[teendoc]

Hi Everyone,

I'm just curious. I am a black mother of a biracial little girl. I belong to a support group for those who have adopted black or biracial child. The interesting thing I have found is that many of the black couples who have adopted expressed a discomfort with open adoption. Most wanted closed adoptions.

I know that when I started the process toward adoption, I was a little worried about "sharing" the child with his/her firstmother. Yet when I learned how beneficial this relationship would be for the child, I relented. Still there were concerns about whether I would be seen as the baby's real mother.

Luckily as we developed a relationship with Zara's firstmother before Zara's birth, all my fears evaporated. I became able to fully understand the beauty of open adoption.

Yet among some of the members of our support group, there is still a lot of anxiety and discomfort about the concept of open adoption. I asked two of the women whether they could express what they feared would happen in an open relationship, but they were not able to describe what made them feel this discomfort.

This made me wonder whether there was perhaps a cultural basis for this discomfort among our people. What do you guys think?

[BrandyHagz]

I think the same 'fear' coming that black aparents have of OA is the same fear that many black first mothers have - thus resulting in more closed adoptions when the first mother is black.

I do think its cultural...which is odd, since so many black families I know are very family focused. Maybe I'll pose a question to them.

ETA: I used "black" as you are obviously comfortable with that (as are my friends) - I hope no one is offended.

[teendoc]

I wish I had a better sense of where the fear is coming from in black aparents. Could it be shame about adoption or fear of disruption or even a usurping of the parental role. I'm not sure.

But it is interesting to hear that there are differences in black firstparents as well. I am fascinated by this. If you do pose this question, please let me know what you find out among firstparents.

[makarios79]

Originally Posted by teendoc

Hi Everyone,

I'm just curious. I am a black mother of a biracial little girl. I belong to a support group for those who have adopted black or biracial child. The interesting thing I have found is that many of the black couples who have adopted expressed a discomfort with open adoption. Most wanted closed adoptions.

I know that when I started the process toward adoption, I was a little worried about "sharing" the child with his/her firstmother. Yet when I learned how beneficial this relationship would be for the child, I relented. Still there were concerns about whether I would be seen as the baby's real mother.

Luckily as we developed a relationship with Zara's firstmother before Zara's birth, all my fears evaporated. I became able to fully understand the beauty of open adoption.

Yet among some of the members of our support group, there is still a lot of anxiety and discomfort about the concept of open adoption. I asked two of the women whether they could express what they feared would happen in an open relationship, but they were not able to describe what made them feel this discomfort.

This made me wonder whether there was perhaps a cultural basis for this discomfort among our people. What do you guys think?

I am an AA mother about to adopt 2 biracial boys.....To be honest, I wasn't all that comfortable with the idea of open adoption, I don't think it was so much that I had to share the child or that I wouldn't feel like the "real mother." It is moreso that I am not really what you would call a "people person." I am one of those people who you would never know is in a room..Unless it's a room full of kids....

I get a long great with kids!!! But adult strangers..that's a whole different story...It's probably why I haven't had a "boyfriend" in over 11 years....I find it hard to let people inside my inner circle....But I am learning because my boys first mother recently relinquished her rights...and asked that I let her stay in contact with the boys....Most people advised against it both black and white..mainly because I am adopting from foster care....

At this point , I am not exactly sure "how much openness" I will allow...I told their first mom I would allow visits in the future, but not sure exactly what time in the future that will happen..However I told her that she can call them every friday and will continue to allow her to do that as long as things remain "pleasant." I also plan to give her pics every couple months....

I plan to meet mom face to face (without the boys) the beginning of next month....I told her I would like to meet her..so we can kind of get on the same page and tell her what I am and am not comfortable with and to see what her expectations of visitiation/contact are...So we can both have a clear understanding and there will be less room for hurt feelings...

In my case mom DID NOT abuse the kids....It's a long story as to why they were taken..but mom did not hurt the kids....She loves them very much..she just can't seem to get her life together long enough to get them back.....and we were headed for TPR anyway..already had the trial date set...but she decided not to fight it.....Dad relinquished on June 20, five days after mom...

I'm not sure if dad has ever seen the youngest...but my understanding is he doesn't really have much of a relationship with either of them and he is in prison right now and I WON'T be taking my babies to any prison to visit him.......

My oldest use to live with grandparents .... not sure how much if any contact at all I will be allowing them....

[joskids]

OK, I posed this question to my husband, who is black. I'm white, we have 4 adopted children, AA and biracial. He pretty much agreed with you, that he's not at all surprised that you have come to the conclusion that blacks seem to be less comfortable with open adoption and here's his take. He says that blacks tend to be more cynical "because of what they have experienced in life". In regards to the two of us, I'm definitely more trusting (call me naive??) and he's much more cautious about people, although he is always gracious, charming and respectful to everyone (until they prove they don't deserve that kind of respect). We are struggling, at this point, with an open adoption of our youngest. Even though we both hoped to be able to build a trusting relationship with her birthparents, it has been, and still is, a sad struggle.

[teendoc]

Makarios: thanks for sharing your thoughts on this issue.

Josie: Thanks for getting your husband's take. So, he's saying that it is more of a "something will go wrong" type of cynicism that leads to issues with open adoption. Maybe it has something to do with trust and not having a willingness to trust as much as do majority people?

Interesting thoughts. Thanks for contributing!

[Pandagirl40]

I am an AA mother starting to look into adoption and I do not want an open adoption. I am a little more harsh than others on this board...so I will ask for forgiviness now. I feel that once I have the child I will be needing time to bond and get to know the child. why confuse with another parent in the picture. who by most accounts maybe judging me on my parenting skills. and to be really blunt..if you(meaning the birth parent..not the orginial author) wanted to be a parent you would have kept the child. you made a choice to give the child up(or the courts did) so you need to move aside and let the new parents form their relationship and if and when the child wishes to meet you he/she can. I think most AA families are judged enough every day by society, what we wear, how we talk, what our hairstyle is ..always trying to prove ourself to a society who does not all the time approve of us ...an open adoption just adds another layer of judgement.

[teendoc]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Pandagirl,

I think you've given me a lot of insight here. Sounds like you see open adoption as the child's having two mothers who are both parenting. That is not the way the majority of open adoptions seem to go, however. For example in our situation, I am parenting and Zara's firstmom is not. She's not judging me on what I do because a) that is not her style and b) she's not around to see me parent. As such there is no confusion or interference.

So I think the concerns blacks have over open adoption has to do with what they perceive open adoption to mean. And if it is seen as "co-parenting" then it will not be palatable at all.

Originally Posted by Pandagirl40

I am an AA mother starting to look into adoption and I do not want an open adoption. I am a little more harsh than others on this board...so I will ask for forgiviness now. I feel that once I have the child I will be needing time to bond and get to know the child. why confuse with another parent in the picture. who by most accounts maybe judging me on my parenting skills. and to be really blunt..if you(meaning the birth parent..not the orginial author) wanted to be a parent you would have kept the child. you made a choice to give the child up(or the courts did) so you need to move aside and let the new parents form their relationship and if and when the child wishes to meet you he/she can. I think most AA families are judged enough every day by society, what we wear, how we talk, what our hairstyle is ..always trying to prove ourself to a society who does not all the time approve of us ...an open adoption just adds another layer of judgement.

[makarios79]

I am an AA mother starting to look into adoption and I do not want an open adoption. I am a little more harsh than others on this board...so I will ask for forgiviness now.

No need to ask for forgiveness, I don't think you are being harsh.

I feel that once I have the child I will be needing time to bond and get to know the child. why confuse with another parent in the picture. who by most accounts maybe judging me on my parenting skills.

I completely understand how you feel, which is one of the reasons why I am not yet allowing visits.. The boys have only been living with me for almost 3 months... We are still a very new family.....and we absolutely still need time to bond

My youngest (15 months) wouldn't know his mom from the man in the moon, so I'm not really worried about his and my bond being affected....my oldest ( 2 years, 8 months) has been in more contact with her than any of his other 4 siblings, so he will be more familiar with her, but he doesn't really "know" her either. He is the main reason why I am postponing visits...

He has a pretty good memory of his grandparents whom he has lived with most of his life and this is still a very sad issue for him because he misses them greatly!!!! I am a little hesitant to let him see anyone from his first family until he can better understand that he can no longer live with them...., not so much because I am threatened by them (cause I could care less what they think) but because my son has a MAJOR MELTDOWN when his GAL or anyone who he is familiar with from his past visits him....The last time his GAL left he cried all night until he fell asleep because he didn't want her to leave....This was really hard for him and me, especially because there is nothing I can do about them not being there.

But when I do allow visits, mom will in no way be "parenting my kids"....Honestly her opinion on my parenting skills really doesn't matter to me because at the end of the day they are going home with me not her....and since she lost her kids to the system and ulitmately ended up signing away her rights, she REALLY has no room to be judging anyone's parenting skills.

The phone calls from their mom have been going great so far, but they are really more for her sake than my sons because my sons, being so young, don't really know who they are talking to when they are on the phone...it helps to ease her pain. I know most adoptive parents don't really care about the lost the first parents are feeling, but I try to put myself in their shoes...this is why I allow the calls and will eventually allow the visits. I will continue to do so as long as things remain "pleasant" and as long as she causes no harm to my children (physical, emotional or verbal etc..)

and to be really blunt..if you(meaning the birth parent..not the orginial author) wanted to be a parent you would have kept the child. you made a choice to give the child up(or the courts did) so you need to move aside and let the new parents form their relationship and if and when the child wishes to meet you he/she can

Well in open adoption, first parents are not "parenting" the child....They just remain in contact with the adoptive family through some form....It may just be through letters and pictures....or they may visit often or anywhere in the "in between spectrum"..

In a lot of cases it is good for the kids..so they won't fantasize about their birth families because they can see first hand the lives their birth families live and why it might have been necessary at the time to place the child for adoption or to be taken by the state.

[Yash]

I don't know if I think it's a black thing. I definitely think it's a conservative thing. The majority of my family and friends, even the ones that are adoptees themselves, advised me not to be a part of an open adoption. I am not in favor of it. I empathize/sympathize with the heartache bio parents feel, but this doesn't mean I have to let them be part of my life, in the form of me sending pictures or update letters.

If you chose not to parent, then to me that is where the contact ends. Sending pictures or yearly or biyearly visits aren't done for the sake of the child, but for the sake of the birth parents. A child can still fantasize about someone they only see once a year, at a park while playing. I believe open adoption is like having your cake and eating it too. Birth parents can pop in, be the fun guy, then duck out.

And in my case, I've adopted through DCF, I will not allow my children to be in contact with someone who endangered their lives, birth parent or not. Emotional, physical neglect, drug abuse, sexual abuse, the majority of reasons why the kids are in the system in the first place means the birth parent valued their lives and their "needs" over their child's and hurt their child in ways I can never understand or imagine so to protect my child, I would say no to any visits or even pictures.

Being pro-closed adoptions is looked on so unfavorably now-a-days and my heart goes out to the parents that say they are comfortable with open adoption because they fear they might not be able to adopt otherwise. Is this the kind of adoption world we want?

I remember reading an article years ago in an adoption magazine about families who said they would send pictures and updates, yet the stuff they sent clearly said they weren't comfortable with it. One picture was of a kid in a tree house taken from down below, all you could see was a brown-haired kid in shorts and a t-shirt. You couldn't even tell what sex the child was or what the kid looked like. This was a picture a family sent the birth parents. Fear made them lie and put everyone in a very awkward and uncomfortable position.

[makarios79]

I don't know if I think it's a black thing. I definitely think it's a conservative thing.

I don't necessarily think it is a conservative thing either, I am pretty conservative and I am finding myself in the midst of an open adoption....not one that I expected to be in or sought out, but I'm in one, none the less

Like I stated on the other Open Adoption post....I NEVER thought I would be in one...but now that I am...I don't necessarily see it as bad as I thought it would be..I may change my mind about that in the future, especially since we have yet to have visits,..who knows, only time will tell...

Being pro-closed adoptions is looked on so unfavorably now-a-days and my heart goes out to the parents that say they are comfortable with open adoption because they fear they might not be able to adopt otherwise. Is this the kind of adoption world we want?

I don't look at being pro closed adoption necessarily unfavorably if that is what is right for that particular family and if every party isn't comfortable with it..it probably isn't right .... like I said before I NEVER thought I would be in an open adoption.....I think everyone should do what is right for their family....and I have to agree with you, in most cases in foster care adoption it is 99.9% of the time a very bad idea

In my case, I am in no way whatsoever obligated to have any contact with my sons parents....I choose to....and should I ever feel uncomfortable at any point...I will choose not to....simple as that

I'm not trying to sway people one way or another on this issue...I am just saying what's right for one family, may not be right for another.....

So Yash , how is the Vietnam adoption going? Any new news on Sasha?

[Yash]

But even on these forums, don't you feel that there is a definite pro-open adoption stance? I remember some other thread recently where someone was saying there are families that are in closed adoptions or want closed adoptions but they keep quiet about it because these forums seem to be pro-open.

If Sasha's CW would stop trying to tract down every known relative in the free living world, my life would be better. My SW is so kind and diplomatic. She tells me the DCF foster workers don't go to the same training adoption workers go to so the CW might not truly understand the effects of moving Sasha, even if it is to a relative, would have on her. Uh, sure. Like I said diplomatic. Praise God Sasha's lawyer and I are on the same page. We are praying we TPR on Aug 14th. And at that court hearing, her lawyer will ask if I can become her de facto parent since Sasha has been home more than 6 months now. So in a nice world, we could be finalized before her first birthday. That would be a nice Christmas/birthday/gotcha day gift for this Dec family.

As for Layla, she officially has a name and I'm in week 11 of my wait. Look only 25 more to go though the wait from referral to travel is increasing. It's now up to 5 1/2 months.

Thanks for asking. ANy word on the little girl?

[makarios79]

Originally Posted by Yash

But even on these forums, don't you feel that there is a definite pro-open adoption stance? I remember some other thread recently where someone was saying there are families that are in closed adoptions or want closed adoptions but they keep quiet about it because these forums seem to be pro-open.

If Sasha's CW would stop trying to tract down every known relative in the free living world, my life would be better. My SW is so kind and diplomatic. She tells me the DCF foster workers don't go to the same training adoption workers go to so the CW might not truly understand the effects of moving Sasha, even if it is to a relative, would have on her. Uh, sure. Like I said diplomatic. Praise God Sasha's lawyer and I are on the same page. We are praying we TPR on Aug 14th. And at that court hearing, her lawyer will ask if I can become her de facto parent since Sasha has been home more than 6 months now. So in a nice world, we could be finalized before her first birthday. That would be a nice Christmas/birthday/gotcha day gift for this Dec family.

As for Layla, she officially has a name and I'm in week 11 of my wait. Look only 25 more to go though the wait from referral to travel is increasing. It's now up to 5 1/2 months.

Thanks for asking. ANy word on the little girl?

Nope still no word...they are doing a new psychological and behavioral assessment on her. The other one that they had was 2 years old.....

I told them that I needed a more current prospective of her needs before I would agree to even go forth with the matching because I have more than just myself to be concerned with...I will have much smaller kids in the home.....and from what i was told I was the only one being considered.....(so why the need to have a matching..I don't know)

So that is where we stand....I'm waiting for a new assessment to be done....

As far as the pro-open and pro closed question you asked....I do see more people who are pro-open speaking out that those who are pro-closed

[teendoc]

Yash,

Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

Originally Posted by Yash

I don't know if I think it's a black thing. I definitely think it's a conservative thing. The majority of my family and friends, even the ones that are adoptees themselves, advised me not to be a part of an open adoption. I am not in favor of it. I empathize/sympathize with the heartache bio parents feel, but this doesn't mean I have to let them be part of my life, in the form of me sending pictures or update letters.

Wow, this is a pretty powerful sentiment. I look at how hard it was for our birth/first mother to make an adoption plan, plan an entrustment ceremony and entrust this baby to me and my husband and I have nothing but respect for her. I feel blessed by her foresight and consideration for her child. I couldn't imagine cutting her out of her child's life because I know that she loves her, but just wasn't equipped right now to raise her. She did nothing wrong and made all the right plans for the tough situation she found herself in. It would seem to be almost punitive to cut her out knowing how the baby is doing.

Originally Posted by Yash

If you chose not to parent, then to me that is where the cont