I'M better, but from the outside it may look like my life is better. I have a place to live. I have a job that doesn't involve pouring beer. I appear to be someone that has their act together. So to many, I may APPEAR better.

But am I? I don't think so. I'm a better liar than ever. I feel like I don't deserve a lot of things (and it doesn't help that I'm occasionally even TOLD that I don't deserve some of them). I'm sadder than I ever was before. Not always sad all day every day, just a dull sadness that's easily reachable. Usually just in my back pocket.

Am I more tolerant? Yes AND no. I think I'm more tolerant of people that are honestly trying. People that are struggling battles that I never really considered. I've seen new perspectives and have a greater understanding of others experiences. From that, I've pushed myself to not have others just teach ME, but to seek out information on my own.

I think I'm less tolerant of some things though....I'm less tolerant of some things that people say. Where I could once say, "Oh, they just don't know..." Now I find that excuse doesn't hold much water sometimes.

To be honest though, I don't think I HAVE to be tolerant of everything. I found a voice through placement - I never saw that happening! And the voice isn't necessarily afraid to be strong and to not put up with what others say.

As for stronger? I don't think I have much of a choice. I have to be stronger to get through this whole thing.

[paigeturner]

\

I’ve been thinking about this thread since Jenna first posted it.

Did placing a child in adoption make me better? Yes and no. It ultimately made me a better mother to my future children. I appreciated every awkward and difficult stage with my daughters. I embraced the terrible twos, the horrible threes, the mouthy tweens and don’t even get me started on the teens. And, I loved it – I loved it, because the loss of my son forced me to see what a privilege and joy being a parent is. With each stage, I’ve thought of my son and wondered if he was putting his parents through similar stress. It also made me a better parent because I felt a need to prove to myself and to my family that I could be a wonderful parent; that I would have been a wonderful parent.

Did placing a child in adoption make me stronger? Absolutely. I believe that all the tough times in my life have made me stronger. Dealing with the loss and grief associated with the placement of my son is ongoing. The grief and loss is ongoing, but not crippling. The worst part for me is the “not knowing”. I don’t know if he was placed with parents that have been good parents to him. Is he a strong, kind man? Is he married with children yet? Is he happy? Is he educated? Is he alive? These questions eat at me.

Did placing a child in adoption make me more tolerant? I don’t think so. Life and experience has made me more tolerant. As I age, I find that I’m way, way more tolerant of those from different backgrounds, ethnic groups, lifestyles and socio-economic standing; but am far less tolerant of ignorance.

Jenna, I also lost self-confidence with the placement of my son. 25-years later, I still struggle a bit with it. I have always felt like I have something to prove to the world. In the long run, it’s benefited my family, at least economically, but underlying all of the success is the thought that I’m “one of those girls” and what would the people around me think if they knew? Funny thought, because most of them do know, but still, it lingers.

[belleinblue1978]

I struggle with my self confidence all the time. Goodness, I was twenty six and I wasn't ready to be a parent, what is wrong with me? I lost my one chance to be a mom, so is someone upstairs saying I never should have been? Was I just a vessel for a couple that couldn't have a child?

I've thought alot too about the whole how do I show my son that I wasn't thrilled to place but not make him feel bad about being born thing. I sometimes feel bad that I was born, it is quite obvious to me, both from what my first brother has told me and her lack of response to me, that M had and has had a hard time and that my birth changed her life irrevocably. It isn't my pain and not my problem in the end though.

I want my son to see that I have succeeded and that EVERYONE has things in life that they struggle with emotionally. My thing has been placing him. My neighbor's thing might be that their mom died when they were five. His thing might be that , who knows what, but we all have our thing. I'm no better or worse for my emotional struggle, just different. It has changed me. But that thing that changed me so profoundly could have been something else too.

[kakuehl]

Maybe the problem is that we need to stop thinking in terms of better or worse and just recognize that we are different people that we were before we placed our children. Each of us has responded to that life-changing event is a way that may be similar to others of us but is totally unique to each of us. I am a different person because I gave birth to D 36 years ago and placed him for adoption. It has affected one way or another every major (and probably minor) decision I have made since then. Have the decisions been better than they would have been? Who can really say. I can "what if" all I want, but I can't know how I would be today without the experience of adoption. I only know that I am a different person than I would have been.