[michellemartin]

I dont feel this thread is very positive as I mentioned before in my first post. Many of us here are quite angry to hear about a fellow birthmother being manipulated. How can this be fixed?

Chris- please tell us your plan to help your girlfriend through her grief and your plan to tell her the truth. Until you accept responsibility for your actions- I feel it is unlikely that anyone here can offer you any support.

[Volfe]

Ugh

<censored>

do you dislike your girlfriend because you cannot completely control her? You certainly dont seem to respect her. Is she so beaten down she cannot see the truth of some things? Perhaps you should call the Battered Women's Shelter for her too.

If someone is bleeding I would not instantly wrap up their wound unless they were my child. If I asked what they wanted me to do and they said I was stupid for not just acting, I'd let them bleed.
a) They have another arm and hand that could staunch the bleeding.
b) Sometimes people do not want to be touched
c) Adults are responsible for their health for they are not children.

I am appalled at your ambivalent tone about having your child taken from you and your girlfriend.

I am sad for your girlfriend but man am I glad you do not get to imprint your opinion of women onto your son.

Me
~ Disgusted

[LoveRiddenDad]

Chris,

I was taken by surprise by the incredible MEAN nature of your post. I have a question for you though, and I want an honest answer. Do you think being disabled makes it alright to do what you did?

Abusing someone, even emotionally, is NOT cool. If you hate this woman so much, leave her. She isn't your caretaker, nor are you hers. Do her a favor and LEAVE.

Fifteen years ago I didn't want children. I'm now an adoptive dad of four. People CHANGE and if you can't deal with that, don't date people. Buy a doll. (Crude, but true.)

Shame on you for being so awful to that poor lady and having her child taken away. Someday, that child will come looking for his birth family and you'll have to explain what you've done. I pray that you can live with it.

Mike

P.S. Shellie, yes it's seemingly unproductive, but I think it's very important aparents be aware of this type of stuff. We NEED to know this goes on.

[theresa ann]

wow! Chris I dont understand. Did you call cps because you dont
want your child or because you are trying to protect your child?
I dont know if your gf loves this child or not ,but if it was me I
would be devastated. I definately think you made a great decision
by having cps take the child out of this situation ,because you
have a really unhealthy relationship and you are right , a child should not be exposed to that kind of stuff. Babies are sponges
and absorb everything. I am really sad to hear that you have so many medical issues;That must be very difficult for you in itself.
I believe you are angry because the guilt is killing you. If cps took the child than it is obvious that the child was in an unhealthy environment,otherwise they wouldnt have taken her or him.Let
go of the anger it is not making things better. I hope for your babies sake that you will take better care of yourself. I understand that you are venting and you just needed to get that stuff off your chest . Betrayel is not a family value and sometimes when people are unhappy in their relationship
they poison each other.Do not mistake comfort with love. People that abuse one another , do not love each other.My opinion is that you should leave this relationship and take care of you and continue loving your child. once your gf finds out what you have
done, your relationship will never be repaired. For every action there is a consequence. I could never be with someone that could betray me like that. I dont know if you believe in God,but
what has helped me get over anger is praying for them and wishing them the best.I know it may be difficult to do , but trust
me it does help.

[FL_GirlByProxy]

Chris ~ I read your original post on this thread and was really unsure of how to respond. I felt that I didn't have the whole story, both sides, and I didn't want to jump to conclusions. Well, I still think that I do not know the whole story, but the more you have posted, the scarier your role in this seems to be. I'm sorry Chris, but for a guy of your age, there is a lot of squawking and whining, he said she said, and he did she did. I really wanted to keep my mind open to why your girlfriend's parental rights have been taken, but there is no chance of that now.

1.) People with $0 in the bank can still parent. That is what public assistance is for, and it's not a bad thing if it is used properly.

2.) Bunion surgery does not cancel out a person's ability to parent. She may need extra help for awhile. I had my shoulder operated on and I'm still recovering. I've recieved extra help from my family. Does this mean I am unable to parent?

3.) Depression, bipolar disorder, does not cancel out anyone's ability to parent. If anything, and we will never know, she may have worked on her issues even harder, with her child in mind. What you and CPS have done is taken away any chance for her to do that. We cannot assume that anyone affected this way cannot parent. If we do that, we will be one step away from "genetic cleansing" reappearing. Seriously. Show me the perfect mother, with plenty of $$ in the bank, in perfect mental health, and we'll be looking at a Tide commercial, not reality.

4.) Dishonesty to this degree, not coming clean about your call to CPS, is going to ruin her, and if your only looking out for you, it's going to ruin you as well. That guilt is going to chase you forever, until you own up to what you've done. All of your excuses serve as a way for you to reason with yourself that you are in the right. I believe you need to re-examine this, truly. Look at the reasons that YOU chose not to parent, instead of the reasons that you blame her for.

I, as well as the other posters here, thought long and hard before posting. I still believe we don't know everything, and that would be fine, if your posts did not project your situation into the "Look what she did", "Look what she can't do", and "Look what she doesn't have ($$)", along with all of your daily needs that were not recognized by her. I am so confused as to who is the child and who is the adult in your 24/7 parent/child relationship. What I see is that you acted as a psuedo-parent, (a real parent in your own mind only), took false control of a situation, and stole all control from your girlfriend. If she was really in such bad shape as not able to parent, if she really is the child that you describe, she really should have had a guardian in court for her, fighting for her rights, and the rights of her child to be raised by her mother.

[Chris516]

>Chris ~ I read your original post on this thread and was really unsure of how to respond. I felt that I didn't have the whole story, both sides, and I didn't want to jump to conclusions. Well, I still think that I do not know the whole story, but the more you have posted, the scarier your role in this seems to be. I'm sorry Chris, but for a guy of your age, there is a lot of squawking and whining, he said she said, and he did she did. I really wanted to keep my mind open to why your girlfriend's parental rights have been taken, but there is no chance of that now.

I applaud your not wanting to jump to conclusions.

>1.) People with $0 in the bank can still parent. That is what public assistance is for, and it's not a bad thing if it is used properly.

While you are correct about going on Public Assistance, the key is using it properly. She does not use her $ wisely.

>2.) Bunion surgery does not cancel out a person's ability to parent. She may need extra help for awhile. I had my shoulder operated on and I'm still recovering. I've recieved extra help from my family. Does this mean I am unable to parent?

Bunion surgery definitely does not cancel out a person's ability to parent. Indirectly, the same thing could be said of me, when I had a cast on my arm over the Winter(I had a hair-line fracture in my right wrist from a bike accident)

> 3.) Depression, bipolar disorder, does not cancel out anyone's ability to parent. If anything, and we will never know, she may have worked on her issues even harder, with her child in mind. What you and CPS have done is taken away any chance for her to do that. We cannot assume that anyone affected this way cannot parent. If we do that, we will be one step away from "genetic cleansing" reappearing. Seriously. Show me the perfect mother, with plenty of $$ in the bank, in perfect mental health, and we'll be looking at a Tide commercial, not reality.

That is all true but, I had to focus on the 'here and now'. Not way down the road. It would be unfair, to make the child, the catalyst for further progress in her recovery from the abuse. That would make the child a pawn in daily crisis.

>4.) Dishonesty to this degree, not coming clean about your call to CPS, is going to ruin her, and if your only looking out for you, it's going to ruin you as well. That guilt is going to chase you forever, until you own up to what you've done. All of your excuses serve as a way for you to reason with yourself that you are in the right. I believe you need to re-examine this, truly. Look at the reasons that YOU chose not to parent, instead of the reasons that you blame her for.

I was not looking out for me, in reference to the call to CPS. I was looking out for the baby.

I was looking out for me, when, I went to the management company of the building we live in, and, told them to list me as 'Head of Household' in case, she took off, in the midst of a 'manic' episode.

I have been looking out for her, in all the medical things she has had done over the last year-and-a-half.

[Chris516]

>I, as well as the other posters here, thought long and hard before posting. I still believe we don't know everything, and that would be fine, if your posts did not project your situation into the "Look what she did", "Look what she can't do", and "Look what she doesn't have ($$)", along with all of your daily needs that were not recognized by her. I am so confused as to who is the child and who is the adult in your 24/7 parent/child relationship. What I see is that you acted as a psuedo-parent, (a real parent in your own mind only), took false control of a situation, and stole all control from your girlfriend. If she was really in such bad shape as not able to parent, if she really is the child that you describe, she really should have had a guardian in court for her, fighting for her rights, and the rights of her child to be raised by her mother.

I forgot to include this part, in my original reply. She is the one that, behaves like a child, largely due to, BOTH, her Bi-Polar Disorder and, the extent of her recovery from being abused by her step-father. CPS received numerous reports from local therapy professionals about her that, did not paint a good picture. Additionally, She has a history of suicidality. She has(prior to meeting me) attempted suicide at least six times.

[Cheryl62]

Chris:

My posts were way back there, so maybe you missed them - but I still have a couple of questions, so that I can understand better:

1) how many other children, and where are they and their birthmothers?
2) why are you still with her? what do you think you and she both get out of this relationship? is there anything about her that you love, like, care about?
3) what kind of support are you hoping to get here? what can we do to help? why are you here, in other words? Not trying to sound mean, but it's hard to know what to say, without having a clearer picture...

[Chris516]

Originally posted by Cheryl62
Chris:

>My posts were way back there, so maybe you missed them - but I still have a couple of questions, so that I can understand better:

ok

>1) how many other children, and where are they and their birthmothers?

Please explain that question further?

>2) why are you still with her? what do you think you and she both get out of this relationship? is there anything about her that you love, like, care about?
On the one hand, because of all the medical stuff she has gone through over the last 18mths., on the other hand, I keep looking to see, if my brains are spilling out my ears, as to the sanity of it. I like the being in touch with ones' 'Inner Child'. Also, as an abuse survivor her, disdain for sex, has wained a great deal.

>3) what kind of support are you hoping to get here? what can we do to help? why are you here, in other words? Not trying to sound mean, but it's hard to know what to say, without having a clearer picture...

That is a very poignant question. If it wasn't well thought out, it certainly sounds like it was. Congrats!!!! Well, From the posts I read, I was trying to be supportive of adoptive parents because, I keep seeing that, they are thrown in the middle of the fray between the birthparent and, the 'system'(whether private industry or, local government i.e. CPS). I am not aiming to fight over, who to feel good about and, who not to. The adoptive parents only 'beome' the Devil, if they are treated that way by the birthparent(s).

[FL_GirlByProxy]

Chris,

Cheryl wrote:
">1) how many other children, and where are they and their birthmothers?"

You asked:
"Please explain that question further?"

In your online profile, in the "How are you touched by adoption" field, your response is "I gave up my children" plural, as in more than one child.

[FL_GirlByProxy]

Chris,

You wrote:
"I am not aiming to fight over, who to feel good about and, who not to. The adoptive parents only 'beome' the Devil, if they are treated that way by the birthparent(s)."

I'm sorry, I don't see any of that in this thread, really. All I see are you listing reasons why she is "at fault". Reasons that in your mind, justify your actions.

You also wrote:
"I forgot to include this part, in my original reply. She is the one that, behaves like a child, largely due to, BOTH, her Bi-Polar Disorder and, the extent of her recovery from being abused by her step-father. CPS received numerous reports from local therapy professionals about her that, did not paint a good picture. Additionally, She has a history of suicidality. She has(prior to meeting me) attempted suicide at least six times."

Chris, this is no small detail. Forgot? We've been going back and forth, trying to understand, and this is being put out here now? With all that's gone on around her, no wonder she is not all put together. Does this mean that they rip this child from her arms, that she gets no chance, even though she obviously wants to parent? This is very dangerous ground. We could all have this power if we wanted to Chris, it's as simple as picking up the phone, right? But life is not that simple. Parental rights may be broken by a phonecall, but bonds are not. It's no wonder to me that this is all she talks about. I would not expect anything different from her.

[michellemartin]

When will you tell her the TRUTH? Thats all I really want to know.