[Jannyroo]

Originally Posted by RavenSong

Hi, Janny...

I'm sorry it took me so long to come back to this thread and post the rest of my story. The thing is, this whole thing about your son has stirred up so many emotions and memories from the past that it kind of has me going in circles. ....

I talked to anybody who would give me the time of day. I prayed and prayed until my knees were sore. And in the end, I "let go

Hi Raven,
wow that was amazing what you went through. Reading it, the pits of my stomach churned and moved over. I'm so sorry the memories my situation with my son is bringing up for you, that is painful indeed. I do wonder if my getting off the boat now is saving some thing awful ahead. Like you, when the doorbell rings, I think is it him, is he mad with me, come down to sort me out? He is convinced he is fine and 'you're my mother for *** sakes, why would you be afraid of me?' but something inside of me is. I have met him only twice and I didn't like what I saw. I instinctively felt something bad about it, but I've carried on in reunion because I wanted to give it a chance - a chance to see if my being in his life could reverse anything. Those hopes were dashed to the ground 2 nights ago and it hurts, badly. So much effort and yet he is so carefree and yet...bluntly, horrible and he can't see it when he's on the stuff. When he's approachable, he's saying to me, mum I hate being like this, I hate my life, but then nosedives into how life has always been for him (very bad swear word) ____everyone' is his attitude.

I feel as though I've left his amom to take the brunt of the inevitable anger you speak of. I not only expected it, but I half envisioned him coming down and walloping me one. He'd certainly get one back if he did, his father did. I was only hit once by his father, but I hit back and moved out. Thats when I found I was pregnant. Yuk. Like you say, all these memories.

I'm so sorry to read your words though Raven. They are heartbreaking and I feel I could well be on the same road... as if there hasn't been enough heartbreak already with this lad of mine. It makes me feel revulsion what drugs do. I half fantasise about going up there and sorting out the obnoxious person that he hangs out with and 'does drugs' with. I better not put in writing what I'd like to do to him, it may be held in evidence against me...!!!

Thanks for sharing. It helps me to stay strong and to face up to what may happen.

((hugs)))) feel a bit numb to give at the minute, I'm just totally shocked. I never did cigs, drugs or alcoholism, and I'm a tough cookie, but you know, this boy can get to me - if I let him.

Feel kinda sad now.

Speak later,
janny

[RavenSong]

Hi, Janny...

I hope you don't mind, but I think I'm going to post the rest of my story later today. That last post just about drained me. It's very hard dealing with the memories, especially since DS has recently decided to shut me out of his life after all these years in reunion.

One of the hardest things I dealt with in the early reunion years was finding out that my son was so messed up. When we gave our babies up for adoption, most of us hoped and prayed they would have a chance at a good life, a better one than we could provide at the time. I had my own "fantasy" image of my son's boyhood, which of course included that he was happy, healthy, and well adjusted ~ that he was thriving. And it hurt so very, very much to discover this wasn't true. And I found myself wondering if whether the pain and anguish over losing him as an infant had been worth it.

[Jannyroo]

Originally Posted by RavenSong

Hi, Janny...I hope you don't mind, but I think I'm going to post the rest of my story later today. That last post just about drained me. It's very hard dealing with the memories, especially since DS has recently decided to shut me out of his life after all these years in reunion.

One of the hardest things I dealt with in the early reunion years was finding out that my son was so messed up. When we gave our babies up for adoption, most of us hoped and prayed they would have a chance at a good life, a better one than we could provide at the time. I had my own "fantasy" image of my son's boyhood, which of course included that he was happy, healthy, and well adjusted ~ that he was thriving. And it hurt so very, very much to discover this wasn't true. And I found myself wondering if whether the pain and anguish over losing him as an infant had been worth it.

I hear ya Ravensong,
I can't tell you how much I feel what you are saying, how deeply I appreciate your helping me through this time, when all it does it dredge up painful memories for you. That is kindness, that is fellow feeling, that is ..hard to put into words, but thankyou seems too brief to say it.

I think the second paragraph says it all - for me and many other bmothers also. I have found the first few months of reunion absolutely devastating, as son describes his life, pain, not particularly well adjusted. I don't think I can even go there at the minute, as I hung on like a scared cat, hoping that the trauma would settle down, and I was lulled into a false sense of security, because each time I felt we were getting somewhere, WHAM it would come from nowhere and the traumas and the ups and downs... and to find his amom so frayed around the edges by the time I phoned her up....

I said to her I'm so sorry.... I'm so sorry, it wasn't meant to be like this. When I gave him in trust to you, it was to make you happy, not this. I'm so gutted Raven that my son has brought such unhappiness and sadness and hurt to so many people that love him including me. I've felt so much love pour out for him, something I find hard to do, feel that close to another human being. I've not allowed anyone into my heart for so many many years. Talk about emotional paralysis.

In reunion, I've stuck with him through thick and thin, I have arms and legs covered with so much skin problems - psoriasis, due to the stress and worry, that I have to have specialist hospital treatment to see if they can clear it up - you can hardly see any of my skin, its all covered in red welts, the stress is plain for me to see. Starting next month, I will have hospital UV light treatment x3 days a week for 8 weeks. I hope to goodness I can get some relief, as it not only looks horrible, but its like I feel a leper and it shows my state of mind too. Not good.

The relief was also enormous when I called time. Well I shut down. I had to. I'm realising just how charged up I have been ever since my son came into my life. Its not a normal way of living. Like you've said before, I have to take care of myself before I become a complete basket case. I really admire Verriers work, but as you say, her books cannot embrace addiction. I can't embrace it either. I have too much of my own internal work that has been a life's work to be able to stretch myself any further. It just isn't possible.

Perhaps some mothers can, but I can't. I just have to retreat. I'm amazed I've got this far, as my emotional strength has been stretched to the limit and beyond. I thought I'd crashed through some pretty awesome barriers in pain over the years, but nothing prepared me for anything like this. I'm in relief and yet I'm just starting to hurt.

I had a good night tonight and my friends all 13 and two halves of them (1 adult +2 kids under the age of 2 came too, last minute additions!) and we had a great time. I kept my mobile on, just in case.... his mom needed to call me. Then I switched off not the mobile, but me, and concentrated on the evening, we had a really good time. I felt my mind wander to him... felt so sad, and had to switch off again.

Now I'm home alone, and I've a feeling of "did this ever happen? is it all a dream?". I feel as if everything is at a distance. Perhaps disassocation something. Can't analyse it. I've read Verrier so much, felt yeh, a lot of it is him, but its ineffectual. Its met a brick wall. I can do nothing to help this boy of mine until he helps himself, and but everyone who has knowledge or even experience of drugs has told me leave him, he has to do this on his own. So here I am again, doing what I do best, with the kind of upbringing and life I've had, instant distancing, putting a great deal between me and him as if it never happened.

Like you, brave Ravensong, I'm gutted that the pain of relinquishment, the pain and numbness and PTSD of those years, feeling that he is bound to be having a better life than I ever had - well I feel it was for nothing. That's how it feels, it was for nothing. Would it have been different if I'd have raised him? I can't go down that road, but knowing my family and the generations past and the generations that I've seen in my circles, even my own father... I doubt it. My father is one big dose of self focused selfishness. Add the drugs and you have my son. My father has some rather neat aspects of his personality that I warm and endear myself to, but like my son, there is too much that is repulsive for it to last for years at a time.

So, I almost feel this is goodbye before we've even really said hello. To think that most of the past 19 months he's been on and off of drugs. I feel duped. I feel hurt. I feel I have to protect myself now. Ouch.

Originally Posted by RavenSong

I had my own "fantasy" image of my son's boyhood, which of course included that he was happy, healthy, and well adjusted ~ that he was thriving. And it hurt so very, very much to discover this wasn't true. And I found myself wondering if whether the pain and anguish over losing him as an infant had been worth it.

Oh my, I can sooo relate to this. Oh my, I can so REALLY relate to this. My eyes are streaming with cold now, my eyes hurt with some kind of virus, but my heart has gone a bit cold. Must go and rest and get rid of this awful thing, nonchantly called 'a cold' but it has to be more evil than that! its a belter. Bye for now. Janny

[lilraskels]

Janny~
You know as we go through the emotions and as this sight is proof of there are many emotions for the adoptee too which I am sure you have taken into consideration. As you and Ravensong type I want to cry with yall. I know we all want so much for our children. You all as bmoms did what you thought was right yall have been strong and brave and experienced the heart ache right along with the amoms. We don't know what the reasons are. Are they because he is overwhelmed with the tramua of being adopted feeling as though the hole will never be filled as Verrier says? Is it biological from the previous generations as you said? Is it that his aparents did not do him right? Is it..... We could do the questions ? But I don't think we will find the answers they lie with in your son. We could all find reasons on how drugs/alcohol could be a way out but it is the self control that keeps us out of that situation. It is sad. It hurts because we care enough to know what it is doing to others and what the consequences are they are too close to see this. Hopefully your son will come out of his slump. I know that there is help that will work if he can get there. Please don't blame yourself. I can remember taking my daughter to therapy and the theropist telling me "what you are doing is right BUT it will never be enough!" That crushed me. I was spinning my tires and I was emotionally drained at trying to show this child that I loved her and that I would not abanonded her (she was removed from CPS) but I could never do enough. After reading Verriers book I understood it is within all of us. We have to fix us. Each one of the sides of the triad have a hole. I did the best I could. I would like to think his a mom did to and I would not blame the mother if my child did not turn out -perfect.- So please don't think we would think you did this to make her miserable None of us know what we are in for. That is why it takes uncondictonal love from all sides. From the bmom to give her baby up for adoption, from the amom to take what ever we get from the kids. No one knows the outcome. It is a leap of faith. I sure hope your son can get the help he needs and trun his life around to see what is truely before him. He is very lucky to have found you and to have two mothers that love him so much. When you have done all you can do that is all you can do. {{{Hugs}}}

[Jannyroo]

Originally Posted by lilraskels

He is very lucky to have found you and to have two mothers that love him so much. When you have done all you can do that is all you can do. {{{Hugs}}}

Lilraskels,
I feel so angry. When I looked at a site this morning that showed Issac Lethbridge, murdered, in foster care. I feel like saying to my son, look at this!!! You have two moms who love you, for goodness sake!!!

Confidentiality and the media?
Detroit Free Press - www.freep.com - Video: News
Slideshow of pictures of the murdered toddler she was referring to in that letter.

Lilraskels, I used to try and find a 'reason' for why my son is the way he is, but I can't. I can't psychoanalyse him anymore c/o Verrier, I have tried, but drugs are an evil evil thing. His amom has told me that he accuses her of not loving him. That is something else speaking. When he is 'normal' he tells me he knows she loves him. He loves her, he loves both his parents. But his angst at being adopted is shrouded by the chemicals and booze that make him resistant to reason.

His counsellor has not helped. She is not au fait with his adoption issues, she is not an adoption counsellor and his parents in my opinion, have ill advisedly paid for this woman to turn him against them, instead of recognising the adoption issues he has. He is in victim mode. If he wanted to see a real victim, he should see the pathetic life story of Isaac Lethbridge. That made me cry. A young life cut so short, you ought to see his beautiful blue eyes.

But my son has his issues, true, I'm not being flippant here. We can do nothing to help him until he is clean of the substances that remove his response to counselling and help with his painful emotions. Catch22 really. I thought my being in his life would help. Not so. Not to the extent that he can be a healthy adjusted individual. Bluntly and also cruelly, I have my own health problems and the impact he is having means I have to back away, self preservation.

I haven't enjoyed this reunion as much as I'd hoped. It has been a life sucking experience for me and pushed me beyond my limits. I so much need for rest and healing myself. This has been so destructive on my emotions and as anyone who knows anything about CFS - that makes it much worse. I can't talk anymore, sorry, this is getting to me.

Janny

[lilraskels]

Janny~
Thank you for sharing the story with me. I know to many times little angels fall to the hand of their foster parents in ending their lives.
The time has come for you to focus on you. Jackie wrote a wonderful passage to me it is from Melody Beatttie book The language of letting go. It sure helped me this morning. I hope you can get as much from it as I have.

Letting Go of those Not in Recovery

We can go forward with our life and recoveries, even though someone we love is not yet recovering.

Picture a bridge. On one side of the bridge it is cold and dark. We stood there with others in the cold and darkness, double over in pain. Some of us developed an eating disorder to cope with the pain. Some drank; some used other drugs. Some of us lost control of our sexual behavior. Some of us obsessively focused on addicted people’s pain to distract us from our own pain. Many of us did both: we developed an addictive behavior, and distracted ourselves by focusing on other addicted people. We did not know there was a bridge. We thought we were trapped on a cliff.

Then, some of us got lucky. Our eyes opened, by the Grace of God, because it was time. We saw the bridge. People told us what was on the other side: warmth, light, and healing from our pain. We could barely glimpse or imagine this, but we decided to start the trek across the bridge anyway.

We tried to convince the people around us on the cliff that there was a bridge to a better place, but they wouldn’t listen. They couldn’t see it; they couldn’t believe. They were not ready for the journey. We decided to go alone, because we believed, and because people on the other side were cheering us onward. The closer we got to the other side, the more we could see, and feel, that what had been promised was real. There was light, warmth, healing and love. There other side was a better place.

But now, there is a bridge between us and those on the other side. Sometimes, we may be tempted to go back and drag them over with us, but it cannot be done. No one can be dragged or forced to cross the bridge. Each person must go at his or her own choice, when the time is right. Some will come, some will stay on the other side. The choice is not ours.

We can love them. We can wave at them. We can holler back and forth. We can cheer them on, as others have cheered and encouraged us. But we can not make them come over with us.

If our time has come to cross the bridge, or if we have already crossed and are standing in the light and warmth, we do not have to feel guilty. It is where we are meant to be. We do not have to go back to the dark cliff because another’s time has not yet come.

The best we can do is stay in the light, because it reassures others that there is a better place. And if others ever do decide to cross the bridge, we will be there to cheer them on.

Today, I will move forward with my life, despite what others are doing or not doing. I will know it is my right to cross the bridge to a better life, even if I must leave others behind to do that. I will not feel guilty, I will not feel ashamed. I know that where I am now is a better place and where I’m meant to be.


I will always be grateful that my first born son was not in the insanity of my life in the late sixties..
I was not ready to parent.. I had some lessons to learn.. and learn I did..


This from Codependents Guide to the Twelve Steps..Melody Beattie.. page 187 on the twelfth.

“Oh, I’ve been a victim all my life,” he said.
“No Joe,” she said “Your whole life is ahead of you.”

Joe and the Volcano

I was always the caretaker.. I always took care of others..
Now I can detach with love.. and just share what I know.. and not stand on that cliff and worry about the drop..

Jackie

I wish you well my friend. Get your medical care and enjoy a good book. Free your mind-I know it is not easy but we deserve it!

[Jannyroo]

Originally Posted by lilraskels

Janny~
Thank you for sharing the story with me. I know to many times little angels fall to the hand of their foster parents in ending their lives. The time has come for you to focus on you. Jackie wrote a wonderful passage to me it is from Melody Beatttie book The language of letting go. It sure helped me this morning. I hope you can get as much from it as I have.

Yes thanks Lilraskels, that was nice and upbuilding, just before I get ready for bed. thanks for posting it and for your warm thoughts. Love Janny.

[Jannyroo]

Originally Posted by RavenSong

One of the hardest things I dealt with in the early reunion years was finding out that my son was so messed up. ...

I've spent since Thursday feeling so ill I can barely function. In my darker moments yesterday, I 'spoke' to my son whilst filming myself with my relatively new mobile 'camera' phone. I told him how ill all this is making me and how bad I feel and that this is not a road he can continue on. It was done with me sitting in a low light bedroom, so the impact when I watched it was quite moving. I think it conveyed the angst and pain of his actions and phone calls when he's drunk.

I then managed somewhat to fathom the technology to load the software on a malfunctioning D drive so that I could load and then email it to him. I waited until today and then backtracked on my original contact to him that I would not want to hear from him unless he'd sought help and advice and gotten 'clean'. That didn't last long and the more I thought about it, the more I thought what an idiot I was to think that 1. that was good for him when he would need me more than ever and 2. how long did I think I could keep that up. Well not for long.

Today I sank into a depression because I just couldn't see the future without him in it, problems and all and I then emailed the mobile camera video of about 2½ minutes talking to him. It impacted on him immediately as I got a phone call from him straight away after sending it. He's FINE. I'm the one in a MESS. How annoying is that????

Are there any other mothers out there that have sons that can make you feel as if you are an old fogey and just what is the problem, because their life is fine. Fine???? Whadya mean fine????? Suddenly his home life is ok, there is no need for you to try to 'fix' my life mom (yeh, well I agree with that one). I've come out this conversation where I was getting eeryated (northern english slang for worked up) and he was the calm "ok mother, calm down' as if I was the one with the problem! Aghhhhhh, hit myself about the face why don't I?

He just thinks that it is less of a problem than it is. He is in complete denial. He recognises his pain, but he says he has known nothing else but how he goes about his life and the way he deals with his pain is, well, the way he deals with it. Crack cocaine he promised was just the once and that he gave it up years ago. Ok, well why did you take it this time? Ah, well, I was stressed. So how are you ..........and so the questions begin and I start to sound like a real nagging mother and I hear the silence when he asks me why I've said so and so, and I retort "because I'm your mother and I'm allowed" and the silence that followed made me feel as if I wasn't his mother, because his mother is the woman he shares his life with and seems ok with his explanation of what is going on. He is suddenly reasonable and easy to talk to, having been off the booze for 5 days.

When he's like this, he's a dream to talk to, except that I'm not, because I've been stressed out and made ill with what his amom calls his amateur dramatics. Half everything he says she told me. I'm wondering if she is still going to call me, I hope she does, I really want to know what was ACTUALLY said to him. He was very 'oh she just said you'd phoned' type thing when she was as exasperated as I was. I wonder if she'd calmed down later and then her son, my son, our son, then turned on the charm as if these 2 older ladies were losing it and he was such a 'reasonable' person - how was he meant to deal with me if I was going to be like this???

So the cheeky *** said in a 'I'm in control even if you aren't type attitude, "I'm afraid I'm going to have to finish this conversation otherwise it will end in an argument". So I agreed and said bye calmly but inside i'm thinking "son, you wretch, you've effectively turned the tables on me and made me feel as if I'm making a big fuss over nothing'. Like, 'over to you mum. I don't need help with my booze or the drugs, because, well I'm in denial and whats the fuss anyway. I'm happy with my life, my folks, my jobs, the locals know what I'm like and they adapt to me',
DENIAL son, thats what it is, but whats the use. I know well enough that 50% of dealing with a problem is recognising it.

I watched video tv for the rest of the early evening and then posted on here to kind of vent my frustration that he managed to squirm in his denial and make me feel an idiot. I don't recognise that trait from anywhere particular, I wonder where he got it from? or is it a 'this generation' trait???? The weirdest but weirdest thing was though, that I felt very calm afterwards. All was right with the world again, because I'd heard from him. He's ok today. So that's what counts. Until the next merry go round and then I'm back to.... square 1.

So Ravensong, it would appear that my son is messed up.. until he decides he isnt. Any mom's reading this that can relate?????

[lovemy2boys]

Not a mom, but a sister...My brother, like I've told you, is similar in attitude. Everyone else is crazy, everyone else has the problem, everyone else has the attitude etc...

When he is clean (which thankfully he is presently) he knows that he completely acknowledges his problem, and is quite insightful. However, he did say one thing that totally shocked me - we were talking about his addiction one day and I was crying because of the fear that we would one day find him dead. He said, "Don't worry about me. I'm hurting myself - nobody else." I told him that if he sincerely thought he was hurting noone but himself, then he was further in denial than he thought.

As far as his aparents, I have a feeling that they didn't just "fall" for whatever state of sobriety he's in. If they have a history of dealing with his behavior, they know the routine...

Sending prayers and good thoughts your way...

[lilraskels]

I truely hope I never have to walk this road personally. I know it is not a choice of anyones not even the addicts. I have been through this with several family members and friends. I know it is not easy but they are grown ups and when someone does this with their life even if in the begening they are doing this 'to see if someone cares' the addiction takes control. There are times when they are in control. It is the you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. It is much different when they are under the age of 18 and a parent can sign them into rehab but if it is not court ordered then all we can do is show our love, make our boundries, and seek council (God). It does not make the worry go away nor does it make it go away. It is so hard to see those you love so much in 'self destruct' mode. Sometimes you want to somewhat throw a fit and mimik their behavior so they can see what they are acting like.... sometimes it works sometimes it does not.
Hard with the reverse talk my daughter does this to take the light off of her self. But it never works. She might think it does.

[kakuehl]

The 31 yr old son that I raised is expert at pushing my buttons and then saying, "what's the matter with you?" (It gets even worse when my daughter jumps into the fray to defend me and they end up in a verbal battle.) I've gotten to the point that when he's busy blaming me for his problems, I just say I'm so glad you have something to talk to the therapist about. (My mother used to say, "The bigger your children are, the bigger their problems are."

[lovemy2boys]

Originally Posted by kakuehl

The 31 yr old son that I raised is expert at pushing my buttons and then saying, "what's the matter with you?" (It gets even worse when my daughter jumps into the fray to defend me and they end up in a verbal battle.) I've gotten to the point that when he's busy blaming me for his problems, I just say I'm so glad you have something to talk to the therapist about. (My mother used to say, "The bigger your children are, the bigger their problems are."

Wow - must be something with mothers and daughters. I get so angry at how my brother talks to my mom that I often jump to her defense and end up making things worse. My mom keeps telling me to let her deal with it (which she does) but I just can't sit idly by...