[Katrinad]

I can see that lots of people have been looking at each others' messages, but no-one is willing to say hi. Are we shy or scared?

[wannaBmum]

I'll say Hi....
Hope everyone had a nice weekend, and it was Fathers Day here in New Zealand. Hope all the Dad's had a nice day. Here's hoping by this time next year, we will be able to celebrate Mother's/Father's day.
It’s a tough road emotionally waiting and hoping to become parents.
Take care
Kim

[Lindsie]

I'll say HI too!!!
I'm not looking to adopt just yet, but more so in a few years. I've been lurking around for a while now trying to find out as much about the whole process and some of the problems to look for on the way. Hopefully there will be more of us Aussies (and Kiwis ) around to talk to.

[Katrinad]

Yipee, some people to talk to! I hang about on the US board, but things are SO DIFFERENT over there! I wonder if people are little shy because we are such a small country? My husband is worried about bumping into the birthmother on the street! I think he's taking it a little too far! We have made the final decision to adopt and have just completed the paperwork, we have our first "adoption day" in a couple of weeks. I thought that I too would have a look around this site, find out a few of the pitfalls people come across. I've come to the conclusion that "paralysis by over-anaylsis" is true. I nearly backed out, with some of the things that can happen and the emotions that are involved. There is so much guilt involved in adoption, on BOTH sides. It can be pretty scary. By the way, WHAT A FANTASTIC DAY, yay spring!!

[Lindsie]

Hi again everyone, I just thought I'd say hi again since everyone else seems to be a bit shy. I'm not so sure it is a "yay, spring" day though. The weather this week is going crazy so I'm a bit over spring. We had 33 degrees the day before yesterday and then today a max of 15. I suppose it could be worse as Sydney is supposed to have been an awful 40 degrees during the week.

Are you hoping to do a local infant adoption or are you trying to an overseas one? Would you prefer a boy or girl? Do you get to list a preference in Australia?
I would love to do an older child adoption but it seems that we don't do that in Australia.

[Katrinad]

Hi Lindsie, we don't do older adoption here either. And what a flaming rigmarole to go through to even get into the pool. We have had a huge hiccup yesterday, which I have spent most of the night and this morning mulling over. I was up at 6.15am writing a letter to the MP of Social Welfare. Pretty grumpy!!
Here in the South it is starting to rain, so had better go get my washing in.
Kat

[Lindsie]

A big Homer Simpson DOH! to the hiccup. Hopefully it is all sorted out for you by the time you read this post. I'm sure that if I were up at 6:15 any letter that I wrote would be a very grumpy one. It is very hard to be tolerant at that time of the day.
So do you have the same system in NZ to adopt that they have in Australia? I don't know that much about ours, only that you jump through a bunch of hoops, go to some meeting and then all go in a pool and sit there for as long as it takes, if ever, for some bureaucrat to choose your profile.
hope your day gets better

[Katrinad]

Here's an overview of NZ adoption:

Introduction session (evening)
Application Forms including police reports, medical reports, and two referees (fairly standard I think)
(Apparently there is supposed to be a sw interview in here as well, we didn't have one)

Then come the two Ed and Prep day courses, which are held 1 month apart, and only TWICE A YEAR. You're stuffed if you aren't able to attend one of the days at the time it is on. And it is policy that applicants attend both days.

Day 1:
Involving Shared Fate/Parental Roles/Comparison of Closed and Open Adoption/GRIEF AND LOSS

SW interview (which we had by PHONE because there were so many people at the first day.)

Day 2:
Involving Early attachment/Nature vs Nurture/MORE GRIEF AND LOSS/Trust/Profiles/Placement

Consider background to Profile doc (I have no idea what this means yet)
SW interview
Complete the profile
Enter the pool

And our system, and Australia's are apprently held up as examples of how a good adoption system should be.

And what they DON'T tell you, is that if you don't BOTH go to day 1 and day 2, you can't progress your application forward until you have. You can't have your interviews, you can't do your profile. This was the stuff up on Friday for us. We now have to wait until December and travel 400km there and back. FUMING. I am going to jump on the bandwagon today about it all.
Kat

[loubielou]

Hi Kat
Thought I'd put in my 2c worth about the NZ system, since we've just been through it...IT IS VERY SLOW. We started the process in March - got mucked up similarly to you in that a sw put us unto a DAY 1 (we took time off work etc..) then she said it was full and we had to wait 2mths and travel an hour and a half to attend another one. We finally heard we were approved about 3 weeks ago, busted a gut to get our profile in and approved - made some final alterations to it (from the sw suggestions) and two weeks later are still waiting for the official letter to let us know we are in the pool. It certainly tests your patience. Good luck with the process and let me know if you have any questions about it.
Louise

[wlbooklady]

Hi!
I hope you don't mind me butting in -- I'm from the U.S. -- but I was reading another thread last night on Adoption Reform and someone posted an article by an Aussie SW saying what's good about adoption in Australia and wrong with adoption in the U.S. -- and apparently, it's everything. The article went point by point and listed how the Aussie systems worked and why it was better than the U.S. As an adoptive mother myself, I'd be the first to admit our system has flaws, but what really offended me about this article -- and I sincerely hope the author is a loose cannon and doesn't represent general Australian policy -- is that it was virulently anti-adoption. For example, it said that in Australia payments are made to single parents to enable them to care for their children (and we do that, too here in the U.S., through welfare, although the article made it sound like U.S. adoption was all about taking children from the poor and providing them to the rich), that the first priority is to preserve families of origin. It gave an example of an area of Austalia with a million people which had only had one adoption in the past year. Also, it said that older child adoption was too traumatic to children who had already been traumatized. So it's better fo them to have no family ties, at all ?! Basically, the whole article implied adoption was a bad way to create families, rarely done in Australia. I was offended and angry, but it did make me think. It especially disturbs me, if, as someone earlier said, the AUstralian system is held up as a model of "good" adoptions. Do you mind if I ask a few questions? 1) If adoption is so rare, what about families where there's abuse? I know government agencies in the U.S. have been criticized when a child dies and there's been a long pattern of abuse but they've tried to keep the children with their families of origin. 2) What if a parent just doesn't feel ready or able to parent a child? It's not just about money, but lots of other things, like readiness, maturity, etc. Can people NOT put a child up for adoption? 3) Are international adoptions supported? Are they funded through the state? The article said that all costs for domestic adoptions were covered by the state; but if there are so few, it would seem to me that couples wanting to adopt would have to go overseas. Thank you so much for filling me in -- I'm trying to get past my initial knee-jerk reaction to reading this article.

[Lindsie]

Hi Louise,
you are right, our system sucks if you want to adopt. I'm not saying that people should be forced to give up their children if they are not able to care for them, however I do not agree with the Department of Community Services giving parents as many chances as they want to destroy a child's life. The way it seems to work here is that the child gets fostered indefinately until the parent either decides to get their act together or stays in the system until they are 16 and age out. If there is abuse, the children are taken by DOCS and fostered. The parents can attend parenting classes and anger management classes and get their kids back. Basically, if you want to adopt, you have to go overseas. We do not have older child domestic adoption unless there are particularly extenuating circumstances.
Our welfare system is fantastic compared to a number of other countries. I am a lawyer and have clients who make more on welfare (and have a couple of kids with no dads) than I do (I am quite junior and do legal aid). They also are entitled to almost free travel($2.20 per trip), free medication ($3.00 per prescription) free medical treatment, free education, very cheap all day care for the children plus a parenting allowance. Parents earn more when they have more children, plus our government in a desperate bid for votes in our recent election have brought in a payment of $3000 for the birth of each child. It goes up to $5000 in another 2 years. Why would you give your child up for adoption when you are going to be paid to raise it yourself. Forgive me if i've been ranting about it. It is a touchy subject with me and it is early monday morning (which never helps)

[Katrinad]

Hi there, from an NZ point of view, we're almost exactly like Australia. And it makes me sick. We have now decided to put adoption on hold, as dh is so angry with the dictatorial system we have here. He had a long talk with our sw this morning, who, thankfully is a great lady, and very open to differing points of view. We have decided to foster, see how we go with that for a while. The foster system is also a laugh (sarcastic). You can only adopt newborns here, as the birth families seem to get chance after chance, and pull the wool over CYFS eyes frequently, hence you get kids abused and murdered by their loving families. Yes, I'm having a rant too!
Better go before I get too mad.
Katrina

[Lindsie]

wow! foster care! that is going to be tough! I would love to try it but with our system I don't think that I could do it, it is just too unstable for the child. Is NZ the same as Australia? It seems like it is if the parents get heaps of chances. It just makes me sick becasue it is so unfair to the kids. every time they settle in and get on their feet emotionally, DOCS or their parents change their mind about how much contact their is, or throw in another re-unification plan and the kid gets the rug pulled from under them again.
We have a client who has a 12year old who is in the system. he's had 16 long term placements break down since he was 5 and only in the last month has DOCS told the mother to make up her mind if she wants him or not. She has decided not, but he is not available for adoption. He is just in care until he is 16 then he will be without a family as his fosters probably won't keep him and his birth family is not interested. it makes me sick to see how the mother has had 7 years to come to this decision and now the kid is virtually a right-off.
All the very best luck with your venture into foster care... i hope it works out really well for you katrina

[Katrinad]

Ohhhhh, yes!! Much as we Aussies and Kiwis like to knock the lights out of each other, so much is similar with our govt policy. It is sick making that a child can be so mucked around for so long, then when they really start to stuff up as an adult, the finger pointing starts. We've come up with a bit of a philosophy (dh and I) about fostering. That's if we even get through, he is so mad at CYFS and I wouldn't put it past the adoption unit to let the foster unit know it! We have decided that we will care for babies under 12-18mths, for whatever periods of time, when they come to us we will love them, when they leave us we will enjoy having our home and our family back to ourselves. Sounds a bit selfish, but we're trying to make a difference and protect ourselves at the same time. You never know, we may get a "keeper" or two!! Do I sound REALLY callous? Surely somewhere, on some level, those tiny babes will have a memory imprint of the people who loved them for a little while...
Katrina

[jandsrowbotham]

Hi

I live in Australia with my husband and have an adopted son from Thailand. We are also in the process of adopting our second, again from Thailand - our file in is Thailand awaiting allocation, but it will be quite some time yet. The first time the process seemed onerous and quite daunting ,but now that I have my son I understand that the process is there for a reason - to protect children and also the applicants as adopting a child from another country has a huge impact on your lives. The second time around I found the process quite simple and not at all daunting - I think I was more confident and also knew what to expect. That is not to say that the process is good as I think more could be done to make the process smoother and quicker.

What I do find frustrating about adopting internationally in Australia is that states often handle things differently eg for Thai adoptions residents in South Australia can use an adoption agency which will have links with various orphanages like Red Cross, whereas in Qld you must go through the Dept of Communities and then the Dept of Social Development & Welfare in Thailand.

In one of the posting someone mentioned that adoption of older children is not permitted in Australia - I don't know about local adoptions but for overseas adoptions the Dept of Communities prefers not to put forward applications for children over 5 y.o. however, this can & has been challegned successfully.

I'd be interested to hear from anyone who knows about Thai adoptions in South Australia as the support group I belong to is trying to get more information together on this topic.

Julie