[Jackiejdajda]

kakuehl

Jackie, all of our lessons aren't painful ones! You may well be in the midst of one right now.

A therapist told me once.. that I needed to be with normal people.. People that were not dealing with addictions or working towards things that had been seperated off in their lives.. like relinquishing a child..

I keep thinking of this..

Jackie

[Jackiejdajda]

Janeytwo

It is strange about the desert. Whenever I have described my silent grief, the one I suffered before I came to this forum, I describe it as a tunnel or a basement; some place dank and dark and murky. I had never thought about the journey as a trek through the desert and so I found this intriguing.

But when I muse on it I can see myself walking along, stumbling over rocks - cussing said rocks out - hearing rattle snakes and then coming up on a cactus and being thirsty and dehydrated. And in my mind I know that the cactus holds life-giving liquid but in order to reach that liquid I must reach out and deal with the cactus, reach through it's spines in order to tap it and drink the quenching liquid it offers. And that means I will probably prick my finger and I might bleed.

And once before we met up and once before we held hands and walked into the desert..
The person I met on CompuServe that helped me… kept me from being hidden in my home.. going nutty..
Listened to my angst.. and my terrors and all the things that worried me.. or read them as I typed them up in a fury..
I really like the part that if we do not bury our heads in the sand others will come along and help..

The silent grief..

And so I can see myself hestitating there. "This will hurt but if I don't do this I might likely die".

Hmmmmm....that was my decision after seeing that little clock. And so that little clock was my cactus.

And God put me here to say.. welcome back.. lets get on with it..

Scott Peck was the one that wrote that analogy about the desert and TS Eliot wrote the poetry..

“April is the cruelest month”

Burnt Norton..

And then.. the final part of this life journey that TS Eliot wrote about is in Little Gidding..

We shall not cease from exploration
And the end of all our exploring
Will be to arrive where we started
And know the place for the first time.
Through the unknown, unremembered gate
When the last of earth left to discover
Is that which was the beginning;
At the source of the longest river
The voice of the hidden waterfall
And the children in the apple-tree
Not known, because not looked for
But heard, half-heard, in the stillness
Between two waves of the sea.
Quick now, here, now, always—
A condition of complete simplicity
(Costing not less than everything)
And all shall be well and
All manner of thing shall be well
When the tongues of flame are in-folded
Into the crowned knot of fire
And the fire and the rose are one.


I had an image of the children in the apple tree for a long time before I found my son..
And the fire..

Jackie

[Jackiejdajda]

RavenSong

After a flurry of activity to get my mom into the award-winning skilled-nursing facility (they offer assisted living, too), she has decided she doesn't want to go. I had her records faxed over there first thing this morning. Several hours later, the admissions/marketing director stopped by to talk with her and evaluate the situation. About an hour later, they called me to say that they had accepted my mom, but my mom seemed to be balking at transferring over there today or tomorrow. They asked me if I could find out what was going on...that they can only hold the bed open until tomorrow afternoon.

I hope I don’t pull stunts like that..
I remember my sister and I trying to get dad into a good long term care facility.. and thinking that if he had to room with someone he would be very difficult to deal with..
We got him into a place that was just opening and we got him a room on his own.. and I saw that there was a bus to the place..

Then when I started visiting.. (I had to take the streetcar to the train.. then the train from Union Station in Toronto to Burlington and then a bus to the nursing home.. about three hours one way) I found out the bus was cancelled to the place were dad was..

So I had to get off the other bus and walk for about ten or fifteen minutes.. this in winter as well as good weather.. (they eventually started bus service again)
All this so he could get in a good place..

Three years.. he was in there..

Jackie

[snuffie]

Dear Raven
I have been through a lot of what you are going through and believe me, I know how heartwrenching and frustrating it is.
It is hard to be the "parent" to our own parents but a lot of times it comes to that. My poor amom had Alzheimer's and my dad was physically ill. He couldn't care for her but adamantly refused outside help. At one point both of my parents were hospitalized and I actually had to work with the social workers to have a van (not myself) drive them directly to an assisted living facility so that they could not make me take them home. I told them the doctor said they had to go. Talk about feeling horrible! But I knew in my heart it was the right thing to do.
Sometimes we have to "remove" ourselves as much as possible from the situation and try without emotion to make the best decisions whether they are the "popular" one with our parents or not.

I know how hard it is but a few years later (both of my aparents are gone) I have no regrets when I look back. I know I did the best I could for them.

Prayers heading your way.

Snuffie

[paigeturner]

Ah Raven. I was so sorry to read this this morning. How incredibly frustrating this must be for you; and hearbreaking. Do you have POA? Can you just have them move her?

I really have no advice, but wanted to let you know that I've been sending good thoughts your way. I think of you often throughout the day.

[xxsurroundedbyxy]

Originally Posted by RavenSong

Oh, well, enough of my complaining. Thanks for letting me vent. Maybe I'll call back the nice facility and see if I can have her bed for myself...at least I'd get some rest, could interact with the preschool kids, and take my cat with me. Sounds like a really nice place. (And Kim, I'll see if I can get you the bed right next to me, lol!)

I started laughing out loud when I read that last paragraph because for the first few paragraphs I was shaking my head and thinking, "I seriously wonder if Raven shouldn't just move herself into that place".....and then I thought, "Heck, if it was close, I would steal that open bed right out from under her". Ok, kidding on that last part. I could never do that to my good friend Raven.....but it sounds like the perfect place for someone who HAS their right mind but can't care for themselves.

For the last 2 years my grandmother has been in the nursing home (she suffered a stroke last year too). She INSISTED on being moved into one even with all of us begging her not to do it. We tried to remind her of what my great-grandmother's last days with cancer had been like in one, but she was so determined that her life was over and she couldn't last another day in her senior-living apartment. For seven years prior, she had a home-health aide come in every day offering to make her meals in advance and freeze them, buying her groceries, doing her laundry, helping to bathe her, and cleaning her house. There were some really nice ones, too, but she was hateful to ALL of them and reminded them constantly how they never did the job up to snuff. They never folded her laundry right and never cleaned good enough and bought the wrong ketchup sometimes!!!!! Some would call me crying after one of her "fits".

So we gave up and let her go into the nursing home. Well, guess what? It is not nearly as clean or clean-smelling as her apartment (they try, but with that many infirm people it is nearly impossible), they lose her laundry or accidentally get it mixed up with others and then she won't wear it anymore, she doesn't like most of the food (and they even offer to make her something she would like), she never has any peace and quiet in a room with a woman out of her mind, etc.

And she isn't "dying" the way she was so determined she was years ago when it all started. She will probably out live us all. She has been determined to make the worst out of every situation and you can't really help people like that......and end up feeling good about it anyway.

I say leave her where she is if she is determined not to move again. Because if you work SO hard to get her moved to what you feel is a nice facility and she complains about it daily, you will seriously want to do her in yourself.

Good Luck Raven. You are doing so much more than you ever thought you would have the strength to do. Make a pit stop on the "Taking Care of Mom" train and take care of yourself for a few days and recharge. If she changes her mind later, she will just have to wait for another opening in the facility you found that I now call "Beullah Land" HeeHee.

Kim

[Janeytwo]

Hey All! :-)

Jackie -

I really like the part that if we do not bury our heads in the sand others will come along and help.

I am instantly reminded of Bill and Bob; two wounded saints of broken wing, drowning in a blistering bottle of a desert. Yet found in one another. And the rest of us who came after....I am fortunate.

The person I met on CompuServe that helped me… kept me from being hidden in my home.. going nutty.. Listened to my angst.. and my terrors and all the things that worried me

I wouldn't have had it any other way bud!! Besides, I remember some nights where you hung in there while I lost my mind!!! LOL!! Oh...them was the days!

And the fire and the rose are one

That clock was my grief and in remembering it, it also became my solace. It led me here; one dented metal-rimmed industrial clock of a kind that once sat above my head counting off the minutes into a near life-time of pain. How long it must've waited there; it's hand ticking the years sublimely by, unconcerned with the lives of the humans it served. Except for one woman named Janey whose grief was a cold fire but bloomed in the friendship she found here.


Raven Thinking of you every day and hoping things are getting better for you!

Kim, Paigeturner and Snuffie I've heard more than one person say over the years that it's a pity they don't teach classes in highschool about caring for our parents as they get older. Then again, I guess in highschool we wouldn't have listened anyway! Don't you guys sometimes wish we could've known "then" what we do now? Me too.

Love you guys!

Janey

[Jackiejdajda]

Janeytwo

That clock was my grief and in remembering it, it also became my solace. It led me here; one dented metal-rimmed industrial clock of a kind that once sat above my head counting off the minutes into a near life-time of pain. How long it must've waited there; it's hand ticking the years sublimely by, unconcerned with the lives of the humans it served. Except for one woman named Janey whose grief was a cold fire but bloomed in the friendship she found here.

The memories and what triggers them.. and how we miss sometimes why we are being triggered..
And what is expected of us.. and whether we need to comply..
Do the right thing on terms of someone else..

We get to do it our way.. our very own way..
Yes we have to live with one another but we do not have to lay down in the road and let the bus run over us.. become a people pleaser in order to be loved.. Taking care of parents that are aging.. and knowing they have done terrible things to us and still we must be the one that martyrs ourselves.. I would not expect my kids to do for me if I did wrong in their lives..

Jackie

[RavenSong]

Well, my latest update is rather frustrating. My mom has been refusing to take her blood-pressure medicine the past several days. I cannot for the life of me get her to understand that a BP of 170/90 is NOT normal. I am so frustrated. She keeps saying 170/90 is what's "normal" for her. I've tried explaining that her "normal" BP is actually hypertension. And that it was the untreated hypertension that led to the atrial fibrillation that led to the embolic stroke in her brain. She isn't having any of it....

She tells me that her treatment plan now has the goal of returning her to independent living in her own apartment in two weeks. They're trying to transition her from a walker to a cane. I guess the admissions director from the nice SNF stopped by again and told her that if independent living doesn't work out to give them a call, and they'll try to find her a bed.

She tells me she cannot deal with anything at all right now, that she can't handle it. Well, I guess if she's going to stop taking her meds, she won't have to worry about dealing with anything much longer.... Can you tell that I'm spinning my wheels here??

[paigeturner]

Raven,

I have no words of advice. This has got to be wearing on you and so frustrating. I hope that you are taking time to take care of you. Have other family members been any help at all in trying to get her to take her meds? It sounds almost like she doesn't WANT to get better.

[kakuehl]

Raven,
Have you said that to her? Remember it is her choice and she has to deal with the consequences. Hold the course, my dear. When she talks about not being able to handle more, ask her if she's taking her meds. If she is not, say, I'm sorry I can't help you and change the subject. It sounds harsh, but she needs to be accountable. (You might ask which funeral home she wants you to call!)

Hang in there and take care of Raven! Remember that she has made/is making a choice; that is her prerogative. She then needs to live with the results.

[MamaS]

I have not responded to this, because my parents were not abusive -- they were wonderful. My father died of a sudden heart attack at the age of 84, leaving my mother, age 88. I retired early to take care of her. When my father died my mother was physically weak but alert. She used a cane and was insistent that she be taken to the hairdresser every week and the nail salon once a month. She dressed for breakfast and was always ready to receive visitors and reminisce about the past. After my father died, she stopped living. She was still alive, but she wasn't living. She stopped walking and let herself be pushed in a wheelchair. She "forgot" her medicine and "didn't feel well enough" for hair and nail appointments. Then, she stopped eating. She just stopped. She didn't eat anything, no matter what we tried to tempt her with. She lingered nine days (with hospice care at home) and went to join Dad.
What I am trying to say is maybe your mom knows that hypertension could kill her and doesn't care. Maybe she thinks she is ready to leave. If that is the way she feels, there is not much you can do.

[dpen6]

AH Raven.....This is all so common. Trust me you are not alone!

I suggest you lay it on the line.....in a nice way. Like kathy said. You explain her options to her and tell her that of course she can make her own decsions.....But in order for her to make a decsion she has to know all of the facts. She has to understand the consquences of her decisions.

Don't take meds...this will happen and the decsion of where she will go will be taken out of her hands....because A. She will be dead, and yes if thats what she wants its ok...but the proper servrices need to be put in place for that, or B. She will stroke again and maybe be paralyzed and agin the decsion will be taken out of her hands because you can't live alone paralyzed. Or another stroke will affect her speech and cognitive abilities and agin the decsion will be taken out of her hands. That no, you can not go live with her, thats not an option. Ask her if she see's it any other way. If she is coherant and able to make her own decsions then so be it......its what she wants. If she is not able to, any question about her ability to make sound decsions then you have another whole host of problems in terms of activatiing her health care proxy and to do that you have to prove she is not able to make safe decsions for herself.

Discuss it in an open way, really listen to what she is saying and if in fact she knows and understands the risks she is taking and wants to do it anyway then ther is nothing you can do.

Just make sure she is told the truth, the whole truth, the brutal truth before she makes the decsion not to take her meds, live alone ect.

Also, sometimes when its not a family member telling the whole truth they sometimes listen better because the baggageof family is not brought into it. some SW and medical personal really don't know how to do it...I do it often in my job. sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

[RavenSong]

I thought I would give everyone an update about what's going on with my mom. She was discharged this morning from the Skilled Nursing Facility to her own apartment. I called her this afternoon, and she sounded really happy to be home.

She's getting around pretty good on a walker these days. The right-sided weakness is improving, as is her speech. She still has problems finding the words she wants to use in a sentence, but she's found ways to compensate. The last time I asked her she was only refusing to take three of her medications, out of a total of nine. Time will tell, though, if she continues to take those six meds. I really doubt it, but that will be her choice, and I'm not going to push her about it anymore. She knows what the probable consequences will be of making such a decision.

I'm glad she's back in her home, although I'm a bit worried about her getting lonely. She's interacted with so many people in the past few weeks. But all in all, I think she's glad to be out...

Thank you so much for all your wonderful, loving posts and support. You guys will never realize how much you've helped me in this situation. You're the best!!

[Janeytwo]

Dear Raven,

Just wanted to say that I'm glad your mom is doing better, is home.

And I'm glad that you were able to make it through everything! Whew!! What a ride, huh?!!!

You're one of the good ones, bud!!

Janey