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#16
09-07-2007, 04:48 PM
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Rainmon, you wrote:
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Often that's exactly what happens when we live in fear... we lose what we have but are afraid we'll lose. As a pastor of small congregations, I have learned well the pattern of unintentioned consequences: small congregations have a history or short pastorates, so after a pastor has been there for 2 or three years, they start to "shut down" emotionally because it's time for this pastor to go. The pastor experience the shut down (actually shut out) and decides that his/her ministry there is over and leaves. Thus the thing the congregation feared, happens. I think it happens in relationships as well, especially in relationships as rife with the insecurities and fears adoption can bring. As always in human relationships, open communication can help lay the fears to rest. I hope your bdaughter is getting some counseling (not only reading books). I sometimes think there should be a course for adoptees and birthparents like the one I use for pre-marital counseling that helps every one get a reality check and work on communication!
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Blessings! Kathy, Forum moderator for birthfamily healing, recovery, success and Birthparent support Birth mom to D (10/4/72) Mom to J(7/6/76) and S (7/26/78) "Weeping may linger for the night, but joy comes with the morning." (Psalm 30:5) Click hereTo read my story Last edited by kakuehl : 09-07-2007 at 04:53 PM. 
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#17
09-07-2007, 07:02 PM
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I'm not sure that I'm in pullback or just we're both afraid to bother the other person as we both have so much change going on in our lives. What is the "appropriate" amount of time to allow to pass before you call/text? 3 weeks, a month, any ideas from adoptees? I don't want to seem uninterested, my God I would speak with my bson daily if that's what he wanted but at the same time I need to give him privacy - so what is the difference - how do you know when it is a pullback or just life? Thanks.
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#18
09-07-2007, 10:20 PM
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keds
I'm sure you know the answer I'm going to give. .........YOU ASK HIM. Honestly, unless you sort out these boundaries now you will spend the next 6 months or so to..ing and fro..ing - trying to work out if he is mad at you, or wondering what has offended him. Fear in thought is a lot worse than fear in fact. Just pluck up the courage to ring that cell-number....tell him you have been worried....tell him you may be irrational but you want to know what he considers sufficient contact rather than too-much contact. If he says "whenever" ask him if twice weekly is too much (or whatever time frame you think would settle your heart). There;s no hard and fast rules - only the ones you make between yourselves. Do it girl....you know you can!!!! I hope you can....b'cause stressing and hoping and wondering just doesn't do you any good. You are still left without an answer. Ann
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Dont spoil what you have by desiring what you have not; but remember that what you now have was once among the things only hoped for.
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#19
09-08-2007, 01:17 AM
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I'm assuming that you are a sister? I thought initially you were a bmother from your thread, but all the above are classic responses to adoption issues and reunion. You say that you don't personally believe in pullback - well its not something that is actually done purposely or to inflict pain. Emotionally it is the same as saying, I'm sorry, i can't get up because my legs are broken, much as I would like to... I can't. Decades of not knowing who you are, who you look like, where you get your mannerisms from... deep inner anguish - missing your bmom and wondering where she is, does she care, why did she give you up? Feeling abandoned, feeling pain, developing defense mechanisms that hide who you are - even to yourself. Unless your family get more clued up on what adoption means to someone who has been lost and felt worthless for their entire life, finds relationships so hard that they very often malfunction and break down, then this reunion will probably come to a grinding halt because of lack of insight, which is not your fault. However, with insight, this reunion can be turned around in lessening the confusion, the frustration, the anger. Not that there's much to be had in the way of guidance in adoption/reunion. I started from square 1 i.e. nothing but have now found the info I need, applied it, got results. You've mentioned that there are books read, but I can't help feeling what actually has gone in? or whether the information you so desperately need is in them. I've read 3 books which I've found have been essential reading to going through and understanding my son through an agonising 17 months reunion. Now that I understand, have made the right responses to what may seem to others illogical behaviour, he is a different lad. I would suggest that if you haven't read already, try 'The Primal Wound' quickly followed up by 'Coming Home To Self' - both by Nancy Newton Verrier. These will most definitely give you more insight if you want it. You sound angry, yes its hard this reunion business and it turns our worlds upside down and its all so easy for any of us to think of our own pain. Its much harder to put ourselves in someone elses shoes of their situation - something we may never have come across before or experienced ourselves. Please do try reading the above. It will give you a clearer picture of what is going on - not only with the adoptee, but your own feelings. I'm sorry I haven't been able to include more, but I've spent a literal day typing up Verrier to send to my own son - hope it helps.
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#20
09-08-2007, 01:17 AM
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Quote:
I'm assuming that you are a sister? I thought initially you were a bmother from your thread. All the above are classic responses to adoption issues and reunion. You say that you don't personally believe in pullback - well its not something that is actually done purposely or to inflict pain. Emotionally it is the same as saying, I'm sorry, i can't get up because my legs are broken, much as I would like to... I can't. Decades of not knowing who you are, who you look like, where you get your mannerisms from... deep inner anguish - missing your bmom and wondering where she is, does she care, why did she give you up? Feeling abandoned, feeling pain, developing defense mechanisms that hide who you are - even to yourself. Unless your family are able to get more clued up on what adoption means to someone who has been lost and felt worthless for their entire life, finds relationships so hard that they very often malfunction and break down, then this reunion will probably come to a grinding halt because of lack of insight, which is not by the way your fault as there is so little available and even this website is a godsend. However, with such insight, I feel this reunion can be turned around in lessening the confusion, the frustration, the anger. You've mentioned that there are books that have been read, but I can't help feeling what actually has been helpful as you still seem confused with what are classic responses in reunion or whether the information you so desperately need is in them. I've read 3 books which I've found have been essential reading to going through and understanding my son through an agonising 17 months reunion. Now that I understand, have made the right responses to what may seem to others illogical behaviour, he is a different lad. I would suggest that if you haven't read already, try 'The Primal Wound' quickly followed up by 'Coming Home To Self' - both by Nancy Newton Verrier. These will most definitely give you more insight if you want it. You sound angry, yes its hard this reunion business and it turns our worlds upside down and its all so easy for any of us to think of our own pain. Its much harder to put ourselves in someone elses shoes of their situation - something we may never have come across before or experienced ourselves. Please do try reading the above. It will give you a clearer picture of what is going on - not only with the adoptee, but your own feelings. I'm sorry I haven't been able to include more, but I've spent a literal day typing up Verrier to send to my own son - hope it helps. Last edited by Jannyroo : 09-08-2007 at 01:37 AM.
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#21
09-08-2007, 06:16 AM
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rainmom - I'm also sorry you are finding this hard to take. I remember your story......and your empathy with your hubby and daughter. Use your energy on your family and friends - they will always be your first priority. Ann
__________________
Dont spoil what you have by desiring what you have not; but remember that what you now have was once among the things only hoped for.
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#22
09-08-2007, 11:12 AM
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Hi Ann, I love the "broken legs" analogy as well - I can relate. I promise to call on Tuesday or Wednesday this week. I have company this weekend and can barely find time alone as one of the five of them is on my heels at all times. I love them dearly but sometimes! I'll let you know how things turn out. I hope everyone has a great weekend!
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#23
09-08-2007, 08:20 PM
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appropriate time....
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Hi Keds, howya doin? Well, I can offer some words of advice given to me... which I totally ignored...! LOL. My son and I were going fast and furious at every 3 days. I was told that this was unsustainable and they were right. Like you, I could have kept it up every day, but as the months went by, there was a depth charging that was happening far too often and he would pull back. I think after about a few months of intensity I emailed him to say I think we have to tone this down a bit, but it was hard for either of us to do so. The reunion tsunami was doing its work. We were drowning in emotion. Kune is right, ask him. However, I think this leaves you vulnerable to an extent. First, you feel lousy and intrusive because you didn't expect to be "allowed" into his life (legacy from the relinquishment, guilt trip etc). Also, an adoptee doesn't really know. Emotions change on an almost daily basis and they expect you to be the parent/adult in the relationship. Unfair? Sure, but once you get to grips with this simple bit of information, its amazing how it changes things. I would leave it 3-4 weeks at a go. If you make yourself too available, you can play into the the adoptees punishment regime whereby they hold back from you. This is not concious, but its a kind of "see how you like it" (inner baby/child waiting for mom to come back, but she didn't -see Verrier for more info - goodness that woman is good). Once they put you through that (that lasted for 16 months with my son, but everyone is different, the fact is, once I said "enough" and had a near breakdown, he responded by being very supportive. I'd taken away his phone options at that stage. I'd had to discipline him. It was 7 weeks before he was allowed a mobile phone contact), they then build up a tentative relationship, of sorts with you. It will grow quicker the more up front you can be and honest with your emotions. As the "parent" in the relationship, he will expect you to take the lead and yet expect you to be so understanding too, whereas inside you are the lost young girl still asking "is it ok". You will need reassurance. Its unbalanced to start with, a bit of tight rope balance, but you get there in the end. Its still early days, so I would encourage you not to be in contact too often at this stage. He will still be coming to terms with having met you and processing his own emotions. Lets face it, its been how long? and there you are, my goodness, can us bmom's really understand the impact of that on an adoptee? Standing in front of him... my mom!!!! Its a rule of thumb given to me by a great counsellor (a bmom in reunion 17yrs herself) that its best to let the adoptee go at their pace not yours. This for me was extremely hard, as I wanted it 24/7 just like you are finding it now. But, my son would email me.... about every 2-3 weeks, which was agony. BUT, I had to endure it, endure being the operative word. At times it would be more and sometimes less, but one has to go with the flow. We bmom's have to remember that they are totally freaking out even if they don't show it. I could gauge better how my son was feeling about things once we got on the phone which was better than emails (about 4 months into reunion) - they have their place to start with, but to hear the expressions and tune in to the tone of voice, emotion is something much better IMHO. The worry for me is that it was one directional again, he could phone me, but I can't phone him as he lives at home with is parents. Patience was a word I started to hate, as was self control. I would say that the sooner you can get on with your day to day life (easier said than done, definitely) and get pleasant "interuptions" from him, the better it will be. The problem that gets in the way is at the stage you are at, you are wondering what he thinks about you. Are you accepted yet? Are you ok? Has he forgiven you? What is he feeling... really? Strange feelings, but there nonetheless. If you don't hear "soon" whatever that is for you, you think "what did I say" and you worry like mad. Its ok, I've been there. You wonder if you've put him off for life and analyse and re-read your emails, and pace the floor. Relief only comes when he contacts you again and absolutely nothing is wrong. By the way, I don't hold back from emailing him if I think I need to say sorry about something. He is instinctively intuitive to my feelings and responds well - eventually. I have now learned that when he says "soon" that could be anything from 4 days to 2 weeks!!! That when he says he will do something... it could take... ages. Don't take it as a personal assessment as to where you are at. Its a guy thing. I think my counsellor got it right when she said it is like a love affair of sorts. You wait to hear from them, they keep you waiting, you are euphoric when you hear from them, followed by total crash wallop in a very short time, as you yearn for more contact. Well I can speak for myself anyway, if there's anything you can relate to, all well and good! So I would guess that as you have had a relatively quick reunion (some take literally years before they are ready) same as me, leave it for as long as you can, preferably until he contacts you. That will give you more confidence, as the more you leave messages, emails etc, the worse you will feel. The more he responds without prompts from you, again, the more confident you will feel. As time goes by, you will get to know one another (as long as you are up front with each other - the treading on eggs bit has to stop - it will kick in at some stage when you think hang on, I've needs too, and you have to lay down what you feel about things. e.g. I told my son that I wasn't going to accept certain behaviour from him and I risked him legging it, but so be it, at that time it had become part of the stages of reunion - have I PM'd that to you yet?) Anyway, I'm rattling on, but its good to see you posting Keds and let me know how you are getting on if you want to PM me it would be great to hear from you. fondest love and (((hugs)))) Jannyroo Last edited by Jannyroo : 09-08-2007 at 08:41 PM.
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#24
09-09-2007, 10:24 AM
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Hi Jannyroo - I'll PM you otherwise my post will be too long. I can't say we're in pullback but rather life has taken over - me moving both daughters out and becoming an empty nester and him having to decide on new career, find a new place to live and being separated from his girlfriend while she goes to school. I have to remind myself how little I spoke with my parents at his age and that he has a lot to deal with at the moment.
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#25
09-10-2007, 02:51 AM
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Jannyroo, thanks for all the info and also the suggestions on Varriers books. I will look for them.
I am wondering if the "punishment rigime" part, is being addressed in Verriers books, or is that something you have experienced. as it really rang home with me as you wrote: " If you make your self too available you can play into the adoptees punishment regime, this is not concious but it's kind of a 'see how YOU like it" yes... I think that may be happening with us, and I wonder how common it is. and while I know that most pull -backs are for protection of ones own heart, and I do beleive it should be used in extreme cases where communication has been tried and failed. I have heard on other threads by others that it has also been used to hurt or punish also, and they don't know why they do it.... and regret it after they do it but sometimes just can't stop themselves from doing it. so I am hoping that it is being addressed now as it does seem to be causing some reunion problems.and not everyone can afford to pay for counseling to get it all figured out on why they are doing it to each other. Kune, you mentioned I should save my energy for my family and friends.... but you see she IS my family now, and I also consider her a friend. and something has gone so wrong with this reunion and we have no idea what..... and... yes sometimes I am angry about it, other times sad, hurt and confused or scared at whats happening and I do come here like everyone else to learn from others, to seek understanding and to vent when needed. and if there is any way possible to find a way to put out the fire on this nice bridge that we have been building and seems now to be slowly burning, I am willing to try to save it, I am just not the type to just look the other way and pretend I don't see it burning.
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#26
09-10-2007, 12:28 PM
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Hi there, not in pullback after all - just life. I received a letter today and a text message. It's funny how your mind plays games and you have to be very careful not to let it. All the best.
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#27
09-10-2007, 01:51 PM
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Emotionally it is the same as saying, I'm sorry, i can't get up because my legs are broken, much as I would like to... I can't.
Decades of not knowing who you are, who you look like, where you get your mannerisms from... deep inner anguish - missing your bmom and wondering where she is, does she care, why did she give you up? Feeling abandoned, feeling pain, developing defense mechanisms that hide who you are - even to yourself. Unless your family get more clued up on what adoption means to someone who has been lost and felt worthless for their entire life, finds relationships so hard that they very often malfunction and break down, then this reunion will probably come to a grinding halt because of lack of insight, which is not your fault. However, with insight, this reunion can be turned around in lessening the confusion, the frustration, the anger. As an adoptee that has met both birthparents, I can say that the above statement very much reflects how I felt before, during and after reunion. I know for myself, building trust was a huge issue. I have gone through the pullback stage partially due to a lack of understanding on thier parts and due to my own personal turmoil. I also pulled back significantly when a very personal letter explaining my turnmoil (and anger) that I wrote was read to my bsiblings...I felt extremely betrayed, as my feelings that I wrote about were intended only for my birthparent (and possibly spouse). There was no apology on bparents part...just mine, apologizng for my "outburst". There was an "explanation" as to why the letter was shown to bsiblings.. I feel it has damaged my relations with bsiblings beyone repair.... I learned from that and have no trust in our relationship anymore.....I felt judged, rejected and misunderstood....and still do..thus the withdrawl on my part. I just wanted to give my 2cents ...the pullback is VERY real for many adoptee's...it's not about hurting the bparents, sometimes it's about feeling hurt and trying to protect ourselves. tlee
__________________
"You can never really understand where you're going unless you know where you came from."
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#28
09-10-2007, 05:06 PM
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tlee, thanks for your post, it is much appreciated. I am very careful not to share any communication from my bson with his bdad (my husband) and his 2 siblings. they have written to him and if they want to share with me fine but his letters go right to them. I wouldn't read my neighbour's mail so I don't expect them to share either (unless they all agreed ahead of time). take care.
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#29
09-11-2007, 12:58 AM
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T lee, it is unfornunate that your personal feeling were shared... without your knowlege......
but just maybe it needed to be shared... for all the family to understand just what an adoptee goes through....as it could have been anyone of them given up.....it turned out ....it was you. please don't sign off forever....sometimes it just takes time for understanding...and maybe that letter was a lot more importance to the whole family then you realize. keep an open mind. no one in the family has "ever" gone through what you have....you are truly unique.
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#30
09-14-2007, 03:19 PM
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rainmon, as I've been reading your posts, you've really struck a cord with me. It's made me see that some of my actions/words may have caused anger from my bparent. I'm sure deep down I was really seeing if they would "leave" again, feeling unsure of my "place", wondering if I were just an "obligation". I decided it was safer to cut ties...since my other bparent had hurt me so much. Combine those feelings a few months after giving birth and you can imagine how emotional and angry my letter was....
That was a few years ago, and I still feel that we haven't really moved past it. I was the one that eventually said sorry for my letter (even after I was told it was shared). The relationship I have with both siblings,especially my sister changed dramatically afterwards. Sometimes I just want to apologize for my exisitence and say...sorry to have upset everyone. I was confused ...still am some days, is that understandable? forgivable?? I haven't closed the door on any of my bfamily, but I'm not going to intrude any longer.
__________________
"You can never really understand where you're going unless you know where you came from."
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